Liberals allege ex-MP was paid off to give his riding to Day - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

RedHot25 · 03-23-2007, 09:58 AM

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-col...ay-riding.html

The Liberals are demanding MP Stockwell Day resign from cabinet after documents surfaced Thursday that allege another MP was paid up to $50,000 to step aside in 2000 and let Day run in his riding.

.....

The allegations centre on events seven years ago when Day was elected leader of the now-defunct Canadian Alliance party. Day, who wasn't an MP at the time, had no riding and no seat in the House of Commons.

Fellow Alliance MP Jim Hart offered to step aside in the Okanagan-Coquihalla riding in British Columbia, forcing a byelection. Day won that byelection handily on Sept. 11, 2000.

On Thursday, Liberal MP Mark Holland alleged his party has found faxes that show Hart made a $50,000 compensation deal with the Canadian Alliance party to resign. If proven to be true, this would be a criminal offence.

....

Among the documents the Liberals say they found was a fax allegedly written by Hart and sent to Glenn McMurray, former executive director of the Canadian Alliance. The fax, which outlines Hart's expectations for $50,000, was dated July 15, 2000, two days before he officially resigned.

In a followup memo, dated Aug. 22, 2000, Hart allegedly complains that he had only received $6,000 of his money.

"My resignation was contingent upon this negotiation," he allegedly wrote.

.........

A related story: http://www.cbc.ca/cp/national/070322/n032224A.html

One of the documents is a fax sent by Hart to a party official, saying that his resignation was contingent on a compensation package negotiated with Day's chief of staff, Rod Love, the weekend before Hart stepped down.

Hart detailed the amounts that he had been promised by Love, and expressed frustration at delays in getting the money.

"Please realize that I took this step of resigning in good faith," Hart wrote to party executive director Glen McMurray. "I could have remained in office until the general election, finished my term and not experienced these losses. My resignation was contingent upon this negotiation."

Another page, a motion apparently voted on by the Canadian Alliance's governing body, approves payment of $20,000 to Hart to pay for his living expenses while he waited to start another job. The motion says the intention was that the party pay half the amount, and the Office of the Leader of the Opposition pay the other half.

Cheese · 03-23-2007, 10:08 AM

LOL

Politicians being bribed to do something? A CONSERVATIVE taking the juice? larf

RedHot25 · 03-23-2007, 10:15 AM

I got a chuckle out of this part. Not sure why, but it just seems kind of..well..

Holland said the Liberals recently found the documents in one of their offices — the Office of the Leader of the Opposition. The office used to be occupied by the Alliance, the Official Opposition from 2000 to 2003.

Ooops!

Ford Prefect · 03-23-2007, 10:16 AM

They're all a bunch of bloody pathalogical liars, so who knows which one's version of the truth might actually even contain a miniscule grain of truth. I don't even trust documented evidence when it's presented by politicians. The only sign post in this story that I might put some credence in is that Rod Love is involved on Day's side, which makes the Lieberals case a little stronger with me. I trust Love even less than most political figures.

Bobblehead · 03-23-2007, 10:17 AM

I hope anyone who was screaming about previous government corruption is just as willing to acknowledge this corruption by the previous Aliance leader/current Public Safety Minister.

Slava · 03-23-2007, 10:21 AM

Uh, oh! Looks like that whole "credibility and accountability" platform is coming around! Maybe Day should hop back on the jet-ski and make a getaway!

peter12 · 03-23-2007, 10:52 AM

nm

burns2002 · 03-23-2007, 11:53 AM

The liberals are accusing someone of taking a bribe. I guess that their former leader was stealing money from the taxpayers and was probably a communist. Bunch of hypocrites.

RedHot25 · 03-23-2007, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burns2002

The liberals are accusing someone of taking a bribe. I guess that their former leader was stealing money from the taxpayers and was probably a communist. Bunch of hypocrites.

I think the thing to me is that it goes both ways, by the looks of it (not getting into whose is worse, etc etc...I agree the liberals were bad bad bad. But when, on the otherside, you preach about how the need for accountability/ethics/etc/etc, and then it looks like....

).

Bertuzzied · 03-23-2007, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burns2002

The liberals are accusing someone of taking a bribe. I guess that their former leader was stealing money from the taxpayers and was probably a communist. Bunch of hypocrites.

The conservatives were accusing the liberals of taking bribes. What hypocrites! hahaha.

peter12 · 03-23-2007, 04:17 PM

Absolutely none of this is substantiated yet. As well, if everyone had actually read the entire piece, they would haven noticed that these are allegations from back in the Alliance days. Different party now and different leadership. If these allegations are proven true, this is Day's problem, not the Conservative party's problem.

MarchHare · 03-23-2007, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peter12

Absolutely none of this is substantiated yet. As well, if everyone had actually read the entire piece, they would haven noticed that these are allegations from back in the Alliance days. Different party now and different leadership. If these allegations are proven true, this is Day's problem, not the Conservative party's problem.

I'm sure you applied that same standard to the sponsorship scandal too, right? Afterall, after a lenghthy and thorough investigation, Paul Martin was cleared of any wrong-doing. Surely you believe it was Chretien's problem, not the Liberal Party's problem, right? Right?

peter12 · 03-23-2007, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarchHare

I'm sure you applied that same standard to the sponsorship scandal too, right? Afterall, after a lenghthy and thorough investigation, Paul Martin was cleared of any wrong-doing. Surely you believe it was Chretien's problem, not the Liberal Party's problem, right? Right?

Totally different situations in my opinion. One involved the criminal misappropriation of citizen tax dollars, the other involved private party dollars

I think it was a problem under the Chretien administration. I don't hold Paul Martin particularly responsible for anything that happened. As you said, Gomery did clear Martin of any wrongdoing.

However, I am certain that certain Liberal Party members and civil bureaucrats are still around and haven't been brought to justice. I am also certain that if Mr. Day and members of his personal circle are responsible that they should be held accountable for their actions.

kipperfan · 03-23-2007, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobblehead

I hope anyone who was screaming about previous government corruption is just as willing to acknowledge this corruption by the previous Aliance leader/current Public Safety Minister.

First of all, as has already been stated, this has not been proven, at this point it is a mere allegation....so lets all calm down. Second of all, if true, yes it sucks for the Conservatives...but lets put this in perspective....this happened 7 years ago, in a different party, long long before Stephen Harper came to power. This says nothing of the Conservative party as a whole(if true), it simply shows Day was and is a little weasel like most of us already knew.....this is no way should reflect on Harper or his government.

Oh and you have to know the Libs didnt just "find" this a couple of days ago...I am sure they have had this little gem for a while now, locked up in the old warchest and felt now, with the heat on the Consertatives in regards to the new budget, would be a great time to "find it" publicly.

calculoso · 03-23-2007, 04:36 PM

Related story:

Former MP issues statement about Day accusations
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNew...3?hub=Politics

MarchHare · 03-23-2007, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Totally different situations in my opinion. One involved the criminal misappropriation of citizen tax dollars, the other involved private party dollars

I'm not comparing the severity of the two (clearly the sponsorship scandal was worse). I just think it's highly hypocritical for the Conservative-supporters on this forum to blame Chertien's scandal on Martin's Liberals and then try to deflect a scandal involving Stockwell Day away from Harper and his Conservative Party.

Quote:

this happened 7 years ago, in a different party, long long before Stephen Harper came to power. This says nothing of the Conservative party as a whole(if true), it simply shows Day was and is a little weasel like most of us already knew.....this is no way should reflect on Harper or his government.

Again, how is that different from the sponsorship scandal which happened in the mid-late 90s under a different party leader, yet in 2006 Paul Martin's Liberal Party lost an election because of it? In fact, Harper himself made this the defining issue of both the 2004 and 2006 election campaigns. If it was fair to attack the Liberals over a Chertien scandal, surely it's fair to attack the Conservative over a Stockwell Day scandal.

kipperfan · 03-23-2007, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Again, now is that different from the sponsorship scandal which happened in the mid-late 90s under a different party leader, yet in 2006 Paul Martin's Liberal Party lost an election because of it.

Yes it is very different, so different the two shouldnt even be talked about in the same sentence. Lets forgot for a moment that the severity of one incident is 45 X greater then the other. From the reports(if true) it sounds like this was the actions of one man, Stockwell Day and his staffers. It didnt effect anyone else and for that reason only shouldnt paint the party with a broad stroke of scandal. Now on the other side of the coin we have the sponsorship scandal......a very very broad incident that involved numerous Libs, god only knows how many, but the Gomery inquiry proved it wasnt just Chretien and-or Martin....it was wide ranging(and we still dont know how wide, Stephen Dion, given his MP status in Quebec at the time very well could have played a part) and that is why are you talking apples and oranges.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarchHare

If it was fair to attack the Liberals over a Chertien scandal, surely it's fair to attack the Conservative over a Stockwell Day scandal.

Not even close.

MarchHare · 03-23-2007, 04:54 PM

Quote:

From the reports(if true) it sounds like this was the actions of one man, Stockwell Day and his staffers. It didnt effect anyone else and for that reason only shouldnt paint the party with a broad stroke of scandal.

According to the article, the Liberals are alleging that public funds allocated to the Office of the Leader of the Oppostion were used as part of the pay-off. If that's true, this goes beyond Stockwell Day and his staffers and affects every tax-paying Canadian.

FlamesAddiction · 03-23-2007, 05:00 PM

Unless it turns out that Harper was somehow involved, or knew about it, I don't think people should hold it against him or the party in general.

But what I hope this does is open the eyes of some of the people who stood on their soap boxes and moral high ground when the Liberals did similar things.

It's politics and it transcends parties. It doesn't matter where they are in the political spectrum or what country they are from. All you can do is hope that it stays minimal.

Resolute 14 · 03-23-2007, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobblehead

I hope anyone who was screaming about previous government corruption is just as willing to acknowledge this corruption by the previous Aliance leader/current Public Safety Minister.

When a corrupt body alleges corruption, one has to question the validity of the source.

It is fascinating how the Liberals magically found this, seven years after the fact, right when they are trying to build momentum. If there is independent proof of such, then yes, Day should resign immediately, and all involved should be prosecuted.

If all we have is the word of the Liberals themselves, then I have a very difficult time trusting it.