2021/2022 Trade Speculation and Rumours

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

So he didn’t impress you last year after being injured in game 6, eh? In light of the fact that he was playing through injuries needing surgery, as it turns out having his hip lock up off of faceoffs, and meanwhile dragging around the corpse of Brett Ritchie? How about that.

Why not consider the information that is well known and freely available, and discuss what is reasonable to expect under those circumstances, rather than completely ignoring them and going off on the player.

People thanked that, too. Yeesh.

This isn’t a one-season blip. Monahan’s play has been declining for a couple of seasons now (from 82 pts in 2018-19 to 48 pts in 2019-20). And he has lacked dimensions to his game beyond sniping since he was paired with Gaudreau, leaving him vulnerable to relegation to the bottom of the depth chart if his scoring touch fails. It’s not as though you can play him on a checking line.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

This isn’t a one-season blip. Monahan’s play has been declining for a couple of seasons now. And he has lacked dimensions to his game beyond sniping since he was paired with Gaudreau, leaving him vulnerable to relegation down the depth chart if his scoring touch fails. It’s not as though you can play him on a checking line.

Declining for a couple of seasons.

Like with the other guy, are we considering it in isolation, or how about some context?

Who else saw their numbers decline from 18-19 to 19-20? Oh, just, you know, Gaudreau, Lindholm, Tkachuk, and Gio

[Vinny01]

So would these be the chips on the able for Eichel?

Monahan+Zadorov (cap purposes, minimal value)
1 of Valimaki or Dube
2 of Zary, Pelletier, Coronato, Wolf
1st round pick
2nd round pick

Maybe that is a bit too much but count me as someone who doesn’t see Monahan carrying much positive value at all. I still feel like Buffalo would need to flip him to a third team and maybe if they are cap it is a low risk/high reward move.

I know the Rangers want a prospect but what if they sent Kratsov to Buffalo for Monahan 50% retained ($3.1875 cap hit)?

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

Declining for a couple of seasons.

Like with the other guy, are we considering it in isolation, or how about some context?

Who else saw their numbers decline from 18-19 to 19-20? Oh, just, you know, Gaudreau, Lindholm, Tkachuk, and Gio

Players decline. It happens. You can look for reasons and excuses for Monahan’s decline all you want. But it doesn’t really matter why at this point. I personally don’t believe Monahan will play top 6 C for the Flames or any other team again. And unless he undergoes a dramatic transformation in his playstyle - including becoming a much better skater at the age of 27 - he’ll have trouble sticking in the bottom 6 as well. If he can regain his scoring touch, he might find a role as a winger and PP specialist.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

So would these be the chips on the able for Eichel?

Monahan+Zadorov (cap purposes, minimal value)
1 of Valimaki or Dube
2 of Zary, Pelletier, Coronato, Wolf
1st round pick
2nd round pick

Maybe that is a bit too much but count me as someone who doesn’t see Monahan carrying much positive value at all. I still feel like Buffalo would need to flip him to a third team and maybe if they are cap it is a low risk/high reward move.

I know the Rangers want a prospect but what if they sent Kratsov to Buffalo for Monahan 50% retained ($3.1875 cap hit)?

That's more than the rumoured "equivalent to 4 first round picks" that no one has been willing to pay.

Valimaki or Dube -> 1st
2 of Zary, Pelletier, Coronato, Wolf -> 2x 1st (Wolf being debatable)
1st = 1st
2nd = 2nd
Monahan + Zadarov are more than a cap dump (say what we may about Monahan, but he's worth at least a couple of 2nd round picks)

This also subtracts far too much from our active roster to have it make any sense (No way Dube is involved).

[keenan87]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Players decline. It happens. You can look for reasons and excuses for Monahan’s decline all you want. But it doesn’t really matter why at this point. I personally don’t believe Monahan will play top 6 C for the Flames or any other team again. And unless he undergoes a dramatic transformation in his playstyle - including becoming a much better skater at the age of 27 - he’ll have trouble sticking in the bottom 6 as well. If he can regain his scoring touch, he might find a role as a winger and PP specialist.

Personally, that's what worries me about Tkachuk as well. He has done very little to improve his skating since coming into the league and feel he will have a steep decline too.

Paying him $9 MM to fight and be an agitator seems like a lot.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Players decline. It happens. You can look for reasons and excuses for Monahan’s decline all you want. But it doesn’t really matter why at this point. I personally don’t believe Monahan will play top 6 C for the Flames or any other team again. And unless he undergoes a dramatic transformation in his playstyle - including becoming a much better skater at the age of 27 - he’ll have trouble sticking in the bottom 6 as well. If he can regain his scoring touch, he might find a role as a winger and PP specialist.

Look for reasons all I want? I don’t have to look, the injury and surgery situation is well documented and understood

I now have visibility in to your opinion, thanks for that, and simply put, I think you’re pretty much wrong, and only time will tell

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

That's more than the rumoured "equivalent to 4 first round picks" that no one has been willing to pay.

Valimaki or Dube -> 1st
2 of Zary, Pelletier, Coronato, Wolf -> 2x 1st (Wolf being debatable)
1st = 1st
2nd = 2nd
Monahan + Zadarov are more than a cap dump (say what we may about Monahan, but he's worth at least a couple of 2nd round picks)

This also subtracts far too much from our active roster to have it make any sense (No way Dube is involved).

When the Venzina Trophy winner was obtained for nothing because he had a $7M cap hit, colour be sceptical that Monny with two years left could currently bring in two second round picks.

Now, if he proves himself healthy, that’s a different matter.


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[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

Look for reasons all I want? I don’t have to look, the injury and surgery situation is well documented and understood

I now have visibility in to your opinion, thanks for that, and simply put, I think you’re pretty much wrong, and only time will tell

Agree. Plus it's worth pointing out that last season, even with his injury, Monahan was just outside the scoring pace for a top 6 centre (we're talking a 3 point difference between solid 2nd line production and what Monahan put up).

The year before he would have qualified as either one of the worst 1st line centres, or one of the very best 2nd line centres in terms of production (again, in a down year).

To say he'll never play top 6 again is completely ridiculous.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Rutuu

For the asset management crowd...how far are we from peak Mangipane? And should we be cashing in to jump start a retool?

JC.

The idea is to ice a competitive team, not to create assets for other teams and run a perpetual rebuild. Mangiapane is 25. The team needs more talent, and he is blossoming into a really good top 6er.

How about we enjoy that as fans for a while?

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

This isn’t a one-season blip. Monahan’s play has been declining for a couple of seasons now (from 82 pts in 2018-19 to 48 pts in 2019-20). And he has lacked dimensions to his game beyond sniping since he was paired with Gaudreau, leaving him vulnerable to relegation to the bottom of the depth chart if his scoring touch fails. It’s not as though you can play him on a checking line.

Very true. Everyone seems to be on the "Monahan was injured last season" bandwagon. But to me, it's specious reasoning as Monahan has been struggling since the second half of his 2018-2019 season. That's roughly 2.5 seasons ago which is not a small sample size.

The opposition has been defending him differently and he hasn't found a way to adjust or evolve yet. I'll give him credit for playing with more aggression and being harder on pucks, but he'll never be a defensive stalwart. So inevitably, producing points will always have to be a part of his game and unfortunately, if he can't do that anymore, then he is no use to this goal challenged team, especially at his current cap hit.

[ComixZone]

Uh…

https://twitter.com/user/status/1452672879594807308

Anyone catch the interview?

[bluejays]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Uh…

https://twitter.com/user/status/1452672879594807308

Anyone catch the interview?

Aka, Source: Conroy

[Jiri Hrdina]

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[MrMike]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Uh…

https://twitter.com/user/status/1452672879594807308

Anyone catch the interview?

It wasn’t much. Saying he still hears Vegas and Calgary, less from Anahiem, thinks the Rangers are out because of Zib, Boston had inquired. Possible that Columbus/Carolina. Vegas still doesn’t want to give up Krebbs. It was a whole lot of nothing really. Same as last week.

[Iginla]

Seems like Treliving has an offer on the table and that's his take it or leave it offer.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

That’s what they’re looking for but they’re not going to get it. They didn’t get it in the summer, when there were more teams bidding and more cap flexility, and they’re not going to get it now that they’re bargaining position is weaker.

It will end up being something along the lines of the Erik Karlsson deal. Karlsson was 28 at the time, a two-time Norris winner who had finished 2nd in Norris voting in each of the previous two seasons. He was coming off a down season due to injury (a season when he still scored 62 points in 71 games) but there was no reason to believe his was in serious long-term decline. He was universally regarded as one of the elite players in the game. And this is the best deal the Sens could get for him:

* 3rd line C (Tierney)

* 3rd pairing D (Demelo)

* Recent 1st round (19 OA) pick (Norris)

* B level prospect (Balcers)

* 2108 1st round pick (coming off a season when the Sharks finshed 10th overall in the standings)

I think the Sabres will get more for Eichel, due to his age and position. But not a whole lot more.

Karlsson was also a deadline deal.


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[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by MrMike

It wasn’t much. Saying he still hears Vegas and Calgary, less from Anahiem, thinks the Rangers are out because of Zib, Boston had inquired. Possible that Columbus/Carolina. Vegas still doesn’t want to give up Krebbs. It was a whole lot of nothing really. Same as last week.

I choose to ignore this rather passive take, and will instead get riled up into an absolute frenzy.

[Heavy Jack]

At this point, with all the smoke seemingly surrounding the Flames and Eichel and from guys who are plugged in, I will be supremely disappointed if we don’t land him.

[joejoe3]

Originally Posted by Iginla

Seems like Treliving has an offer on the table and that's his take it or leave it offer.