Russia invades Ukraine

[Muta]

"Russian warship, go #### yourself" is going to turn out to be one of the most bad-ass and legendary quotes ever. Balls the size of King Kong for sure.

[krynski]

Originally Posted by Bagor

How come there is no talk of sanctions/action against Belarus?

Here? Or in general?

There are talks about sanctions involving Belarus and their diplomats, but most of the attention is on Russia and Ukraine as Russia is the primary aggressor.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Bagor

How come there is no talk of sanctions/action against Belarus?

There were some announced, several pages back. There are not a lot they can do to Belarus really. They are an inconsequential country and get everything from Russia.

My hope is that Lukashenko and his psychopathic sons get hanged when all this is over.

[FlameOn]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

It's so infuriating that we aren't doing more.

Honest question here. Why didn't the EU, Canada, USA, Japan and Australia have troops in Ukraine a month ago - chilling on the border with the home troops? Why isn't that deterrent an option?

Cuz EU has no defense agreements with Ukraine and they are not a member of NATO. Traditionally Ukraine has been a Russian ally and previous Ukrainian administrations were complicit the Gazprom natural gas kickback and bribery schemes in which Russian LNG was sold to EU countries like Germany through pipelines that ran through Ukraine while Putin and Oligarchs were skimming profits off the top and using the proceeds to buy European and Ukrainian government officials + make themselves filthy rich. When the Orange revolution in 2013 deposed of Russia's puppet government, the Ukrainians demanded broader integration with the EU, but not NATO membership yet.

Putin losing his puppet government in Ukraine freaked him out because at that point he was looking to retire, but the the Orange revolution showed him even he could be deposed if people rose up. Combination of potentially being prosecuted himself, losing Ukraine and Russia's only warm water naval port, and possibly being surrounded by NATO/EU nations that were not friendly to Russian interests sent him off the deep end and he invaded Crimea knowing NATO membership rules state that a country needs to be at peace and have resolved any outstanding border conflicts before being allowed join NATO. Ukraine having an active conflict with Russia prevent them from joining up and Russia wouldn't be surrounded.

EU not responding harshly against Russia the first time showed Putin he could get away with what he had just seized, and the EU countries went back to their Russian gas addiction and complacency convinced Putin was only interested in that one piece of land around their port. They never thought Putin would be crazy enough to actually roll to full scale war like he has and after Trump the US had major credibility problems trying to convince the EU. EU's addiction to Russian LNG has prevented them from doing anything militarily. Their mentality was always Ukraine was always "its within Russias sphere of influence anyways" and not really their problem. Combination of US being war weary (no more boots on the ground), NATO allies getting burned by Afghanistan/Iraq wars, EU being happily addicted to Russian low cost natural gas, and no one wanting to fight an nuclear armed Russian unless they absolutely have to, has prevented a troop build up ahead of time despite knowing far in advance an invasion was coming. Lot of these factors are still preventing a proper sanction response against Russia.

[FlameOn]

Originally Posted by Coys1882

It's so infuriating that we aren't doing more.

Honest question here. Why didn't the EU, Canada, USA, Japan and Australia have troops in Ukraine a month ago - chilling on the border with the home troops? Why isn't that deterrent an option?

Also this from CNN. A lot of naïve EU countries that "trust" Russian leaders.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1497066084154937345

[CaptainCrunch]

If I was a country around Russia, I'd be finding a way to buy or develop nukes in a hurry.

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by Jordan!

What would stop Trump from doing this in Canada or Mexico though?

Start a fake beef with Canada and just move in?

I’d like to believe this isn’t possible but with this?? Who the hell knows..

My understanding of history is that USA did this to Mexico and tried to do it to Canada. Except it was like 200 years ago.

In the meantime one more fairly legit motivation of Putin is circulating. He's mad at Ukraine toppling his crony-yet-elected president at 2014, with perceived western support, so he's went like

"Oh, you went in with your secret services and propagandists and advisers and all the funding and topple my ally to install pro-western government? Well, two can play this game. I enter with my tanks, topple your guy and install mine"

[chubeyr1]

Originally Posted by Muta

"Russian warship, go #### yourself" is going to turn out to be one of the most bad-ass and legendary quotes ever. Balls the size of King Kong for sure.

Yet they all died! Brave, absolutely. Stupid? Absolutely. Surrender and fight another day.

The Ukraine will not win a conventional war against Russia.

They all died for pride and ego. They should of stayed home and fought the war a few weeks later. If there is even a war in a couple of weeks.

I wish people would stop following politicians to war.

[FlameOn]

Originally Posted by Pointman

My understanding of history is that USA did this to Mexico and tried to do it to Canada. Except it was like 200 years ago.

In the meantime one more fairly legit motivation of Putin is circulating. He's mad at Ukraine toppling his crony-yet-elected president at 2014, with perceived western support, so he's went like

"Oh, you went in with your secret services and propagandists and advisers and all the funding and topple my ally to install pro-western government? Well, two can play this game. I enter with my tanks, topple your guy and install mine"

That is severe paranoia on Putin's part. The US and Europeans were so afraid of Russia's anger + LNG leverage that they wouldn't get involved w/ the Ukrainian protesters out even as they were getting slaughtered by Yanukovych's forces. It wasn't till it after Yanukovych fled to Russia the the West actually come out in support.

And really, regular Ukrainians wanted better standards of living and no institutionalized corruption and its Western propagandists toppling the government? That is some next level tin foil hat stuff there.

[Robo]

I feel this war is going to backfire on Putin so many people in Russia do not want this war Including soldiers

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

If I was a country around Russia, I'd be finding a way to buy or develop nukes in a hurry.

Ukraine disarmed their nukes in return for a promise of USA, UK and Russia to protect her. It's called Budapest memorandum. But it's not legally binding and so vaguely written, that USA and UK just said that they won't commit

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Psychotic ####ing piece of #### dictator.

I find it fascinating the way Pointman sees this man and his actions. I don't even mean that in a derogatory way, just in a matter of fascination in seeing how where we're born and raised paves the way for how we interpret the world around us.

[flylock shox]

Possible ways to help from Postmedia:

• The Canada-Ukraine Foundation is raising money on GoFundMe and is encouraging people to use #HelpUkraineNow on social media. As of Thursday, the organization had raised more than $190,000 to help Ukrainian families displaced by the bombing.
• The National Bank of Ukraine has opened a special account to raise money for the armed forces in Ukraine at bank.gov.ua.
• The Ukrainian Canadian Congress also accepts donations on its website at ucc.ca.
• Charitable Foundation Voices of Children helps children affected by the war in eastern Ukraine. You can donate at voices.org.ua.
• On Facebook, United Help Ukraine is asking for donations for medical aid and humanitarian relief for the front lines.

From the Globe:

• Canada-Ukraine Foundation: a Toronto-based group that co-ordinates Canadian charitable aid to Ukraine
• Médecins sans frontières (Doctors Without Borders): a humanitarian group that’s been supporting Ukraine’s COVID-19 response
• Voices of Children: offers psychological support to children affected by the conflict in Eastern Ukraine
• Come Back Alive Foundation: a Ukrainian NGO that supports veterans and co-organizes the Invictus Games in Ukraine
• Phoenix Wings: a charitable foundation that supplies the Ukrainian army with medical treatment and defensive equipment such as vests and helmets
• Revived Soldiers Ukraine: a non-profit that funds medical rehabilitation for Ukrainian soldiers
• Razom for Ukraine: a pro-democracy group that’s fundraising for medical supplies in Ukraine
• Kyiv Independent: a Ukraine-based, English-language independent news media outlet

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Minnie

Ukraine matters because of its people. Screw the rest.

All lives matter. One dead person from this war is one too many.

[agulati]

Nm

[Minnie]

Originally Posted by Dion

All lives matter. One dead person from this war is one too many.

Ok?

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Minnie

Ok?

Not sure what you mean. Can you clarify?

[tony-soprano]

Originally Posted by Robo

I feel this war is going to backfire on Putin so many people in Russia do not want this war Including soldiers

Putin’s demise.

[chubeyr1]

Originally Posted by Dion

Not sure what you mean. Can you clarify?

Waiting for the response making popcorn as I wait.

Do you disagree that this was an unjust war?

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by FlameOn

That is severe paranoia on Putin's part. The US and Europeans were so afraid of Russia's anger + LNG leverage that they wouldn't get involved w/ the Ukrainian protesters out even as they were getting slaughtered by Yanukovych's forces. It wasn't till it after Yanukovych fled to Russia the the West actually come out in support.

And really, regular Ukrainians wanted better standards of living and no institutionalized corruption and its Western propagandists toppling the government? That is some next level tin foil hat stuff there.

While this by no means justifies the horror for which Putin is solely responsible, western meddling in 2014 is obvious.

https://mobile.reuters.com/article/a...A1601G20140207

https://www.thenation.com/article/ar...-maidan/tnamp/