2021/2022 Trade Speculation and Rumours

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

No, I disagree.

The Flames should absolutely keep Tkachuk, Gaudreau, and Mangiapane because they are all good players and they drive the team forward.

You can’t discard good players because you’re stuck with bad players or paying mediocre ones too much money. The GM has to find a way to offload his makes/under-performers (and better yet, don’t pay them in the first place). If he can’t do that, then he shouldn’t have his job.

The moment we lose one of Tkachuk/Gaudreau/Mangiapane, then we immediately need to replace that player. This team doesn’t have top-six wingers just sitting around waiting to get into the lineup.

Every year we see teams somehow figure out how to manage difficult cap situations without ejecting their best players.

Nobody thinks any of our guys aren’t good players.

They all play the same position, and it happens to be the least valuable position on the ice.

They won’t be able to acquire the centre this group needs, because Jack Eichel is no longer available.

A core of Eichel, Gaudreau, Tkachuk and Lindholm is something you can build around. You figure out how to make that work.

Tkachuk, Lindholm, and Mangiapane? (I’m assuming Johnny is gone, unless this team makes it to at least the 3rd round)

Blow it up. Stop building around wingers. Start building around centres.

A plurality of the fan base was on board with this before Sutter got here. Darryl’s impact can’t be understated. But he also isn’t enough to overcome a glaring lack of star power, specifically at the centre ice position.

Since they wouldn’t pay to acquire a star centre, they have no choice but to draft one - it’s really hard to draft one in the middle of the 1st round.

So what are we holding out for?

Punt already.

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

No, I disagree.

The Flames should absolutely keep Tkachuk, Gaudreau, and Mangiapane because they are all good players and they drive the team forward.

You can’t discard good players because you’re stuck with bad players or paying mediocre ones too much money. The GM has to find a way to offload his makes/under-performers (and better yet, don’t pay them in the first place). If he can’t do that, then he shouldn’t have his job.

The moment we lose one of Tkachuk/Gaudreau/Mangiapane, then we immediately need to replace that player. This team doesn’t have top-six wingers just sitting around waiting to get into the lineup.

Every year we see teams somehow figure out how to manage difficult cap situations without ejecting their best players.

So you think those 3 natural LWers should be paid 25m+ combined for 6+ years? You are essentially saying "let's build a team around 3 LWers, two who are small"

Please don't tell me you make fun of Toronto's cap situation

[TheoFleury]

The main problem with this franchise is that management is no better at forecasting than the average fan. If you can't forecast, how can you possibly expect to manage your assets properly?

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

The main problem with this franchise is that management is no better at forecasting than the average fan. If you can't forecast, how can you possibly manage your assets properly?

I think the average fan is actually better at forecasting than this group.

If we ran a poll asking how long a rebuild should take, I would bet less than 10% respond “2 seasons”.

Not after nearly a decade relying on Iggy and Kipper. Doesn’t matter how good this Johnny Hockey kid is - you’re gonna need more than him.

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

No, I disagree.

The Flames should absolutely keep Tkachuk, Gaudreau, and Mangiapane because they are all good players and they drive the team forward.

You can’t discard good players because you’re stuck with bad players or paying mediocre ones too much money. The GM has to find a way to offload his makes/under-performers (and better yet, don’t pay them in the first place). If he can’t do that, then he shouldn’t have his job.

The moment we lose one of Tkachuk/Gaudreau/Mangiapane, then we immediately need to replace that player. This team doesn’t have top-six wingers just sitting around waiting to get into the lineup.

Every year we see teams somehow figure out how to manage difficult cap situations without ejecting their best players.

Good teams build around C and D... not LW

[ComixZone]

All this talk about “three natural LW”.

Sorry, Matthew Tkachuk is the RW on the best line in the league. It is very clearly not a problem.

Mangiapane also plays both LW/RW. As does Coleman, who is also under contract.

Having Gaudreau/Tkachuk/Mangiapane on the team doesn’t prevent this team from building on Centre/Defence. The bigger problem there is Monahan and Backlund - those two should go, and I don’t think it’s crazy to think that they will in fact be moved at some point.

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

I think the average fan is actually better at forecasting than this group.



If we ran a poll asking how long a rebuild should take, I would bet less than 10% respond “2 seasons”.



Not after nearly a decade relying on Iggy and Kipper. Doesn’t matter how good this Johnny Hockey kid is - you’re gonna need more than him.

Actually I agree. Honestly the problem is two prong. Talent evaluation and forecasting. Hand in hand. BT is pitiful at both IMO

Amateur scouting is good though. Get them as many picks as possible. Work to your strengths and hopefully hire someone who doesn't throw darts on July 1st and for some reason thinks a surplus of bodies on D is more important than scoring depth

Maybe someone who can learn and gets better. No rookies. No retreads.

Easier said than done obviously

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

All this talk about “three natural LW”.

Sorry, Matthew Tkachuk is the RW on the best line in the league. It is very clearly not a problem.

Mangiapane also plays both LW/RW. As does Coleman, who is also under contract.

Having Gaudreau/Tkachuk/Mangiapane on the team doesn’t prevent this team from building on Centre/Defence. The bigger problem there is Monahan and Backlund - those two should go, and I don’t think it’s crazy to think that they will in fact be moved at some point.

The team would be better if the 2nd line was built around him (Tkachuk). Too bad BT could never actually figure out the RW dilemma in 8 years

Having JG, MT and AM absolutely makes it very difficult to build around C and D because of the salary cap

Where do you see the future 1C and 1D coming from? Just curious

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

And Tanev and Markstrum

Take contracts back like Arizona . They have 3 firsts and 5 seconds this years draft

I hope JG and MT resign , but if they don’t (and I would say both must) go nuclear and do it right finally . Have a new team ready for the new Arena (insert joke here )

I mean, someone has to play the games - no sense feeding any of the young goalies to the wolves.

I don’t believe Markstrom would be enough to keep this roster out of the basement sans the entire top line. Especially if you trade Tanev - that blue line is gonna give up some chances.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

The team would be better if the 2nd line was built around him. Too bad BT could never actually figure out the RW dilemma in 8 years

…he has.

He has an elite RW in Tkachuk.

Gaudreau - Lindholm - Tkachuk is the best line in hockey.

So turn your eyes to the 2nd line.

Mangiapane - ? - Coleman

That’s pretty good. That “?” just needs to be better than Backlund or Monahan. The money spent on Monahan and Backlund (and Lucic) is the problem with the cap structure right now.

[dino7c]

Team has 13 regulation losses in 41 games, mostly road games

Must be doing something right

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Team has 13 regulation losses in 41 games, mostly road games

Must be doing something right

It's amazing what happens when you finally get a coach (4th time's a charm) and give your superstar linemates worthy of his talent for the first time

I'm enjoying this season honestly

It sucks that we are in for years of pain going forward though

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

…he has.



He has an elite RW in Tkachuk.



Gaudreau - Lindholm - Tkachuk is the best line in hockey.



So turn your eyes to the 2nd line.



Mangiapane - ? - Coleman



That’s pretty good. That “?” just needs to be better than Backlund or Monahan. The money spent on Monahan and Backlund (and Lucic) is the problem with the cap structure right now.

The 2nd line is Mangiapane and two average overpaid vets

One line team. We are lucky that the top line is so good. You shouldn't be forced to put your three best players on one line because of faulty roster construction though

How do you get a Lindholm type C for line 2?

This GM has proven to be mostly incapable of adding talent like that

[GreenLantern2814]

They’re having a great year. But they’re on the verge of being completely lost in the wilderness once they lose the best player they’ve had since Iggy for nothing, and the other side of their 1st line has a $9M Q.0. Which takes him to UFA at the earliest age allowable by the CBA.

Which leaves Lindholm and Mangiapane as their two best offensive players, and that’s not a core. They aren’t going to acquire new core players via the draft or free agency if they lose Tkachuk and Gaudreau.

They’re going to be a bottom-10 team, so they may as well sell everything they can and make it bottom-5.

[dino7c]

You have to be pretty pessimistic to just assume Gaudreau and Tkachuk are both gone for nothing

[Gaskal]

Clearly we just steal our long-term 2nd Line C from the Canucks right? Isn't that the game plan now, steal all the Canucks good things?

I'd be getting ready to roll out the carpet for JT Miller.

[Fire]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

^^^What I wouldn’t give for our franchise to run itself the way the Winnipeg Jets do.

Stay out of the news. Scout well. Draft well.

Don’t waste all your cap space every July 1 with free agents even the most casual fan can see are garbage.

When a star(ish) player wants out, trade him for a 1st +.

Don’t hire a new head coach every 18 months - the Jets have been back for 12 years and they’re only just on their third coach.

Treliving on his own has hired five.

It’s impatient Mickey Mouse ####.

I don't mind the way the Jets are running their team but how much success has the Winnipeg Jets had in the past 12 years. Not much different from the Flames success.

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by dino7c

You have to be pretty pessimistic to just assume Gaudreau and Tkachuk are both gone for nothing

Gaudreau is pretty likely gone for nothing imo

What do you think Tkachuk's trade value this summer will be with him one year from UFA? Look at the return for Mark Stone at best lol

Good chance all we have to show for these two players when all said and done is a late 1st, decent prospect and decent roster player

Makes keeping Lindholm, Hanifin and Mangiapane moot

[GioforPM]

The Jets? The ones who traded a first and 4th (and a player) for Kevin Hayes? Who gave Wheeler $8.5 and a NMC until 2024?

I’m not sure they’re a model franchise. They’ve been back for 10 years, missed the POs in 5, and got past the 1st round twice (once because they played the Oilers). And this year, when they made a big push getting D in, they suck.

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

The Jets? The ones who traded a first and 4th (and a player) for Kevin Hayes? Who gave Wheeler $8.5 and a NMC until 2024?

I’m not sure they’re a model franchise. They’ve been back for 10 years, missed the POs in 5, and got past the 1st round twice (once because they played the Oilers). And this year, when they made a big push getting D in, they suck.

They're like us basically, maybe 5% better