2021/2022 Trade Speculation and Rumours

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Just terrible waste of assets IMO.

And a team that might be forced into a rebuild very shortly should not be unloading valuable future pieces for a player that might only be with them for a couple months.

It is a waste of assets, however this could be the biggest chance this team will have in the foreseeable future.

The assets would likely be mid-high first and second rounders. I don't think they would be the difference between the next iteration of the Flames winning a cup or not.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

It is a waste of assets, however this could be the biggest chance this team will have in the foreseeable future.

The assets would likely be mid-high first and second rounders. I don't think they would be the difference between the next iteration of the Flames winning a cup or not.

It's a slippery slope though to be honest, and depends on the player you are getting, and how close to a true contender you really think you are.

Flames traded their 2010 1st, and Lombardi for Jokinen.

Seemed like the right move at the time and fortunately Gormley didn't work out for Phoenix, but Schwartz, Forbort, and Tarasenko went with the next three picks.

If Phoenix takes Tarasenko instead of Gormley I'm not sure we are happy that we missed out on 10 years of that.

You can always justify moving future picks in the moment of a playoff run, but those deals add up long term.

The Hamonic trade for example is really killing this team right now.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Just terrible waste of assets IMO.

And a team that might be forced into a rebuild very shortly should not be unloading valuable future pieces for a player that might only be with them for a couple months.

All players are just passing through it's just a question of how long. The team got one playoff series out of Hamonic and he wasn't considered a rental.

When you actually have a team that is competitive and able to beat good teams, it's worth investing. Otherwise, waht exactly are we building towards? What good are valuable future pieces if you don't try to win once in a while.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

It's a slippery slope though to be honest, and depends on the player you are getting, and how close to a true contender you really think you are.

Flames traded their 2010 1st, and Lombardi for Jokinen.

Seemed like the right move at the time and fortunately Gormley didn't work out for Phoenix, but Schwartz, Forbort, and Tarasenko went with the next three picks.

If Phoenix takes Tarasenko instead of Gormley I'm not sure we are happy that we missed out on 10 years of that.

You can always justify moving future picks in the moment of a playoff run, but those deals add up long term.

The Hamonic trade for example is really killing this team right now.

The Jokinen trade was IMO a good trade and addressed a glaring need. In hindsight, he wasn't as good as we thought but I'd do that deal all day.

I'd much rather trade picks when you know you have a playoff team vs. dealing picks in the offseason for depth players.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

The Jokinen trade was IMO a good trade and addressed a glaring need. In hindsight, he wasn't as good as we thought but I'd do that deal all day.

I'd much rather trade picks when you know you have a playoff team vs. dealing picks in the offseason for depth players.

It was similar to the Neal signing in that a huge hole was supposedly being filled but the player didn’t measure up. Of course, in Neal’s case it was a much much bigger failure to measure up.

I suppose you would say the same about the Hamonic trade, plus the price was too high.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

It's a slippery slope though to be honest, and depends on the player you are getting, and how close to a true contender you really think you are.

Flames traded their 2010 1st, and Lombardi for Jokinen.

Seemed like the right move at the time and fortunately Gormley didn't work out for Phoenix, but Schwartz, Forbort, and Tarasenko went with the next three picks.

If Phoenix takes Tarasenko instead of Gormley I'm not sure we are happy that we missed out on 10 years of that.

You can always justify moving future picks in the moment of a playoff run, but those deals add up long term.

The Hamonic trade for example is really killing this team right now.

It is a slippery slope. I was advocating a rebuild for much of the off-season, but this team doesn't have the appetite for one.

As for your outlook, it's a little flawed in my opinion. You are looking at a draft pick as a best case scenario. It's like if you were to trade a lottery ticket, and complain that you have traded the biggest prize.

The point is that draft picks are far from a sure thing. It's very difficult to predict who the Flames would've picked in that scenario and how that player would've developed in this organization.

For example, maybe Tarasenko would've preferred staying in Russia rather than coming to play for the Flames' AHL team. He might not have gotten opportunities on the PP or failed on the 4th line. In pro sports a lot of things have to go just right for a player to succeed. Raw talent is one of them, but opportunity, and coaching/development play a huge role.

[Bongsong]

I want Zadina and Tippett for a first and Valimaki good for now and the future maybe even Kravitzov for a couple seconds

[powderjunkie]

If dragged into a rebuild you can move the likes of Tanev, Hanifin, Monny/Backlund, and maybe even Lindholm/Markstrom for futures.

The sparse cupboards from 2017-19 mean it's unlikely to be quick retool. Sustained success for this group will require continued improvement from young roster players, and for a few of our best prospects to make a big impact fairly soon. If those things don't happen, then it means we're likely heading into a rebuild without much legit young talent (ie. starting with the 2023 draft instead of 2022 won't be a huge deal)


1-2 need to jump from very good to great+:
Mangi
Hanifin
Andersson

1-2 need to jump to very good+
Kylington
Dubé
Valimaki

Several need to be top half of roster players, with at least 1-2 being 'great' (and a few depth players, too):
Ruzicka
Pelletier
Zary
Coronato

Heineman
Yuznetsov
Poirier
Boltman
etc

[bigrangy]

Actually the best thing to do would be fire the pro scouts and go hire Florida’s

Then make some trades

[Sandman]

The other day, I was going to mention Mason Marchment as a player I would love to aquire. Tonight, he has 6 points against Columbus.

I believe he attended Flames rookie camp at least once.

[Heavy Jack]

I would love to see the flames land both Toffoli and Jarnkrok while hanging on to Monahan and I think it’s definitely achievable. With Johnny’s contract up they have to swing for the fences and deal with the contracts afterwards I can’t see them not going for it. A combined cap hit of 6.25 mill for Toffoli and Jarnkrok makes it so Calgary only has to shed about a mill to make it work.

Gaudreau - Lindholm - Tkachuk
Mangiapane - Monahan - Toffoli
Coleman - Backlund - Jarnkrok
Lucic - Ruzicka - Dube
Lewis, Richardson

Waivers/Taxi - Ritchie, Pitlick (potentially included in a trade?)

Crazy deep forward lineup that has scoring threats throughout.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Sandman

The other day, I was going to mention Mason Marchment as a player I would love to aquire. Tonight, he has 6 points against Columbus.

I believe he attended Flames rookie camp at least once.

Lundell is the target there, but no way the Panthers give up Lundell. That kid is going to be a player on the level of Huberdeau in a couple years. Really great young player.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Heavy Jack

I would love to see the flames land both Toffoli and Jarnkrok while hanging on to Monahan and I think it’s definitely achievable. With Johnny’s contract up they have to swing for the fences and deal with the contracts afterwards I can’t see them not going for it. A combined cap hit of 6.25 mill for Toffoli and Jarnkrok makes it so Calgary only has to shed about a mill to make it work.

Gaudreau - Lindholm - Tkachuk
Mangiapane - Monahan - Toffoli
Coleman - Backlund - Jarnkrok
Lucic - Ruzicka - Dube
Lewis, Richardson

Waivers/Taxi - Ritchie, Pitlick (potentially included in a trade?)

Crazy deep forward lineup that has scoring threats throughout.

That's what I'm talkin' about.

Looks great

[FranksandBean]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

This is such a difficult scenario because I feel like any rental added is likely going to walk in the summer. Not that different from the last time this team looked like they could do something they have a summer full of tough contracts to negotiate.

Adding Eberle, Toffoli, Milller etc would make sense in regards to paying a 1st or good assets because these guys would be back for at least one more run. Even without any moves it is going to be tough to sign Johnny and the 3 RFA’s this summer.

This team could be in rental territory only which is really tough to see high picks and good prospects moved.

I don’t totally agree I think there are a few ufa’s that might resign, Rackell and Jarnkrok are two who we might be able to keep if the came here and we went on a run.

Like I said in my other posts I think we can and will trade Dube and one of Valimaki/MacKey for upgrades but only if those come with term. Just my thoughts.

There is another tactic we are not exploring which might be to go after rfa’s with large qualifying offers to make a run this year and give us flexibility to loose one of Gaudreau or Tkachuk in the off-season but keep the trade deadline pickup. Just a thought.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by FranksandBean

I don’t totally agree I think there are a few ufa’s that might resign, Rackell and Jarnkrok are two who we might be able to keep if the came here and we went on a run.

Like I said in my other posts I think we can and will trade Dube and one of Valimaki/MacKey for upgrades but only if those come with term. Just my thoughts.

There is another tactic we are not exploring which might be to go after rfa’s with large qualifying offers to make a run this year and give us flexibility to loose one of Gaudreau or Tkachuk in the off-season but keep the trade deadline pickup. Just a thought.

I do think that Dube and Valimaki are in play for deals If the flames are looking to go real big game hunting.

They talk on the fan about a Monahan buyout because that might be how they can realistically afford to give Johnny, Tkachuk, Mangiapane, Kylington their raises. I have a hard time seeing them add any significant contracts beyond this year

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by bigrangy

Actually the best thing to do would be fire the pro scouts and go hire Florida’s

Then make some trades

Not winning a playoff round since 1996 doesn't hurt either...lots of lottery tickets

[FranksandBean]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

I do think that Dube and Valimaki are in play for deals If the flames are looking to go real big game hunting.

They talk on the fan about a Monahan buyout because that might be how they can realistically afford to give Johnny, Tkachuk, Mangiapane, Kylington their raises. I have a hard time seeing them add any significant contracts beyond this year

I agree on significant contracts but if they think they can’t sign or afford the big two maybe they trad for rfa’s at the deadline for a run this year and retool on the fly. Just a thought, as it would add a significant play to the negotiating position of the flames. They could say here is what we can afford and if not the you are traded and we will sign our new addition. Works more with Tkachuk than Gaudreau but applies to both.

Either way they are in an interesting position of not having enough to be a true contender but not being bad enough to rebuild/retool. I think that low value (cap) ufa’s are their best bet but who know the price (picks). I just hate trading picks when we might be forced to retool/rebuild in the off-season.

[Classic_Sniper]

Hate to be the wet blanket again, but I’m still seeing tons of names in this thread that just don’t seem realistic in my opinion. I feel like a lot of posters are setting themselves up for disappointment and also putting unfair expectations on Brad Treliving.

Even though I’m typically very critical of the guy, even I don’t think it’s realistic for Brad to trade for the Laine’s, DeBrincat’s or even the Toffoli’s of the hockey world with the Flames’ cap situation being what it is next season. I don’t think it makes sense acquiring big ticket players with term/rights that could impede the Flames’ ability to sign their 4 free agents this summer.

For instance, just to pay for the raises of Gaudreau, Tkachuk, Mangiapane & Kylington, Treliving will likely have to move one or more of Monahan, Backlund, Hanifin and etc. If you throw in a Toffoli contract on top of that, then it just adds more complexity and risk in to the mix. Then we’ll be in a situation of diminishing returns just due to sheer desperation. That’s not a good idea at all.

So in my opinion, the scenario that makes the most sense is a rental, at least until the TDL of 2023 when Lucic and Monahan’s contracts will be up.

[dino7c]

Is Lucic even going to play for next to nothing next season? I could see him retiring

[Roof-Daddy]

Love Looch, but if he retires after this season that's a game changer for the Flames cap wise.