Matthew Tkachuk & Johnny Gaudreau Signing Watch Thread

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

In my 20ish years on this board I have found plenty of it. And I don't view passion and thoughtfulness to be mutually exclusive at all.

Passion clouds logic and enforces bias. We all see things through our own lense. You are way more likely to accept what you ordinarily wouldn't if the message is what you believe in the first place.

[kyuss275]

I also wonder how having the arena deal fall through affects Johnny’s thinking? I know some posters feel that a new state of the art facility is not a big deal , but I can guarantee some players feel differently. I have read many articles over time , in a wide variety of sports, that have players and management saying that new player facilities played a small factor on signing with said team.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

I get that you don't like the idea of fans being negative about the team. I don't feel I'm really being negative though. This is just predictable based on 30 years of following this team. I used to give them the benefit of the doubt, used to think the flames would see their day. The culture of losing and bad management has poisoned me I guess? Now they finally look good for one pandemic season and I can see the car going over the cliff in a few months. Oh, and now the team relocating is a possibility? It's like some sort of comedic tragedy. Winning in the forum really did curse this franchise.

Maybe I was being an ass? Not any more than some of the smarmy responses from lots of positive pete's dismissing people like me though. Just different sides. Just as people like me rile you up, people like TOfan and dissentowner rile others up. No right side here, despite you wanting to be the voice of reason constantly.

Some people like to point out negatives and will even bring up past history, I get that; Just the other day, a handful of posters assumed Backlund was being punished for poor play and a bunch of negative responses followed. It wasn't until Sutter's comments that things were cleared up. All those negative comments turned out to be just that, a bunch of negative comments. We honestly don't know the situation with Johnny but despite a lot of possibilities, I feel hopeful he wants to stay I gave my reasons and to me, that is better than worst-case scenario's.

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

I also wonder how having the arena deal fall through affects Johnny’s thinking? I know some posters feel that a new state of the art facility is not a big deal , but I can guarantee some players feel differently. I have read many articles over time , in a wide variety of sports, that have players and management saying that new player facilities played a small factor on signing with said team.

A factor for sure imo. Players want a secure situation, respectable ownership and great facilities. Can't check any of those boxes right now

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by DazzlinDino

Some people like to point out negatives and will even bring up past history, I get that; Just the other day, a handful of posters assumed Backlund was being punished for poor play and a bunch of negative responses followed. It wasn't until Sutter's comments that things were cleared up. All those negative comments turned out to be just that, a bunch of negative comments. We honestly don't know the situation with Johnny but despite a lot of possibilities, I feel hopeful he wants to stay I gave my reasons and to me, that is better than worst-case scenario's.

We are at opposing view points. I'm disillusioned, you believe things aren't that bad and could/will get better. Honestly, your POV is a happier place to be. I wish I could be there, I really do.

[dissentowner]

I was wondering where the Negative Nancy's of the board were going to hang out if the team was successful and the PGT was no fun for them. Here it is, the Johnny is going to leave for nothing plot to keep things miserable. If Johnny signs I am sure they will immediately move on to Tkachuk leaving.

[Strange Brew]

I have been consistently critical of Treliving and I remain of the belief that he is a best an average GM that isn't able to get things done to the extent needed to build a contender.

But that said, I'm not going to jump on the "he should have done this" train because I really have no idea what he has or hasn't offered, what the state of negotiations are etc.

What I am sure of is that the club is now in a very difficult place on the JG front. Can't possibly trade him and he holds all of the cards. I just hope there is reason to believe he and the club can work out a reasonable deal.

Hopefully Treliving let it get to this point because he has been happy with how negotiations are going.

BTW, you are also seeing the advantage of having players in a contract year. They tend to overperform.

If Tkachuk signs his QO, you could have him and Monahan playing for new contacts next year.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

'Voice of reason' wasn't a personal shot

Now try it with "constantly" at the end.

Different ring.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

We are at opposing view points. I'm disillusioned, you believe things aren't that bad and could/will get better. Honestly, your POV is a happier place to be. I wish I could be there, I really do.

When I was 2 1/2 years old I contracted meningitis, lost my ability to walk and talk, and had to learn all over again, I also lost all hearing in my left ear.. Growing up I walked funny, had trouble with speech so I worked on my walking, and my speech improved with focus and hard work. At age 21 I woke up and had lost hearing in my right ear and became completely deaf overnight. Despite all those odds I still went to college and accomplished myself; I learned sign language and can lipread. I did this, despite being told constantly what I can't, couldn't do. People will always look for worst-case scenarios. My point is you can choose to be negative or you can look at life, problems and challenges as a stepping stone. Being negative even if you are wrong in the end only causes people to doubt and breeds more of the same attitudes. I can be critical at times but overall I would rather enjoy the Flames and look at the positives. Johnny hasn't said he doesn't want to stay he actually went as far as to say that he has never told anyone he didn't want to stay. So let's give him the benefit and for some reason, he doesn't let's be happy for him he has given us something to cheer for through the hard times! Yeah do I believe things are not that bad

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Now try it with "constantly" at the end.



Different ring.

Fair enough. Sorry about that.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I was wondering where the Negative Nancy's of the board were going to hang out if the team was successful and the PGT was no fun for them. Here it is, the Johnny is going to leave for nothing plot to keep things miserable. If Johnny signs I am sure they will immediately move on to Tkachuk leaving.

I don’t think it’s negative to be concerned about asset management. Are you not in another thread saying how terrible Monahan is? Wouldn’t that also classify as a “ negative Nancy”?

[DoubleK]

Are the 5 teams on Johnny's list public?

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

I don’t think it’s negative to be concerned about asset management. Are you not in another thread saying how terrible Monahan is? Wouldn’t that also classify as a “ negative Nancy”?

No, that would classify as a fact.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by DazzlinDino

When I was 2 1/2 years old I contracted meningitis, lost my ability to walk and talk, and had to learn all over again, I also lost all hearing in my left ear.. Growing up I walked funny, had trouble with speech so I worked on my walking, and my speech improved with focus and hard work. At age 21 I woke up and had lost hearing in my right ear and became completely deaf overnight. Despite all those odds I still went to college and accomplished myself; I learned sign language and can lipread. I did this, despite being told constantly what I can't, couldn't do. People will always look for worst-case scenarios. My point is you can choose to be negative or you can look at life, problems and challenges as a stepping stone. Being negative even if you are wrong in the end only causes people to doubt and breeds more of the same attitudes. I can be critical at times but overall I would rather enjoy the Flames and look at the positives. Johnny hasn't said he doesn't want to stay he actually went as far as to say that he has never told anyone he didn't want to stay. So let's give him the benefit and for some reason, he doesn't let's be happy for him he has given us something to cheer for through the hard times! Yeah do I believe things are not that bad

Good for you man.

Love perseverance stories like that.

I haven't had those types of challenges but I do get the overall point ... losing my mom when I was 18 and having a cancer fight that could have ended me certainly changes my perspective on life.

I hope they sign Gaudreau to a reasonable contract, and I understand the worry that they won't. I just don't like those that try to remove hope from any discussion. Hope has had a huge impact in getting me to today.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

No, that would classify as a fact.

Haha. I quite like your answer.

[Erick Estrada]

I don't think this has anything to do with a bounce back season. It's pretty clear Johnny never lost it and that Monahan was bringing down his game. You could see it at the end of last season once Darryl broke them up as he hasn't missed a beat. If the GM doesn't know his own guy after having him spend his entire pro career under your organization enough to judge his worth we have to assume in Treliving's opinion it wasn't worth giving him an 8 year deal or whatever was being asked. Not to mention Gaudreau's ask would have been likely lower than it will be now. It feels to me like this has been mishandled pretty badly.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

I get that you don't like the idea of fans being negative about the team. I don't feel I'm really being negative though. This is just predictable based on 30 years of following this team. I used to give them the benefit of the doubt, used to think the flames would see their day. The culture of losing and bad management has poisoned me I guess? Now they finally look good for one pandemic season and I can see the car going over the cliff in a few months. Oh, and now the team relocating is a possibility? It's like some sort of comedic tragedy. Winning in the forum really did curse this franchise.

Maybe I was being an ass? Not any more than some of the smarmy responses from lots of positive pete's dismissing people like me though. Just different sides. Just as people like me rile you up, people like TOfan and dissentowner rile others up. No right side here, despite you wanting to be the voice of reason constantly.

Totally. I love riling people up with my wild takes of ‘Treliving isn’t an idiot’. That’s some outside the box thinking there, isn’t it?

What’s the point in posting, man? To wallow in your pessimism with other like minded rock kickers? Let everyone know how dumb the Flames are and how smart you are? Mental health is a thing. If you’re this down trodden about something that should be a distraction or something for you to enjoy then what is it bringing to your life other than something to complain endlessly about? To what end? Tell a therapist, not CP.

You are right though there are two ways to view things. Being pessimistic, your stand point, is easy. Any potato can do that. Taking the 10,000 foot view of something you have no first hand knowledge of and calling the people involved idiots or incompetent makes me question who the idiot is.

Pretty sure Treliving has considered each of his options and done the risk analysis. Wouldn’t you have if you were in his shoes?

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I don't think this has anything to do with a bounce back season. It's pretty clear Johnny never lost it and that Monahan was bringing down his game. You could see it at the end of last season once Darryl broke them up as he hasn't missed a beat. If the GM doesn't know his own guy after having him spend his entire pro career under your organization enough to judge his worth we have to assume in Treliving's opinion it wasn't worth giving him an 8 year deal or whatever was being asked. Not to mention Gaudreau's ask would have been likely lower than it will be now. It feels to me like this has been mishandled pretty badly.

I don't think it's that simple.

Sutter is the difference but it's not all Monahan.

Gaudreau is now playing fast Sutter hockey and he's done away with the button hook perimeter play that the league had figured out.

Having Lindholm over Monahan has to help Gaudreau to be his best self, but he wasn't firing on all cylinders individually either.

[Flamesfan05]

Treliving was/is in a very tough spot. Sign him to a bad contract you lose. Don’t sign him and he is having a career year you lose.

But I don’t feel sorry for him, he got paid good to make the decision.

And I also disagree that he couldn’t sign him. Everyone has a price.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Treliving was/is in a very tough spot. Sign him to a bad contract you lose. Don’t sign him and he is having a career year you lose.

But I don’t feel sorry for him, he got paid good to make the decision.

And I also disagree that he couldn’t sign him. Everyone has a price.

Could be a mutual agreement between them we don't know yet. Could be that Johnny told Tre that he wants to prove himself to show he is worth a bigger, better contract but actually wants to stay. On the ice, Johnny acts like he is happy playing with his team and his line-mates. They are feeding off each other like they are really close. Even Matt in his interview was commenting on how close the team was. The opportunity to prove his worth as JG is doing now might be the opportunity he was given to justify a good payday.

I know people get concerned, you just have to go back to Johnny's last contract to see all the over-the-top comments regarding Johnny and Treliving not having a contract signed. I am thankful that the board's posting has improved as it was unbearable during that last contract. That Gaudreauovertime poster was a very negative catalyst on the forum. Most posters these days, although not always agreeing have matured and are quite rational.