2021/2022 Trade Speculation and Rumours

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Completely different profile of player. Pretty disingenuous comparison in order to take a shot at the organization.

Ghost has more term and dollars on his deal. also worth acknowledging he couldn’t stay in the lineup in Philadelphia. But I suppose they are idiots over there as well. I’ll also go out on a limb and say Sutter had some input on how to shape the blueline and I would be a bit surprised if Ghost was on that list. How does his contract work with the other acquisitions? You’re apples to apples comparison is pretty flimsy.

Further, had the Flames gone out and acquired Ghost, where does that leave Kylington? Seems that is the far more apt comparison as it relates to the type of players they are.

Lastly, did the Flames have the cap space to absorb Ghost’s contract? The Flames and the Coyotes were in very different positions cap wise. If you think the Glames were just going to absorb full

Gostisbehere was traded to Arizona on July 22nd. The Flames acquired Zadarov on July 28th and then didn’t sign him for a while - so yes the Flames had the space to take on Gostisbehere.

If the goal of the GM is to build a good team, which is usually done by acquiring good players (not bad ones), then the Flames would have been better off trading a 3rd for Gostisbehere - but they wouldn’t have even needed to as they could have taken advantage of Philly in the same way Arizona did and gotten paid a 2nd and 7th to take on Gostisbehere.

If anyone is arguing that the Flames should have paid a 3rd for Zadarov and then signed him for $3.75M at this stage I’m not really certain what to say. He’s a bad player and generally has been for some time. The point about impacting Kylington doesn’t track. You play the best 6 players. Kylington was one of the best 6 players, and he knocked Valimaki into the AHL - adding Gostisbehere wouldn’t have all of a sudden made the Flames suppress Kylington.

Hanifin - Andersson
Gostisbehere - Tanev
Kylington - Gudbranson

Or

Hanifin - Andersson
Kylington - Tanev
Gostisbehere - Gudbranson

+ 2nd rounder + 3rd rounder + 7th rounder

Is significantly better than:

Hanifin - Andersson
Kylington - Tanev
Zadarov - Gudbranson

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Philly’s GM is terrible.



…subtract Zadarov, add Gostisbehere, and there’s no difference in how Kylington earns his spot. Oh, and we’d have an additional 2nd, 3rd and 7th round pick to compensate for having to have an appropriately paid offensive defenceman on the books - which I don’t know if you’ve noticed, this team desperately needs as their defence is woeful when it comes to offensive production.

That additional 4.5M cap hit next year is a huge anchor to a team already struggling to find the space to keep 3 of their 4 best forwards who need a new contract. Would have been tough to see this team staying in the Eichel sweepstakes if they made this multi year cap commitment.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Gostisbehere was traded to Arizona on July 22nd. The Flames acquired Zadarov on July 28th and then didn’t sign him for a while - so yes the Flames had the space to take on Gostisbehere.

If the goal of the GM is to build a good team, which is usually done by acquiring good players (not bad ones), then the Flames would have been better off trading a 3rd for Gostisbehere - but they wouldn’t have even needed to as they could have taken advantage of Philly in the same way Arizona did and gotten paid a 2nd and 7th to take on Gostisbehere.

If anyone is arguing that the Flames should have paid a 3rd for Zadarov and then signed him for $3.75M at this stage I’m not really certain what to say. He’s a bad player and generally has been for some time. The point about impacting Kylington doesn’t track. You play the best 6 players. Kylington was one of the best 6 players, and he knocked Valimaki into the AHL - adding Gostisbehere wouldn’t have all of a sudden made the Flames suppress Kylington.

Hanifin - Andersson
Gostisbehere - Tanev
Kylington - Gudbranson

Or

Hanifin - Andersson
Kylington - Tanev
Gostisbehere - Gudbranson

+ 2nd rounder + 3rd rounder + 7th rounder

Is significantly better than:

Hanifin - Andersson
Kylington - Tanev
Zadarov - Gudbranson

Don’t think you really want to acknowledge that the Flames clearly wanted a physically imposing 3rd pair, or at least the option for it. I’ll side with the guy who has two cups and 35-ish years in the NHL as a player, assistant coach, coach, GM and executive. Add to that the years Treliving, and Maloney you’re looking at decades of professional hockey experience.

But I’m sure you have it figured, and they could learn a lot starting with ‘a good GM acquires good players.’

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Don’t think you really want to acknowledge that the Flames clearly wanted a physically imposing 3rd pair, or at least the option for it. I’ll side with the guy who has two cups and 35-ish years in the NHL as a player, assistant coach, coach, GM and executive. Add to that the years Treliving, and Maloney you’re looking at decades of professional hockey experience.

But I’m sure you have it figured, and they could learn a lot starting with ‘a good GM acquires good players.’

Yeah, being critical of a team that has won 4 playoff rounds since 1989 definitely means I think I know better than hockey professionals.

I don’t think the plan was to have a physically imposing 3rd pair. I think the Flames were planning for Zadarov to be on the 2nd pair, and that’s where they started him. Thankfully we do have a really good coach who has been making the best out of the hand he was dealt by his poor management team by limiting Zadarov to the 3rd pairing.

The team continues to do the exact same stuff year in and a year out and they garner the same results year in and year out. I’m not sure why being critical of that gets reduced to me thinking I know better. I don’t know better, I just want to see better results from the team I cheer for.

8 years into Treliving’s time here, I think it’s pretty damn fair to say he’s somewhere around “below average” to “outright bad” at his job.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by CroCop

I was just thinking this is a guy the Flames should be all over right now.

No, no they shouldn't. Sutter would bench him within a week, he is one of the worst D men at playing defense I have ever seen. No thanks.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Yes, our current coach does have a history of terrible player acquisitions.

If Sutter was happy with the construction of his roster, would he be openly criticizing it as much as he has this year?

Yes.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Yeah, being critical of a team that has won 4 playoff rounds since 1989 definitely means I think I know better than hockey professionals.

I don’t think the plan was to have a physically imposing 3rd pair. I think the Flames were planning for Zadarov to be on the 2nd pair, and that’s where they started him. Thankfully we do have a really good coach who has been making the best out of the hand he was dealt by his poor management team by limiting Zadarov to the 3rd pairing.

The team continues to do the exact same stuff year in and a year out and they garner the same results year in and year out. I’m not sure why being critical of that gets reduced to me thinking I know better. I don’t know better, I just want to see better results from the team I cheer for.

8 years into Treliving’s time here, I think it’s pretty damn fair to say he’s somewhere around “below average” to “outright bad” at his job.

Ok, so who is a good GM? lets start with the low hanging fruit; clearly Brisbois is. Yzerman too. His hands are all over TB. People like to look at the Canes and say 'that's how you do it' but Waddell has also been labeled and idiot for long stretches throughout his career.....I guess Lou as well?

Maybe they are all idiots though. All of them. After all given Philadelphia basically had to pay for Arizona to take Gostisbehere not one other GM found a way to get this stud in their line up. Even Ron Francis who had a clean sheet didn't take him. Astounding.

[neo45]

This offseason was super frustrating. Just a constant stream of really good players we should have been targeting moving for cheap and thinking

“We couldn’t have beat THAT offer?!?”

Followed by a constant stream of underwhelming players being brought in and thinking “management must see something in this guy no one else does”

[neo45]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

That additional 4.5M cap hit next year is a huge anchor to a team already struggling to find the space to keep 3 of their 4 best forwards who need a new contract. Would have been tough to see this team staying in the Eichel sweepstakes if they made this multi year cap commitment.

It would have super devastating long term to miss out on coming second in the Eichel sweepstakes

[dino7c]

With better geography the Flames would have Kadri, Stone, Brown right now.

Tre would likely have a more favorable rating around here

Calgary is a really tough job for a GM. It's not everything but it's certainly a factor.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by neo45

It would have super devastating long term to miss out on coming second in the Eichel sweepstakes

What are you talking about? Not talking about a second sweepstakes. Just pointing out that a this fairly ridiculous point to nitpick on a cap dump deal that only the worst team in the league who is in clear tank mode was willing to take. Flames top priority was Eichel so they make this deal for a guy who likely in the summer is fighting for a bottom pair spot and paying him more than Rasmus Andersson doesn’t make sense. That would have severely limited their flexibility and I doubt Sutter wanted that player as opposed to bigger leaner guys like Gudbransen and Zadorov

[Cobra]

Originally Posted by dino7c

With better geography the Flames would have Kadri, Stone, Brown right now.

Tre would likely have a more favorable rating around here

Calgary is a really tough job for a GM. It's not everything but it's certainly a factor.

I think by adding Zadorov, Pitlick, Lewis and Richardson.
Keeping the core intact.
Possibly letting Gaudreau walk for nothing.
He should win Executive of the year.

His own Coach is begging for help.
But keep defending him....

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Cobra

I think by adding Zadorov, Pitlick, Lewis and Richardson.
Keeping the core intact.
Possibly letting Gaudreau walk for nothing.
He should win Executive of the year.

His own Coach is begging for help.
But keep defending him....

He is? That’s strange. Why would Sutter be ‘begging for help’? He took the job less than a year ago. He knew what he was getting into and I doubt he needed the job.

[Vinny01]

I think Trelviing is absolutely in a spot where he could be fired. Johnny walks no doubt he should be shown the door. Another playoff miss or embarrassing first round exit I think he should be gone. Because this team is on a losing streak we shouldn’t be bringing up trades that worked out for other teams in hindsight that made no sense for the Flames at the time. Richardson, and Lewis, and Gudbransen are almost certainly here because Darryl requested it.

This team is second in points % in the division despite playing 2/3 of their games on the road. The season is still going extremely well. Secondary scoring is the biggest need and hopefully they can address it

[neo45]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

I think Trelviing is absolutely in a spot where he could be fired. Johnny walks no doubt he should be shown the door. Another playoff miss or embarrassing first round exit I think he should be gone. Because this team is on a losing streak we shouldn’t be bringing up trades that worked out for other teams in hindsight that made no sense for the Flames at the time. Richardson, and Lewis, and Gudbransen are almost certainly here because Darryl requested it.

This team is second in points % in the division despite playing 2/3 of their games on the road. The season is still going extremely well. Secondary scoring is the biggest need and hopefully they can address it

They are 14th in the league in points percentage are and 3-6-1 in their last 10

If things are going “extremely well” in your eyes it’s only because you’ve been conditioned to expect such mediocrity that anything that’s a shade above it is considered unbridled success

This season has been OK. 42% of the league is doing better than us right now. Absolutely nothing to hang your hat on

[chedder]

^ This. If Gaudreau isn't re-signed and Tkachuk isn't either re-signed or traded for a haul, Treliving better be shown the door.

If the Flames fizzle in the playoffs again, he should be canned no matter what happens with Johnny and Matthew.

If both players are gone it's going to be one ugly rebuild.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by neo45

They are 14th in the league in points percentage are and 3-6-1 in their last 10

If things are going “extremely well” in your eyes it’s only because you’ve been conditioned to expect such mediocrity that anything that’s a shade above it is considered unbridled success

This season has been OK. 42% of the league is doing better than us right now. Absolutely nothing to hang your hat on

They were 2nd in the west in points percentage before the covid stuff and things are still tight. They have also played 11 home games and 22 road.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by neo45

They are 14th in the league in points percentage are and 3-6-1 in their last 10

If things are going “extremely well” in your eyes it’s only because you’ve been conditioned to expect such mediocrity that anything that’s a shade above it is considered unbridled success

This season has been OK. 42% of the league is doing better than us right now. Absolutely nothing to hang your hat on

This season has been good because I expected them to be far worse. 14th in points % playing more road games than any team in the league. Dig a little deeper to find a positive you don’t have to go far.

I didn’t have this team in a spot to be opening the playoffs at home before this season started. Flames win their games in hand they will be 3 pts up on Vegas.

But hey way more fun to live life looking at things negatively.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Cobra

I think by adding Zadorov, Pitlick, Lewis and Richardson.
Keeping the core intact.
Possibly letting Gaudreau walk for nothing.
He should win Executive of the year.

His own Coach is begging for help.
But keep defending him....

You must be new to Sutter, he has talked the same way about every team he has ever coached. Basically we don't have the talent so we better outwork the other team

[Snuffleupagus]

Since this is a rumor thread can I post one?

Mostly smoke but rumblings are Calgary is sniffing around Giroux.