New Zealand to make it illegal for kids to buy cigarettes — for life

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Maritime Q-Scout

That's literally the exact thing they're doing.

How so?

[The Yen Man]

Originally Posted by Maritime Q-Scout

That's literally the exact thing they're doing.

So rather than phase it out in say 2030 or 2040, they'll continue to allow shops to sell it up to 2073, or whenever the oldest person who's still legal to buy smokes dies? Seems like such a convoluted way to do it.

But I guess you don't really know how it will play out till you try it. So I'm not knocking on NZ for trying it this way. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

How so?

Eventually everyone allowed to buy them will be dead, and then it will be illegal for everyone to buy them.

[The Fisher Account]

Proactive governments are looking at the future decades of exponential health care costs and the smart ones will nip dumb crap like smoking in the bud. Kudos NZ.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

So rather than phase it out in say 2030 or 2040, they'll continue to allow shops to sell it up to 2073, or whenever the oldest person who's still legal to buy smokes dies? Seems like such a convoluted way to do it.

But I guess you don't really know how it will play out till you try it. So I'm not knocking on NZ for trying it this way. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out.

Yeah, but at some point the number of people who what smokes will dwindle down low enough that no one will bother carrying smokes.

You don't have to wait until the last person who is old enough to smoke dies for cigarettes to be completely gone, you just have to wait until they're no longer profitiable.

I really like this plan by NZ. I've been saying for a long time the way to go about getting rid of smoking is to just raise the legal smoking age by 1 year every year. Which is exactly what this is. Banning outright is a big shock to lot of groups, smokers, tabaco companies, farmers, and governments who take in the taxes.

Phasing it out like this seems like a good way to eliminate the problem and wean everyone off, which lesses the shock on everyone.

Add in the fact that fewer young people are starting to smoke anyway, and this likely gets rid of smoking a lot quicker than it seems it should.

[Matata]

nmd

[Fuzz]

Unless you are, what, 8 years old and a prospective NZ smoker, this should have zero negative impacts on your life. I don't even know how anyone, anywhere could be upset about this.

[Locke]

So...another question is: They've made them illegal to buy.

But what if you're out and about and you see a 10 year old smoking in the town square? Perhaps he didnt purchase that cigarette and thus infringed upon no laws?

Are there going to be Goon-Squads roaming about enforcing a smoking prohibition among the Kiwi youth?

I could see so many opportunities for workarounds here. But thats not really the point, its a step in the direction that they clearly want to take and if thats what they as a voting populace wants I guess thats fine.

I do find it funny that for their arbitrary age they picked a group who are unable to vote and wont be of voting age for at least another whole Government cycle.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Unless you are, what, 8 years old and a prospective NZ smoker, this should have zero negative impacts on your life. I don't even know how anyone, anywhere could be upset about this.

Seems like going backwards though. People that want to smoke will still find ways to attain it and now it's just going to go through non-legal channels which means police forces will have another thing on their plate to deal with and taxes made of cigarette sales will be lost to private tobacco entrepreneurs under the table.

[Roger]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Seems like going backwards though. People that want to smoke will still find ways to attain it and now it's just going to go through non-legal channels which means police forces will have another thing on their plate to deal with and taxes made of cigarette sales will be lost to private tobacco entrepreneurs under the table.

So then let's just do nothing at all.

Just like phasing out leaded gasoline, at least they're doing something. What's your solution? Do nothing because some people will find a way around it? Brilliant. Never thought of that.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Unless you are, what, 8 years old and a prospective NZ smoker, this should have zero negative impacts on your life. I don't even know how anyone, anywhere could be upset about this.

Do you feel the same about smoking weed? I don't use either (and dislike being around both) so have no real horse in the race... it just seems a touch odd for people to be ok with the legalization of one type of plant, but be ok with the banning of another.

[Roger]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Do you feel the same about smoking weed?

I don't use either (and dislike being around both) so have no real horse in the race... it just seems a touch odd to push for the legalization of one type of plant, but be ok with the banning of another.

Weed has medicinal uses as well as recreational uses. It can also be consumed smoke-free. Just like nicotine, in the form of vaping. The actual inhaling of smoke is the worst part of smoking. Nobody's making New Zealanders that currently smoke quit, they're just proposing to not allow new ones to start. How is this a bad idea? Nobody's rights are being trampled, they're just taking away the most destructive and useless habit in the history of humanity. As a guy who smoked for 27 years, this has my full admiration, and I hope Canada does the same thing.

If you really want to get addicted to nicotine, go get a vape. Comparing it to weed or alcohol is not even close to the same thing, as those products actually give you something in return for the harm you're doing to your body, and taken in moderation, they're perfectly fine to use. Cigarettes are designed for one thing: get you addicted and consume, consume, consume.

[PepsiFree]

I find the notion that this will create a cigarette black market completely hilarious. But to the point, this is the wrong direction. They should legalise all drugs.

[Envitro]

People that think that banning things makes those things go away are living in a fantasy land.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Envitro

People that think that banning things makes those things go away are living in a fantasy land.

Yeah, its kind of cute in its own way.

"Historically this has never worked for anyone and consistently backfired spectacularly...but maybe it'll work for us this time!"

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

great news. Now will they do the same for alchohol? what about fast food? How about limiting cars to no faster than the maximum speed limit inside of the NZ (maybe 100 kph)? How about a mandatory exercise regime?

seems like a good idea on the surface, but it also takes rights away and i find that a little uncomfortable

Well New Zealand is the first country likely to go that route considering how they think they can accomplish zero COVID.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

I find the notion that this will create a cigarette black market completely hilarious. But to the point, this is the wrong direction. They should legalise all drugs.

Even with cigarettes being legal, there is still a black market for cheap untaxed cigarettes.

I think a law like this would be difficult to implement in Canada. We have a pretty porous border with the U.S. and it would absolutely never fly there. Tobacco is still a fundamental part of their economy, not to mention the backlash it would have on the right wing libertarian crowd. It would be seen as an attack on the south.

Tobacco use is also considered part of the culture for some Indigenous Peoples in Canada, so there would be an easy conduit for cigarettes to make their way into Canada that way.

New Zealand benefits a lot from being islands with no land borders.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Roger

So then let's just do nothing at all.

Just like phasing out leaded gasoline, at least they're doing something. What's your solution? Do nothing because some people will find a way around it? Brilliant. Never thought of that.

Smoking is being phased out already. Barely anyone smokes now compared to only a few decades ago. All "something" does is create illegal supply chains and more criminal activity.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Unless you are, what, 8 years old and a prospective NZ smoker, this should have zero negative impacts on your life. I don't even know how anyone, anywhere could be upset about this.

Higher taxes on cigarettes will only push more smokers to the black market, and lead to more money for organized crime groups, the National Coalition Against Contraband Tobacco (NCACT) said.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/thund...ttes-1.5995075

Banning them will create an even bigger black market.

We already know how to reduce smoking rates. With time and more dedicated resources, there is no reason we can't further decrease the cost on society.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

I find the notion that this will create a cigarette black market completely hilarious. But to the point, this is the wrong direction. They should legalise all drugs.

You do realize the black market for cigarettes is thriving because of higher taxes?