The Legend of Sam Bennett

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

I posted this list some time ago, of worst trades
1. Gilmour
2. Savard
3. Mullen (they also traded Sarge for a 2nd which wasn't great either)
4. Giguere
5. Regehr to Buffalo
6. Bouwmeester (didn't need to happen as he had a 1 year left)
7. Stralman/Lydman (putting these together as they are very similar in that a quality dman was traded for next to nothing, seemed like they didn't align to Sutter's approach to D but they both went on to be long time quality NHLers)
8. Phaneuf (this was a bad deal because they should have gone for quality not quantity)
9. Hrdina for Kyte


I would add to that:
- Giving up MSL for nothing
- James Neal UFA
- Hamonic deal is probably top 15
- Though in isolation I don't think you can be too hard on not picking good players in the mid 20s, but the cumulative impact of the Chucko, Pelech, Irving, Nemisz, Erixon stretch from 2004 to 2009 (with Backlund sandwiched in there) did the franchise some serious long-term harm and deserves mention.

I'm probably missing some stuff. Right now I would put the entire "Saga of Sam" from the pick, to the development, to the trade somewhere in the top 20.

Special Bonus: The Flames signing Teemu Selanne to an offer sheet matched by the Jets. This wasn't a blunder at all, in fact it was a brilliant move. It falls more under the "what if" category for if Winnipeg hadn't matched the Flames fortunes surely change.

Thanks for posting a list that allows everyone else to criticize. Although I have strongly resisted this in the past, I think you have to put the Hull trade on this as a bad trade. Let's be honest about the return.

Wamsley was great guy, but he was a backup goalie. No role in the Cup run.
Ramage was quite possibly the best bottom pairing D in the league upon joining the Flames. But that's what he was for us, bottom pair. He was incredible depth when Suter went down and he was very important. And then he left the club, only playing one full season in Calgary.

Brett Hull went on to score 741 goals in the NHL and another eye popping 103 playoff goals. Trading Brett Hull should have set the club up for years instead of temporary depth.

Would I change anything? Well no, but it was not a good return.

I'd also put Neal and Hamonic higher on my list. Yes Jaybo was traded too soon and the return was really weak but IMO less onesided than the Hamonic deal.

The Jokinen trade that got us Kotalik was worse than the trade that sent him and Regehr to Buffalo IMO.

I hear you on the run of bad first round picks under Sutter but really we haven't seen this club do anything with mid to high first rounders in forever. Backlund was an exception. And Feaster actually turned Erixon into something.

We should do a list of good trades too sometime. There have been lots.

[DomeFoam]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Sam Bennett would have been awesome in Calgary if the Flames had a Jonathan Huberdeau for him to play with. Sadly, Bennett was supposed to be the Flames' version of Jonathan Huberadeau, and not just a "complementary" player to the actual Jonathan Huberdeau.

/thread

[DeluxeMoustache]

^ Lol

The goalposts have moved to their final location?

[FBI]

Bennett now has higher goals per game than everyone on the flames except for Mangiapane. (0.52 vs 0.51)

[blankall]

People do realize that Bennett is 8th on Florida in scoring right? He has 23 points to Huberdeau's 53. Even after that massive game yesterday, he's only on pace for 65 points. Basically, Huberdeau turned a 40ish point guy into a 65 point guy. If the Flames had given Bennett all the best minutes in Calgary he's probably a 55 point guy, which is not what you want on the top line.

It's pretty obvious what's going on. Barkov and Huberdeau are drastically improving the stats of competent nhlers, like Bennett and Duclair.

[StAlbertFlame]

I don't know, Bennett scoring when the score is 6-1 seems on par

[FBI]

“Only on pace for 65 points” lol
41 goals too. Would be nice.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by FBI

“Only on pace for 65 points” lol
41 goals too. Would be nice.

And how many of those goals are Bennett driving the net or taking advantage of space that Huberdeau creates? He also got all the goals in a hat trick yesterday when his team was already up 4-0, after Huberdeau had mentally defeated the stars. Bennett is not getting any of his point of goal totals unless he's riding shotgun to Huberdeau.

[Kipper_3434]

Originally Posted by blankall

And how many of those goals are Bennett driving the net or taking advantage of space that Huberdeau creates? He also got all the goals in a hat trick yesterday when his team was already up 4-0, after Huberdeau had mentally defeated the stars. Bennett is not getting any of his point of goal totals unless he's riding shotgun to Huberdeau.

If only we had a playmaker with elite vision and puckskills.....wait how many of gaudreaus wingers have scored at a 40 goal pace? Mony and lindholm both had that pace for the start of a season once. Huberdeau is a great great player and hes having arguably a career season with Benzo, good for him, bad for your argument.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by blankall

And how many of those goals are Bennett driving the net or taking advantage of space that Huberdeau creates? He also got all the goals in a hat trick yesterday when his team was already up 4-0, after Huberdeau had mentally defeated the stars. Bennett is not getting any of his point of goal totals unless he's riding shotgun to Huberdeau.

This whole train of thought regarding Bennett scoring meaningless goals is idiotic.

He was consistently the only Flames forward to elevate his game in the playoffs. If he’s scoring meaningless goals for Florida, yet was the only one scoring meaningful goals/points for the Flames - what does that say about the state of the Flames?

It’s okay to admit that the Flames screwed the hell out of this situation. I really hope they are internally acknowledging it because ignoring the fact that they did (screw this up) isn’t going to help them get better going forward. The sooner they realize they’re doing things wrong, the sooner they can stop sucking complete ass.

…sigh, I’ve just become an old man yelling at a cloud.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

If only we had a playmaker with elite vision and puckskills.....wait how many of gaudreaus wingers have scored at a 40 goal pace? Mony and lindholm both had that pace for the start of a season once. Huberdeau is a great great player and hes having arguably a career season with Benzo, good for him, bad for your argument.

Firstly, let's wait until he actually has 40. Secondly, it's such a shocking coincidence how many other players were mishandled horribly before going to Florida. Verhage, Montour, Duclair, Forsing, and Reinhart all vastly increasing their offensive output upon arriving in Florida.

Bennett playing with the league leader in assists has nothing to do with him scoring more goals?

[Kipper_3434]

Originally Posted by blankall

Firstly, let's wait until he actually has 40. Secondly, it's such a shocking coincidence how many other players were mishandled horribly before going to Florida. Verhage, Montour, Duclair, Forsing, and Reinhart all vastly increasing their offensive output upon arriving in Florida.

Bennett playing with the league leader in assists has nothing to do with him scoring more goals?

Sure does have plenty to do with him scoring....doesn't mean the flames dont have their own assist machine. I also qualified my statement by mentioning pace not full season goal totals. Hmmm gaudreau also contributed to career highs for the likes of Lindholm, Mony, Hudler and Giordano....i guess all those guys are plugs without him so theres that. Oh and Reinhart played for the perpetually tanking Sabers everyone knew he would do better with a change of scenary, much like Benzo.

[TheScorpion]

It's really time to move on. Bennett was a horrendous fit here. I'm glad he's doing well in Florida. The Flames got good value. As they say, bingo bango benzo.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

If only we had a playmaker with elite vision and puckskills.....wait how many of gaudreaus wingers have scored at a 40 goal pace? Mony and lindholm both had that pace for the start of a season once. Huberdeau is a great great player and hes having arguably a career season with Benzo, good for him, bad for your argument.

But that was kind of the issue - Huberdeau plays on their second line and needed a centre because Barkov always had his wingers.

Here, Bennett was not displacing Monahan when the Gatoraid line was going, and then Lindholm and Gaudreau clicked as well. People here think he should have but that’s a coaching decision that just made no sense - those lines were performing really well, and you’re going to remove the centre to see if Bennett can click? And of course, there wan’t any playmaker like Huberdeau on the second line. It was just a really bad fit.

[memphusk]

Originally Posted by blankall

People do realize that Bennett is 8th on Florida in scoring right? He has 23 points to Huberdeau's 53. Even after that massive game yesterday, he's only on pace for 65 points. Basically, Huberdeau turned a 40ish point guy into a 65 point guy. If the Flames had given Bennett all the best minutes in Calgary he's probably a 55 point guy, which is not what you want on the top line.

It's pretty obvious what's going on. Barkov and Huberdeau are drastically improving the stats of competent nhlers, like Bennett and Duclair.

So what your saying is Sam Bennett is better at hockey than you. You're right. Sam Bennett is a legend.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

It's really time to move on. Bennett was a horrendous fit here. I'm glad he's doing well in Florida. The Flames got good value. As they say, bingo bango benzo.

I think the issue is not how the fit was here, it’s why the fit was so bad

But yeah, just wait til we see Emil ####ing Heineman!

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by blankall

Even after that massive game yesterday, he's only on pace for 65 points. Basically,

Bahahahaha : I don't think that was the burn on a former player that you thought it was.

[codynw]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

What a statement that is. Consider that I would routinely read about how badly the franchise has been run and that they should move the team...over, and over, and over, and over.

What this says is that winning cures all, and that a few shrewd moves is all it takes to move a middling franchise to an elite one.

Of course, you need the right person making those moves. Dale Tallon and others...sucked. Bill Zito was a great choice.

Don't get me wrong, Zito has done a good job, but inheriting Barkov, Huberdeau and Ekblad certainly helps. Flames never got that kind of luck with draft lotteries and it shows.

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

I think the issue is not how the fit was here, it’s why the fit was so bad

Because the Flames only had one Huberdeau-calibre player instead of two, and the connections between Gaudreau and Monahan/Lindholm were too good to break up in favour of propping up a complementary player.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by blankall

And how many of those goals are Bennett driving the net or taking advantage of space that Huberdeau creates? He also got all the goals in a hat trick yesterday when his team was already up 4-0, after Huberdeau had mentally defeated the stars. Bennett is not getting any of his point of goal totals unless he's riding shotgun to Huberdeau.

Okay, now go through the whole league of point getters and take away from them based on the top six players they play with? Oh, you don't want to do that, do you?

Merit only gets taken away from Bennett for playing with good players, or everyone? Just Bennett? Okay.