2021/2022 Trade Speculation and Rumours

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Yep.

From the Flames side of things there'd need to be some salary cap exchanged (unless they go Kucherov with the situation, which is also not crazy), but there's a clearly a deal to be made as almost every insider has the Flames (and Ducks/Knights) as the teams in it.

Just to be able to see a 1-2 punch of Eichel-Lindholm down the middle. It'd be so magnificent.

Even if Eichel plays before the playoffs it still buys the team plenty of time to move salary during the season. If Monahan ends up being the odd man out, he is still a multiple 25-goal scorer who is under 27-years old, and in a down year. Monahan is one of several very valuable, expendable commodities the Flames have that can be moved.

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[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Who's gutting the entire team? The Eichel deal will be mostly futures.

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As long as we come out of the deal with:

6F
Gaudreau
Eichel
Tkachuk
Lindholm
Mangiapane
Backlund

4D:
Hanifin
Andersson
Kylington
Tanev

All other bodies and prospects IMO are fair game.

Though Coleman makes more sense for us than for them given his age.

And I'm pretty excited about Coronato, but if they insist, then you make the move.

The only asset I'd be a bit wary about including is an unprotected 1st in the next two years, on the off-chance we win a lottery for Shane Wright or Connor Bedard. Just lottery-protect any draft picks.

[Textcritic]

I think I would do the deal even without lottery protection. This team is going to be nowhere near bottom-five bad, and the chances of winning a top-three pick are practically infinitesimally small.

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[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I think I would do the deal even without lottery protection. This team is going to be nowhere near bottom-five bad, and the chances of winning a top-thrre pick are practically infinitesimal.

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The odds don't matter. If they're non-zero you don't do it.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

The odds don't matter. If they're non-zero you don't do it.

If it is the breaking point you do it.

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[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

If it is the breaking point you do it.

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Not as long as there is a non-zero risk to Eichel's health.

[Jiri Hrdina]

I can't see the Sabres going for a deal from the Flames that has lottery protection for picks. Otherwise what's the point for them? The rest of the pieces from the Flames aren't good enough. You have to give up something of value.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

The odds don't matter. If they're non-zero you don't do it.

I disagree with this.

I think you're undervaluing Eichel. If the Flames are making the deal, they're confident in Eichel's ability to heal and get back to it. If they weren't confident, they wouldn't be in it - because even if it is a protected 1st, it'd just slide to 2023 and the team wouldn't be any better next season given the $10M they have committed to a then broken Jack Eichel.

Also, it's a bidding war between what looks like three divisional rivals. The Flames unprotected 1st may be one of the more enticing pieces because of the (minor) chance that they crumble.

Getting hung up on a protected 1st is just being entirely too conservative when you're making a move to push this team out of the mushy middle to the top. You have to be bold.

Also, if it is in fact Anaheim/Calgary/Vegas as the final three teams standing and Treliving is serious about having this team compete with this group, then we effectively have to win this bidding war. If Anaheim gets Eichel, I'd put Anaheim ahead of Calgary as soon as this season (and definitely next season), and if Vegas gets him then how can this team expect to go toe to toe with them at any point in the near future?

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

As long as we come out of the deal with:

6F
Gaudreau
Eichel
Tkachuk
Lindholm
Mangiapane
Backlund

4D:
Hanifin
Andersson
Kylington
Tanev

All other bodies and prospects IMO are fair game.

Though Coleman makes more sense for us than for them given his age.

And I'm pretty excited about Coronato, but if they insist, then you make the move.

The only asset I'd be a bit wary about including is an unprotected 1st in the next two years, on the off-chance we win a lottery for Shane Wright or Connor Bedard. Just lottery-protect any draft picks.

So the deal you are proposing is Monahan, Dube, Valimaki, and prospects or picks.

That is a significant hit to the team from a depth perspective. Do the Flames have the horses in the minors to make up for the loss? Are there any free agents out there they can sign for cheap to make up for the loss? Or is there a second trade where the Flames give up one player for multiple assets in return (Tkachuk to St. Louis for example)?

If they trade three roster players for Eichel, who will be possibly out for the season, they are throwing the towel in on 2021-22. Without the depth, they're in trouble. If we were further along in the development of Pelletier and Zary, I might be more inclined to take the gamble. It is a really tough decision.

[Bingo]

Interesting to see Pelletier off to a 5 points in 4 games AHL start. Really small sample size, but maybe that gets Buffalo thinking a bit.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Interesting to see Pelletier off to a 5 points in 4 games AHL start. Really small sample size, but maybe that gets Buffalo thinking a bit.

I'm not sure if he or Zary move the needle much for the Sabres. In isolation Pelletier looks like he has solid middle six potential and Zary maybe top 6 but neither are upper tier prospects you want in a return for an elite player. I have to imagine the Sabres are looking for top tier prospecs combined with draft picks and the Flames really don't have that in their prospect base.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I'm not sure if he or Zary move the needle much for the Sabres. In isolation Pelletier looks like he has solid middle six potential and Zary maybe top 6 but neither are upper tier prospects. If I was the GM I would be looking for top tier prospecs combined with draft picks.

Well yeah we've all known all of that for months.

I'm not suggesting he's a top prospect, or becoming a top prospect.

I'm just saying if you're humming and hawwing on a package and Pelletier looks to be adjusting to the AHL very quickly it can't be a bad thing.

And given we keep hearing that the teams with the blue chips aren't biting, it could become a factor. Certainly better than a face plant at the pro level.

[Macindoc]

With the Flames’ fortunes, I can just imagine the disastrous scenarios that could emerge from trading for Eichel. Just envision a trade of Tkachuk, Coronato, and the next two unprotected firsts for Eichel. He has his surgery but sustains some nerve damage affecting the dexterity of his hands. He’s healthy enough to play and is no longer a sniper but instead a $10M bottom 6 player. Without Tkachuk or any top 6 RW on the club, and other teams totally keying on Lindholm and Gaudreau, the Flames finish bottom 3 and win the draft lottery, giving the first overall pick to Buffalo. Flames can’t make any off-season deals due to being in salary cap hell, and end up winning the next draft lottery as well, giving Buffalo its second first overall in two years. With only Zary, Pelletier, and maybe Wolf having any chance of making the NHL, once they have made the jump, the prospect pipeline is dry for three years and the team spends another three years being in the bottom five, and can’t even start a rebuild until Eichel’s contract is up.

I know, it all sounds unlikely, but it’s the Flames we’re discussing, and if any team could have a misfortune such as this, it’s the Flames.

[browntrout]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I think I would do the deal even without lottery protection. This team is going to be nowhere near bottom-five bad, and the chances of winning a top-three pick are practically infinitesimally small.

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Remember harmonic

[Strange Brew]

Eichel and Hamonic are so different. A trade for eichel is a swing for the fences kind of deal and if removing contingencies and lottery protection get the deal done, then I do it.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by browntrout

Remember harmonic

What about it? It was unprotected but had but a slim chance to win the lottery even if they fell out of the POs (which happened) since they’d be only just out. And it didn’t win.

And IIRC the rules are even stiffer now.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I'm not sure if he or Zary move the needle much for the Sabres. In isolation Pelletier looks like he has solid middle six potential and Zary maybe top 6 but neither are upper tier prospects you want in a return for an elite player. I have to imagine the Sabres are looking for top tier prospecs combined with draft picks and the Flames really don't have that in their prospect base.

I don't think they are getting top tier prospects. So far Anaheim has reportedly balked at including Zegras, Drysdale or McTavish. Vegas has balked at including Krebs. So you when enter the next tier of prospects they are relatively similar to what the Flames would offer. If one of those teams puts on of their best prospects on the table, it's going to be tough for the Flames to counter.

Which is why I think it comes down to which team is willing to include a 1st (or multiple 1sts) and if there is any level of protection attached to those. An unprotected 1st becomes the most important part of the deal for Buffalo.

[kehatch]

If a team was willing to give up a AAA prospect for Eichel the deal would have been done already.

Buffalo is in a tight spot. The teams that would be interested don't have cap space and don't want to give up high priced talent for a player that won't play most of the season. Add in the surgery risk and long term contract and there is a short list of teams that can or would make a deal.

The LTIR gives them some options, but there still aren't many good ones, and I expect that will be reflected in the price they get back.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by browntrout

Remember harmonic

I don’t think that changes anything from a Flames perspective. If the Flames are intent on acquiring Eichel, and it seems like they are, they’re going to have to take some risk. Just because it kind of (not really) bit them once before should not deter them from being bold as doing what needs to be done to improve the team.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by kehatch

If a team was willing to give up a AAA prospect for Eichel the deal would have been done already.

Buffalo is in a tight spot. The teams that would be interested don't have cap space and don't want to give up high priced talent for a player that won't play most of the season. Add in the surgery risk and long term contract and there is a short list of teams that can or would make a deal.

The LTIR gives them some options, but there still aren't many good ones, and I expect that will be reflected in the price they get back.

Agreed. If Buffalo could have gotten Lafreniere, Byfield, Zegras, Drysdale, or a top 3-5 pick at last years draft, I would wager the deal would have been done by now.