Brad Treliving needs to go

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

From the time the Sharks acquired 26 year old Joe Thornton, they won 16 playoff rounds. In total, they have 19 playoff rounds won this century.

They went to the Conference Finals five times, made one finals appearance.

It doesn’t matter that they didn’t cash one in - that sort of sustained success is unheard of.

This is hard. You wouldn’t take San Jose 2.0 for the next 15 years?

1 cup would be better but I am talking SJ after Karlsson...You are acting like Eichel being better than ever when he comes back is a given

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Again, not my point, but you be you.

I get your point - but the Lightning aren’t special. The same thing happened to Chicago, as it did to LA, as it did to Pittsburgh.

It’s what happens when you win multiple titles.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

From the time the Sharks acquired 26 year old Joe Thornton, they won 16 playoff rounds. In total, they have 19 playoff rounds won this century.

They went to the Conference Finals five times, made one finals appearance.

It doesn’t matter that they didn’t cash one in - that sort of sustained success is unheard of.

This is hard. You wouldn’t take San Jose 2.0 for the next 15 years?

The Golden Knights don't remind me of the Sharks when they acquired Thornton, and anyway Eichel is no Thornton.

They do rather remind me of the Sharks when they brought in Erik Karlsson and his magic disappearing foot in an attempt to keep their window open a little longer. The first year they finished 2nd in the Pacific and made the third round. The following two years: 8th in Pacific, 7th in West.

I don't see how a damaged Eichel at a huge salary is going to make up for an aging roster, a depleted prospect pool, and a looming deadline to slash payroll for cap reasons.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by dino7c

1 cup would be better but I am talking SJ after Karlsson...You are acting like Eichel being better than ever when he comes back is a given

It’s not a given. But it’s a gamble you have to make, because all it cost was Tuch, Krebs, a 1st and a 3rd.

Vegas understands this better than virtually every team in the league, I suspect in no small part because of the nature of that town’s core industry.

If it doesn’t work, it cost them almost nothing but money, and if it does, they have round after round of playoff revenue. Plus they might actually win - they’ve gotten damn close two of their first four years.

Vegas, hate to say it, gets it.

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Such a bad take.

Monahan isn't going to have any trouble getting another NHL contract as long as his health holds up.

He has 4 points in 9 games ... 40 point players aren't on PTOs.

Add in the nine games are after major surgery and he's being walked back slowly and you likely have those numbers improve.

The lynch mob on Monahan is silly.

Sorry man, I call BS. Plenty of players who put up ok numbers on the back of special teams but don’t contribute 5v5 have had to take PTO offers just to stay relevant. Look no further than James Neal for evidence of this.

Monahan is trending far closer in that direction than I think you’re willing to admit.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

It’s not a given. But it’s a gamble you have to make, because all it cost was Tuch, Krebs, a 1st and a 3rd.

Wrong, as usual. That's just part of the acquisition cost. The rest of that cost comes when Vegas has to shed several players to stay under the cap, and then don't have the prospect base to fill out the rest of the roster. The Golden Knights are going full Oiler by stacking the lineup up top with expensive talent. NEVER go full Oiler.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by mrdonkey

Sorry man, I call BS. Plenty of players who put up ok numbers on the back of special teams but don’t contribute 5v5 have had to take PTO offers just to stay relevant. Look no further than James Neal for evidence of this.

Monahan is trending far closer in that direction than I think you’re willing to admit.

James Neal can't skate, and he's way worse defensively than Monahan is.

Call BS until the cows come home, won't change the simple fact that Monahan is still just under a 1/2 point a game despite the surgery and playing on a fourth line.

Production is production.

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by dino7c

You were talking about their past success and now adding Eichel. Past success is irrelevant it's a different team. They won't have any depth. Look at the roster!

You keep parroting this point over and over like teams haven’t found ways to cheat the salary cap before. Vegas will find some baloney loophole to exploit, and they probably already know what it is. Otherwise the trade wouldn’t have been done and we wouldn’t have gotten a salty tears Twitter post from the Flames director of marketing last night. This was all planned.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Wrong, as usual. That's just part of the acquisition cost. The rest of that cost comes when Vegas has to shed several players to stay under the cap, and then don't have the prospect base to fill out the rest of the roster. The Golden Knights are going full Oiler by stacking the lineup up top with expensive talent. NEVER go full Oiler.

Except their top end won't even be as good as the Oilers

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

The Golden Knights don't remind me of the Sharks when they acquired Thornton, and anyway Eichel is no Thornton.

They do rather remind me of the Sharks when they brought in Erik Karlsson and his magic disappearing foot in an attempt to keep their window open a little longer. The first year they finished 2nd in the Pacific and made the third round. The following two years: 8th in Pacific, 7th in West.

I don't see how a damaged Eichel at a huge salary is going to make up for an aging roster, a depleted prospect pool, and a looming deadline to slash payroll for cap reasons.

The Golden Knights have been to a Final and conference final two of the last four years.

When the Sharks acquired Thornton, they had been to the second round and conference finals Where they lost to us.

If anything, they’re ahead of where the Sharks were.

Both are warm-weather desirable markets for talent.

Vegas has no state tax, so like the Lightning, they can give players smaller cap hits for the same real dollars.

Eichel, Karlsson, Stone, And Pietrangelo are all in their primes. Theodore is a stud.

So they have to trade Patches or Marchessault - not a problem so long as the Coyotes remain the league’s dumping ground for awful contracts (until they sign Matthews LMAO).

Nothing is guaranteed.

But the Knights have understood from the moment they were awarded a franchise, you can’t play this game scared, because fortune favours the brave.

Playing it safe and stocking up on picks/prospects? Let the Kraken have fun with that; they’ll be looking up at the rest of the league from the bottom of Peugeot Sound like every other expansion team (except the Blues, and that was different).

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by mrdonkey

You keep parroting this point over and over like teams haven’t found ways to cheat the salary cap before. Vegas will find some baloney loophole to exploit, and they probably already know what it is. O Otherwise the trade wouldn’t have been done and we wouldn’t have gotten a salty tears Twitter post from the Flames director of marketing last night. This was all planned.

And you keep living up to your username

There is no loophole, Vegas already lost their Vezina winner and Tuch. They will be cutting more.

If you think they are going to pull a Kuch GL with that. They are over the cap without Eichel

Vegas has to cut 12M...no, trading one player won't do that

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by dino7c

And you keep living up to your username

There is no loophole, Vegas already lost their Vezina winner and Tuch. They will be cutting more.

If you think they are going to pull a Kuch GL with that. They are over the cap without Eichel

Vegas has to cut 12M...no, trading one player won't do that

Are you dense? The dominoes are already falling to indicate that the Knights are loading up for some “no cap in the playoffs” BS that literally drew salty loser tweets from Flames PR. They’re kicking the can down the road for sure, but for this year their roadmap is clear and evident. And there might be no stopping them if they get away with it.

I’ll take that over 30 years of mediocrity.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by mrdonkey

Are you dense? The dominoes are already falling to indicate that the Knights are loading up for some “no cap in the playoffs” BS that literally drew salty loser tweets from Flames PR. They’re kicking the can down the road for sure, but for this year their roadmap is clear and evident. And there might be no stopping them if they get away with it.

I’ll take that over 30 years of mediocrity.

You are assuming they make the playoffs with their current roster and Eichel is 100% ready to hit the ground running for game one of the playoffs after two years off and spine surgery. You are being irrational.

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by dino7c

You are assuming they make the playoffs with their current roster and Eichel is 100% ready to hit the ground running for game one of the playoffs after two years off and spine surgery. You are being irrational.

I’m looking at a roster in a soft as baby wipes division who is about to load their rocket launcher in the playoffs. Is this so hard to wrap your head around?

For God’s sake the Flames and Oilers are battling it out for the lead. Making the playoffs in the 2021 Pacific division is not in the least bit a challenge.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Wrong, as usual That's just part of the acquisition cost. The rest of that cost comes when Vegas has to shed several players to stay under the cap, and then don't have the prospect base to fill out the rest of the roster. The Golden Knights are going full Oiler by stacking the lineup up top with expensive talent. NEVER go full Oiler.

The Oilers cap is a disaster because they insist on drafting their own picks and filling out their roster via free agency instead of trading those picks for players.

They’ve drafted their own 1st round pick every this century except 2006, when they spent it on Roloson and Damn near won a Cup.

Pittsburgh, meanwhile, drafted two players in the first round after they got Sid who ever raised the mug with them - Staal and Maata. Not a single other 1st round selection contributed anything more than helping them to acquire actual talent. Except Kapanen, though they paid more to bring him back.

Thank God Edmonton hasn’t figured out that Broberg, a 1st and something else would get them John Gibson until 2026 or whenever - they’d rather roll with a 40 year old injury risk and a guy who glitches like a video game when they shoot at his glove.

Or they could sign Rask for nothing but money.

What they’ll likely end up doing is trade for Fleury.

They have 250 points under contract for $20M.

It’s absolute malpractice to fail to build a competitive roster around that.

But enough about the Oilers.

Guys want to play in Vegas, and that’s a market that actually could see players take less to try and win there.

They have a franchise winger, a franchise D (arguably 2) and now a franchise C under contract for four more years after this one. All he needs is a surgery that UFC fighters get.

Their goalie isn’t Fleury, but he’s pretty good. He’s just a bit weird, even for a goalie.

I guess I just don’t understand this mindset that you can win without elite talent.

It’s quite obvious you can’t. You may not win with it, but you’re winning nothing without.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

I get your point - but the Lightning aren’t special. The same thing happened to Chicago, as it did to LA, as it did to Pittsburgh.

It’s what happens when you win multiple titles.

The difference is that Vegas is in cap trouble now. Not after they won the cup. TB wasn’t cap trouble for their first one. They would have been for the second, but the Kucherov injury helped them keep the band together, and they didn’t lose assets in the process. Vegas has only once chance to replicate that, and a lot of things have to happen in order for those stars to align right.

[chedder]

Said it before, but relating to the thread title, what Treliving does with Johnny and Chucky should dictate whether he's fired or not. (Though I would have been happy with him gone over the summer)

Sign them or trade them for something substantial and he might survive. Let them walk or get next to nothing and he better be gone.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by mrdonkey

I’m looking at a roster in a soft as baby wipes division who is about to load their rocket launcher in the playoffs. Is this so hard to wrap your head around?

For God’s sake the Flames and Oilers are battling it out for the lead. Making the playoffs in the 2021 Pacific division is not in the least bit a challenge.

one, don't be an ass

Wrap your head around how likely it is that Eichel doesn't play until game one of the playoffs and is immediately a top player after two years off and spine surgery. Vegas isn't even cap compliant without Eichel and their other guys back. Playoffs won't be as easy as you think.

Also,
Flames are 6-1-2 because they play in the pacific and its soft? That's odd since they have beaten 6 teams not in the division

Oilers beat Vegas

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

The difference is that Vegas is in cap trouble now. Not after they won the cup. TB wasn’t cap trouble for their first one. They would have been for the second, but the Kucherov injury helped them keep the band together, and they didn’t lose assets in the process. Vegas has only once chance to replicate that, and a lot of things have to happen in order for those stars to align right.

Reilly Smith is a UFA this year: -$5M

Patches has one year after this one at $7M - trade him with some modest retention and recoup some picks.

Dadonov is only on a 2 year deal - you can find someone to take him at 1 year $5M.

That’s $15-17M in money gone right there.

None of those players are essential - they’re luxuries.

The core of Eichel, Stone, Karlsson, Marchessault, Pietrangelo, Theodore, and Lehner is locked up, and you build around that for the next five years.

You don’t lose paying for talent. You lose paying replacement players $5.75M or $4.25M with term.

And they still get to make their “$18M over the cap” run this year.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Reilly Smith is a UFA this year: -$5M

Patches has one year after this one at $7M - trade him with some modest retention and recoup some picks.

Dadonov is only on a 2 year deal - you can find someone to take him at 1 year $5M.

That’s $15-17M in money gone right there.

None of those players are essential - they’re luxuries.

The core of Eichel, Stone, Karlsson, Marchessault, Pietrangelo, Theodore, and Lehner is locked up, and you build around that for the next five years.

You don’t lose paying for talent. You lose paying replacement players $5.75M or $4.25M with term.

And they still get to make their “$18M over the cap” run this year.

Patches has been one of their best players...you act like they won't even miss him

Patches and Tuch combined for 84 points in the shortened season last year

Patches was over PPG he wasn't a luxury he was their 2nd leading scorer