Matthew Tkachuk & Johnny Gaudreau Signing Watch Thread

[Johnny Makarov]

Here is how we sign Johnny for under $10mil.

1. You put a lifetime ban on Eric Francis at the Dome.
2. You put a lifetime ban on Eric Francis at press conferences out of town.
3. You promise him that you will not buy out Monahan
4. You give his wife the role of Verna Yiu as the CEO of AHS.
5. You keep shoveling his driveway.
6. You give his mom and dad a penthouse suite in whatever condo building they build next to the new arena.
7. You make sure he never has a Calgarypuck account so he doesn't read Timbit's hate posts about him.
8. You put Eric Francis in a hockey bag and dump him in the Elbow River.

8 X 9.0 mil!

[CalgaryFan1988]

Just get a fuel company to sponsor the Flames so that every Flame player gets a free gas card. No? Free skittles?

[Mitch]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

You don't overreact to a bad playoff series let alone a single bad play. You can go through every goal scored in the Stanley Cup playoffs and find several elite players that made poor plays defensively leading to goals against. There's no such thing as a player that's perfect every shift.

Exactly.

If the Capitals took this stance with Ovechkin, who was notorious for his 'controller disconnections' a couple years ago, they wouldn't have a cup.

[Johnny Makarov]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

Just get a fuel company to sponsor the Flames so that every Flame player gets a free gas card. No? Free skittles?

I will personally drive his vehicles to the Tsuu Tina Costco and fill it up.

$1.61.9 today!

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

Here is how we sign Johnny for under $10mil.

1. You put a lifetime ban on Eric Francis at the Dome.
2. You put a lifetime ban on Eric Francis at press conferences out of town.
3. You promise him that you will not buy out Monahan
4. You give his wife the role of Verna Yiu as the CEO of AHS.
5. You keep shoveling his driveway.
6. You give his mom and dad a penthouse suite in whatever condo building they build next to the new arena.
7. You make sure he never has a Calgarypuck account so he doesn't read Timbit's hate posts about him.
8. You put Eric Francis in a hockey bag and dump him in the Elbow River.

8 X 9.0 mil!

Nice that you do all that but you come up short on the $

10M minimum to get his signature

[chedder]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

The 4 losses to the Oilers will likely not affect Johnny's contract number. His value is based on a career spanning many years and will not be defined by 4 losses where he actually played quite well.

His whole playoff resume will factor into his number. While improved this year it should still keep him from getting super crazy money. Which for Flames fans, and our cap situation, is a good thing.

[GullFoss]

Tkachuk and Johnny both took discounts on their last contract. I don't think those discounts are for the owners because the team is committed to spend to the cap. So regardless of how much Johnny or Tkachuk get paid, the owners are spending the same amount on team payroll. And the discount isn't for the fans because the players want to win more than the fans do.

So what is the discount for??? The discount is to give themselves a better chance to win a cup because it allows for more talent to be squeezed within the cap.

My bet is that if they took discounts before, they'll take discounts again.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

Tkachuk and Johnny both took discounts on their last contract. I don't think those discounts are for the owners because the team is committed to spend to the cap. So regardless of how much Johnny or Tkachuk get paid, the owners are spending the same amount on team payroll. And the discount isn't for the fans because the players want to win more than the fans do.

So what is the discount for??? The discount is to give themselves a better chance to win a cup because it allows for more talent to be squeezed within the cap.

My bet is that if they took discounts before, they'll take discounts again.

The “discount” was because that was the max offered and they were RFAs without a lot of leverage. And they both took shorter terms as a result (with Tkachuk getting a huge QO guarantee).

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

Tkachuk and Johnny both took discounts on their last contract. I don't think those discounts are for the owners because the team is committed to spend to the cap. So regardless of how much Johnny or Tkachuk get paid, the owners are spending the same amount on team payroll. And the discount isn't for the fans because the players want to win more than the fans do.

So what is the discount for??? The discount is to give themselves a better chance to win a cup because it allows for more talent to be squeezed within the cap.

My bet is that if they took discounts before, they'll take discounts again.

Neither took discounts, particularly Tkachuk, who took a contract with likely max dollars which allowed him to get to UFA (and the resulting leverage) as soon as possible).

Johnny's number was kept lower due to only being a 6 year contract which allowed him to reach UFA quicker to give him maximum leverage.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by chedder

His whole playoff resume will factor into his number. While improved this year it should still keep him from getting super crazy money. Which for Flames fans, and our cap situation, is a good thing.

Johnny had a good playoff. At least good enough to not affect his expected payout.

[GullFoss]

From 2019: "As was reported by Sportsnet’s Elliotte Friedman, among others, it was confirmed by both Treliving and Tkachuk that the sides had discussed a long-term deal. Treliving joked that they spent “hours, weeks, and months” on such discussions. But the balancing act of the deal was that neither side wanted a long-term deal to result in moving a piece to weaken the team during its competitive window."

[GullFoss]

From 2019 “That’s it, absolutely,” said a very relieved Tkachuk on Wednesday afternoon, following a press conference at Scotiabank Saddledome. “We could have done a longer term, for however many years we wanted. But this was the deal that was going to keep the number within the cap space. To me, we have such a great group here. I want to win with this group."

[FanIn80]

Yeah, Chucky's a keeper.

...I mean, not an actual keeper though. Like, don't put him in net or anything crazy like that.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

I am all for signing Johnny at all cost
The other option is the complete rebuild

I don’t really care what the advance stats is saying. My eyes said he didn’t play well, at least not of what you would expect from a top player. He did play better than before so hopefully he can build on that.

That's my favourite internet argument!

Don't care what any objective data sources say, my eyes are the true test for what's actually happening.

When I first launched CP the number of hours I'd spend arguing with people in a world where you couldn't dig in and get actual data.

So no sorry ... they created a lot in that series. Tkachuk was 1st in the NHL in xGF60 in the series, Lindholm 3rd, Gaudreau 8th. Even if you don't love the data 100%, it's certainly directional given how it's counted.

They didn't produce to that level, and they gave up too much but they were certainly creating opportunities.

That line was able to our score their expectations in the regular season, they couldn't in the playoffs.

[The Yen Man]

Originally Posted by Bingo

That's my favourite internet argument!

Don't care what any objective data sources say, my eyes are the true test for what's actually happening.

When I first launched CP the number of hours I'd spend arguing with people in a world where you couldn't dig in and get actual data.

So no sorry ... they created a lot in that series. Tkachuk was 1st in the NHL in xGF60 in the series, Lindholm 3rd, Gaudreau 8th. Even if you don't love the data 100%, it's certainly directional given how it's counted.

They didn't produce to that level, and they gave up too much but they were certainly creating opportunities.

That line was able to our score their expectations in the regular season, they couldn't in the playoffs.

I agree. In that series, scoring wasn't the problem. It's keeping goals out of their own net. They scored 20 goals in 5 games. That's an average of 4 goals a game. That should get you more than 1 win in 5 in the playoffs.

[Ashasx]

Ultimately the problem with the Gaudreau line in the series was McDavid. The line did not perform well defensively against them.

At the same time, McDavid is on a generational (or beyond) tear right now and it's kind of hard to fault them. Nobody can stop him right now.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

He didn’t play well against the Oilers.

But yeah that will have little impact on his ask. Treliving may try to use that excuse though.

over PPG...good luck with that excuse

there are also 10M players in this league that have never played a playoff game

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

He didn’t play well against the Oilers.

But yeah that will have little impact on his ask. Treliving may try to use that excuse though.

Right, might not have any impact at all because a player’s contract should theoretically be based on supply and demand.

We as fans can spend an eternity here nit picking bad plays here and there and convince ourselves that a discount should follow suit, but if another team wants to to overlook deficiencies and overpay him for whatever their reasons are, then the Flames may not have a choice but to up the ante.

That’s the beauty of the open market, you don’t really have to care what your previous GMs say about you because all it takes is one GM who really likes you to change everything.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

From 2019: "As was reported by Sportsnet’s Elliotte Friedman, among others, it was confirmed by both Treliving and Tkachuk that the sides had discussed a long-term deal. Treliving joked that they spent “hours, weeks, and months” on such discussions. But the balancing act of the deal was that neither side wanted a long-term deal to result in moving a piece to weaken the team during its competitive window."

Yeah I thought this was the case. Treliving and his team made a big bet on the 2022 window. I know for me, as I’ve stated before (much to the chagrin of many), I was a big advocate of signing Tkachuk and especially Mangiapane to longer term deals.

Yeah it would’ve affected the team’s window, but getting good deals on your stars or players before they pop is just as, if not more important to ultimately extend your window as you never really know when your window ends.

I dunno, guess it depends on your own personal cap philosophy. But in the end, I don’t think Treliving’s big bet on 2022 worked quite as well as he would have hoped as the team only had 1 playoff series win from 2016 to 2022. Now the team is effectively going into their second window with much less cap flexibility due to all these big career years coinciding with contract years.

[looooob]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

Here is how we sign Johnny for under $10mil.


4. You give his wife the role of Verna Yiu as the CEO of AHS.
!

that strikes me as a miserable job- you may have to up his pay to make her do that one