Eastern Bias exists - No Gaudreau for Hart

[topfiverecords]

People that vote on this stuff be dumb.

Mcd top 3? Lol

[looooob]

Originally Posted by OutOfTheCube

I know everyone here is salty but really, has the Art Ross winner ever not been nominated for the Hart? I know they don’t win every time but it’s pretty much a shoe in nomination.

I believe Jamie Benn finished 12th the year he won the Art Ross (although interestingly was a finalist the next year)


I mean it is Jamie Benn so LOL and all that but it does happen

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Are you a secret Oiler fan?! You really think Gaudreau is more important to the Flames than McDavid is to the Oilers?

That only works if you believe that Tkachuk and Lindholm are fourth line bums that Gaudreau elevated to first line players à la Thornton or Crosby. Otherwise, as any true Flames fan would proudly proclaim, the Oilers are absolutely terrible without McDavid.

Remove Gaudreau from the Flames, yeah they probably don't make the playoffs but this year they're probably still fighting down to the wire against Vegas and the Kings. Remove McDavid from the Oilers, they're probably also still fighting down to the wire for a playoff spot....against the Gulls and Roadrunners.

I’m feeling like you’re the secret Oiler fan.

[burn_this_city]

Wait for Lindholm to lose to reputation for the Selke.

[looooob]

in 91-92 Mario freaking Lemieux won the Ross and finished 5th in Hart voting, as another example. I agree there likely aren't many


it happened to Gretzky too in 1990. Ross and 4th in Hart (and a distant 4th)

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

No Huberberdeau (sp?) either.

one would think that matthews and shes have the inside track given thier markets.

seems to me that it was a tough year to narrow the list down to 3

I think Huberdeau, much like Makar, has the "disadvantage" of being on such a stacked team that already had established players "ahead of them" (Mackinnon, Barkov). Makar has a further disadvantage of being a defenseman in a trophy where the player with the most point wins more often than not.

If a person is voting for Hart Trophy based on the MVP to their team criteria, I don't think you could fault an informed voter if they thought Huberdeau/Makar were behind Barkov/Mackinnon (both of whom finished with 88 points after missing roughly 15 games) depending on how they judge the player against the season. Especially as Barkov is only a year removed from his Selke while crushing it offensively when he was playing. So how does one make an MVP top 3 in the league when they might not be MVP of their team?

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Wait for Lindholm to lose to reputation for the Selke.

At least with Norris (uninformed voters voting based on most points by defenseman) and Hart (uninformed voters based on most points), the Selke doesn't have any easy voting criteria for an uninformed writer. It's certainly a reputation award that is probably delayed by two years when giving it to a new player. And is probably the most media biased trophy.

So yeah, I think Lindholm could definitely be "robbed" here.

[looooob]

ok now I'm sort of obsessed by this- in 74-75 Bobby Orr won the ART ROSS (all the while also a pedestrian +80), now he did finish 3rd (so was a finalist in modern terms) for the Hart but it was pretty close between him and Parent for 3rd even. (Clarke and Vachon were 1-2)

[Harry Lime]

The alternate ballot of Gaudreau, Huberdeau and Josi are all equally or more deserving. Take any one of them off of their teams, and the difference is palpable. Take McDavid off of Edmonton, and they are probably about the same, maybe a bit better if they are forced to play a team game. Goalies are very hard to place, because they are the most important position. That's why it's rare to see them here.

Matthews probably makes my list. I would have made it Gaudreau, Huberdeau and Matthews, and the voting should be neck and neck. Having two players in McDavid and Shesterkin on the ballot, just make the check out to Matthews.

[Samonadreau]

There's only one trophy I care about this year. Im sure the players would feel the same.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Are you a secret Oiler fan?! You really think Gaudreau is more important to the Flames than McDavid is to the Oilers?

That only works if you believe that Tkachuk and Lindholm are fourth line bums that Gaudreau elevated to first line players à la Thornton or Crosby. Otherwise, as any true Flames fan would proudly proclaim, the Oilers are absolutely terrible without McDavid.

Remove Gaudreau from the Flames, yeah they probably don't make the playoffs but this year they're probably still fighting down to the wire against Vegas and the Kings. Remove McDavid from the Oilers, they're probably also still fighting down to the wire for a playoff spot....against the Gulls and Roadrunners.

No, the Oilers are terrible without the powerplay.

To me, a Hart candidate should elevate their team to a new level and overall higher performance.
Gaudreau, Matthews, Igor, Huberdeau, Kaprisov all did that this year.

Being the best player on a bad team shouldn't be enough.
The Oilers were still an average team, bad 5 on 5 and reliant on the PP. They didn't elevate to any new level from what they've been the last 7 years.
There shouldn't be awards for that.

[Canada 02]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1524767959301898240

[looooob]

Originally Posted by Canada 02

https://twitter.com/user/status/1524767959301898240

psssh what does he know? best playmaker? obviously has not consulted the rank and file

[Firebot]

McDavid can have his regular season Hart and carry it around on the golf course.

Gaudreau will get the Conn Smythe

[Tacoman]

Ever since that crooked Montreal writer tanked Iggy, I never pay attention to the Hart. I'm much more interested in the Lester B and who the players vote for.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Tacoman

Ever since that crooked Montreal writer tanked Iggy, I never pay attention to the Hart. I'm much more interested in the Lester B and who the players vote for.

Based on the player polls last month, he'll finish even lower based on the opinions of his peers.

[Snowghost]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I suspect politics were involved here with Gaudreau being buried in ballots from Edmonton, Toronto, NY. McDavid may have led the league in scoring but it was all based on powerplay points and despite how hard Edmonton media tries to spin that he's a complete player, he's far, far from it. I am surprised that he got in but maybe the voters feel that if you win the scoring race that means you are most valuable.

Well obviously the reporters are taking Mcwhiny's best advanced stat into consideration. He leads the league in LETSGO/60 by wide margin.

[Johnny Makarov]

i'm ok with it. Whatever makes him cheaper!

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

They didn't elevate to any new level from what they've been the last 7 years.

What happened 7 years ago?

I think there's definite room to argue the criteria for Hart, as is an annual tradition at this point, but I'm not sure I agree with yours at all.

If the Coyotes draft Bedard in 2023 and the Houston Coyotes become a perennial playoff team in 2024 based on him breaking out and putting up 150 points each year, I don't see any reason that Bedard should not win it each of those years even if he doesn't elevate them beyond what he did in 2024. As long as he (a) stays the best player in the league (if that's what the voters are voting on) or (b) remains the most important player to the otherwise pitiful Coyotes (if that's what the voters are voting on).

But elevating the team from what it was the year before isn't a criteria for Hart. That's actually closer to the Jack Adams award winners.

As for the specific argument against McDavid and the Oilers relying on powerplays. Well the Oilers drew the second least amount of penalties this year (ahead of only Vegas) with 269. McDavid, however, was second in the league in drawing penalties with 50 (behind only Dubios). As much as he whines when he doesn't get a penalty (like Crosby before him), it's not exactly a secret that his speed causes issues for players around the league resulting in those penalties being taken. So even if he relies on the PP for his points, at least he's the one drawing them.

If the Oilers even had a normal bottom pairing defenseman spare in the wings like the Flames do with Stone, I think the Nurse suspension may have given them a better chance at beating the Kings given how absolutely stupid Nurse is. But because they have to rely on some scrub who probably shouldn't play in the AHL let alone the NHL during the playoffs, I'm hoping the Kings can capitalize on the suspension. But Nurse will make more than any player on the Flames (until Tkachuk and Gaudreau re-sign). That's how bad the team is crafted lol.

[FlamesAddiction]

I think the Eastern bias is more just a symptom of media bias in general. People love to be spoon fed their opinions rather than actually having to develop them themselves. I bet McDavid gets a lot of votes in the east just based on how hard he is marketed. Ever since McDavid was in junior, the NHL has been marketing him and have invested a lot into it that it's hard to change directions at this point. To be fair, he does have entertaining highlights which are what most of them see in the news every morning. They don't see him after the other team scored and he is on the periphery or not in the shot at all because of his unwillingness to play defense.


I hope Gaudreau uses it as fuel to get the post-season accolades instead.