With Bennett I truly think he felt helpless at the end. If the team is giving you sporadic chances to play big minutes with no true intention of wanting to succeed, it’s hard to play hard when you get the sense that the team doubts you. Florida seems to have said they don’t care about his past and they want him to run with it. So much of sports is psychological. If they put him in a positive headspace and they’re truly hoping he succeeds, it seems to have worked. The Flames really didn’t give him good looks and the results show. Whatever they’re doing seems to work. Treliving should be commended on the return he got because it was good based on the lack of production. Would be nice to have this Bennett for the second line right now.
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Bennett should have been in our top-six all along.
Gulutzan should have made Bennett - Backlund - Tkachuk the line.
Peters should have made Gaudreau - Monahan - Bennett the line.
Ward should have made Lucic - Bennett - Dube the line and then Gaudreau - Bennett - ? after Monahan got injured.
They didn't. They backed veterans and reveled in their own stupidity (and they all earned their dismissals), and now the Flames have traded away a 24/25 year old #2 centreman who is going to have a better season than both Backlund and Monahan.
I can see the argument around a Backlund line. Except Chucky clearly plays better on LW (and so does Bennett when he’s a winger). But Peters breaking up the Gatorade line, that was absolutely killing it, just in order to see if Bennett could improve is asking a lot. Plus, half of the “Bennett was mistreated” crowd argues that he needed to be a centre. You can debate them if you want.
What the Flames did try was putting him together with another first round pick and a guy who scored 20 every year.
In any event, none of those linemates are anywhere near as optimal for Bennett as Huberdeau. On the Flames, Lindholm actually comes closest. Or, later, Mangiapane.
With Bennett I truly think he felt helpless at the end. If the team is giving you sporadic chances to play big minutes with no true intention of wanting to succeed, it’s hard to play hard when you get the sense that the team doubts you. Florida seems to have said they don’t care about his past and they want him to run with it. So much of sports is psychological. If they put him in a positive headspace and they’re truly hoping he succeeds, it seems to have worked. The Flames really didn’t give him good looks and the results show. Whatever they’re doing seems to work. Treliving should be commended on the return he got because it was good based on the lack of production. Would be nice to have this Bennett for the second line right now.
The same problem still exists with the Flames today - the team does not have a dominant, puck possession center, which puts too much of the weight on the wingers to create scoring chances and ultimately score more goals.
Monahan is just complete garbage that brings nothing to the team and Lindholm, like him or not, would be far better suited to the 2C role or top line wing on a very good team. Eichel is a lifeline to salvage this mess if he can be acquired and gets healthy, but otherwise you're going to have players that can never fully hit their max output based on this teams current configuration.
You suck BT.
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You already had Gaudreau-Monahan as your LW-C pair at that time, Frolik and Backlund had shown good chemistry previously....it would have made sense to try to put together Tkachuk and Bennett as a pair. Instead they paired Bennett with Versteeg and Brouwer and blamed the lines struggles on him not being capable at center. The next year Bennett-Janko-Hathaway was great, and Bennett had become a full time LW.
The same problem still exists with the Flames today - the team does not have a dominant, puck possession center, which puts too much of the weight on the wingers to create scoring chances and ultimately score more goals.
Monahan is just complete garbage that brings nothing to the team and Lindholm, like him or not, would be far better suited to the 2C role or top line wing on a very good team. Eichel is a lifeline to salvage this mess if he can be acquired and gets healthy, but otherwise you're going to have players that can never fully hit their max output based on this teams current configuration.
You suck BT.
LOL - I remember all those available dominant puck possession centres Treliving didn’t grab, just waiting to be acquired.
I think Sam was supposed to be that guy, IIRC.
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You already had Gaudreau-Monahan as your LW-C pair at that time, Frolik and Backlund had shown good chemistry previously....it would have made sense to try to put together Tkachuk and Bennett as a pair. Instead they paired Bennett with Versteeg and Brouwer and blamed the lines struggles on him not being capable at center. The next year Bennett-Janko-Hathaway was great, and Bennett had become a full time LW.
Yep, I'd argue no player was more harmful to Bennett's development than Brouwer. He dragged every linemate down to an almost comical degree, and he was stapled to Bennett's hip for 50 games. If you wonder why Bennett never trusted his linemates and tried to do it himself - 2016/17 was why. I've never been so frustrated watching hockey as I was that year - watching Bennett win a puck battle in his own zone and make a great breakout pass, only for it to clank off Brouwer's stick right to the D.
Thought someone said Bennets hat trick was not the result of his team-mates. Rebound, wrap around and carried one from his own blue line. Be Interested to know if Huberdeau is the result of Bennetts goals or if Bennett has has helped his team-mates?
Thought someone said Bennets hat trick was not the result of his team-mates. Rebound, wrap around and carried one from his own blue line. Be Interested to know if Huberdeau is the result of Bennetts goals or if Bennett has has helped his team-mates?
From my perspective the reason for his success can be broken down into 4 factors, weighed out by percentages.*
Renewed confidence/fresh start/Coach Q motivation: 40%
Quality of linemates/Huberdeau: 25%
Individual skillset: 20%
Style of play/Coach Q tactics: 15%
*It should be noted that this is not scientific in any way, just mere speculation based on observation
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LOL - I remember all those available dominant puck possession centres Treliving didn’t grab, just waiting to be acquired.
I think Sam was supposed to be that guy, IIRC.
One way or the other there are better centers that have been, and continue to be available now and over the past 7 seasons. Treliving continues to buckshee a roster together that is just never going to work. How does this team not even have 1 legitimate dangerous shooter - a guy who can pull the trigger on the PP? If you're not going to have a dominant center you most certainly need that at a minimum.
Absolve him of responsibility all you want, but we see it time and time again where good GMs are able to make things happen by not being afraid to make a splash and not being scared to make moves outside of brutal FA signings.
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Last edited by Hot_Flatus; 10-18-2021 at 10:16 AM.
From my perspective the reason for his success can be broken down into 4 factors, weighed out by percentages.*
Renewed confidence/fresh start/Coach Q motivation: 40%
Quality of linemates/Huberdeau: 25%
Individual skillset: 20%
Style of play/Coach Q tactics: 15%
*It should be noted that this is not scientific in any way, just mere speculation based on observation
I would also add the simple addition of icetime and a top six role. Huberdeau does complement him very well but I think it's also the other way around, Huby benefits a lot from a guy that isn't afraid to go infront of the net. I don't remember him ever having this kind of chemistry with Trocheck who is more a perimeter player and not a crash and bang type center.
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One way or the other there are better centers that have been, and continue to be available now and over the past 7 seasons. Treliving continues to buckshee a roster together that is just never going to work. How does this team not even have 1 legitimate dangerous shooter - a guy who can pull the trigger on the PP? If you're not going to have a dominant center you most certainly need that at a minimum.
Absolve him of responsibility all you want, but we see it time and time again where good GMs are able to make things happen by not being afraid to make a splash and not being scared to make moves outside of brutal FA signings.
It absolutely blows my mind that Treliving somehow built a team that is pressed right up against the cap with only a single player worth showing up to watch. A year from now we might not even have that one player and still be a cap team.
That level of commitment to mediocrity is actually kind of impressive.
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In honor of the 600 goal, 1300 point, the Miami Christ the Savior, we should name every OOT thread that the Panthers play in The Samuel Bennett Game Day Thread.
__________________ Peter12 "I'm no Trump fan but he is smarter than most if not everyone in this thread. ”
Bennett should have been in our top-six all along.
Gulutzan should have made Bennett - Backlund - Tkachuk the line.
Peters should have made Gaudreau - Monahan - Bennett the line.
Ward should have made Lucic - Bennett - Dube the line and then Gaudreau - Bennett - ? after Monahan got injured.
They didn't. They backed veterans and reveled in their own stupidity (and they all earned their dismissals), and now the Flames have traded away a 24/25 year old #2 centreman who is going to have a better season than both Backlund and Monahan.
I don't think it's that simple. Bennett/Backlund/Tkachuk probably wouldn't have worked.
Bennett just doesn't have very good hockey intelligence. The Backlund line is one of the best shut down lines in the league, and in order to play on it you need a lot of play awareness. Bennett's classic move was to get himself deep into the corners and turn the puck over. There's no way to transition back to the defence when you're making those kind of bonehead plays repeatedly.
I also don't think that Gaudreau/Bennett was the best pairing either. Gaudreau likes to slow down the play and relies on everyone to get into proper position and take advantage of space he creates. Once again not what Bennett does. With Gaudreau, Bennett would have gotten some goals causing chaos in front of the net. However, Monahan despite his faults is one of the best trigger men in the league. Monahan was just better in that role.
Huberdeau, on the other hand, loves to take the puck end to end and is always driving right towards the net. Bennett is great at playing with Huberdeau, as what he can do is bully his way towards the net.
If you look at any Florida replays and highlights from last year, all of Bennett's points either came from driving the net with his stick down and receiving a fantastic pass from Huberdeau or just feeding the puck to Huberdeau in transition and Huberdeau finishing the play himself. That wrap around goal from the other night was probably the best goal I've seen Bennett score as a Panther. Even then, Bennett looked a bit shaky with his puck control. He took advantage of Huberdeau drawing defenders back towards the right upper slot and Tippett tying up his man in front of the net. If there had been a defender down low, I don't see Bennett having the ability to deke around them. He simply doesn't have that kind of stickhandling ability.
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It absolutely blows my mind that Treliving somehow built a team that is pressed right up against the cap with only a single player worth showing up to watch. A year from now we might not even have that one player and still be a cap team.
That level of commitment to mediocrity is actually kind of impressive.
Cmon....Hanifin, Lindholm, Tanev, Mangiapane, etc.. are all signed to bargain contracts. In fact, I'd argue the only bad contract on Calgary is Lucic. Even then, it's only two years.
You act like the Flames are like the Canucks, repeatedly signing guys like Myers, Eriksson, Sutter, etc...to bad contracts.
Calgary has lots of talent, the issues are that the team never seems to play well all at the same time, and the team buckles when the going gets tough. IMO if you were to take almost any of the individual personel and place them on a winning team, they would excel.
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I don't think it's that simple. Bennett/Backlund/Tkachuk probably wouldn't have worked.
Bennett just doesn't have very good hockey intelligence. The Backlund line is one of the best shut down lines in the league, and in order to play on it you need a lot of play awareness. Bennett's classic move was to get himself deep into the corners and turn the puck over. There's no way to transition back to the defence when you're making those kind of bonehead plays repeatedly.
I also don't think that Gaudreau/Bennett was the best pairing either. Gaudreau likes to slow down the play and relies on everyone to get into proper position and take advantage of space he creates. Once again not what Bennett does. With Gaudreau, Bennett would have gotten some goals causing chaos in front of the net. However, Monahan despite his faults is one of the best trigger men in the league. Monahan was just better in that role.
Huberdeau, on the other hand, loves to take the puck end to end and is always driving right towards the net. Bennett is great at playing with Huberdeau, as what he can do is bully his way towards the net.
If you look at any Florida replays and highlights from last year, all of Bennett's points either came from driving the net with his stick down and receiving a fantastic pass from Huberdeau or just feeding the puck to Huberdeau in transition and Huberdeau finishing the play himself. That wrap around goal from the other night was probably the best goal I've seen Bennett score as a Panther. Even then, Bennett looked a bit shaky with his puck control. He took advantage of Huberdeau drawing defenders back towards the right upper slot and Tippett tying up his man in front of the net. If there had been a defender down low, I don't see Bennett having the ability to deke around them. He simply doesn't have that kind of stickhandling ability.
Yeah he doesn’t have the ability to make the like of Brouwer, Versteeg and Jankowski looke good. Only Crosby can do that, even Crosby has at least one great winger
It absolutely blows my mind that Treliving somehow built a team that is pressed right up against the cap with only a single player worth showing up to watch. A year from now we might not even have that one player and still be a cap team.
That level of commitment to mediocrity is actually kind of impressive.
The Flames have one bad contract into next season...and I bet he retires
Bennett continues to be polarizing on these boards because some people think he had a very low ceiling and is a bust (though there is no way he is a 'bust' - disappointing maybe, but outright busts are players who don't become NHL'ers, or are in and out of the league in a blink of an eye like Yakupov).
Some people saw that he had had talent but wasn't given the right opportunity to develop in Calgary.
I guess we will see. I don't really see the point of arguing about it right now. He SEEMS to be doing really well so far. I personally don't see it suddenly coming to an end, but we will see what happens during the season. If he bombs in Florida, then more people will just agree that he has some tools, but just wasn't able to put it together. If he continues to excel (which is what I expect), then I would think that people can be more willing to admit that perhaps his development was an issue in Calgary, and that he is a good player.
It is not about 'winning' the trade, or 'cheering against Calgary' lol. Yeah, some people are like that. How good or bad Bennett is doesn't alter what Calgary received in a trade - Heinemen and a 2nd. If he falls on his face, or wins an Art Ross, it is still going to be Heinemen and a 2nd. All I care about when it comes to the trade is how well Calgary can develop Heinemen and draft and develop that 2nd round pick.
I am cheering for Bennett not because it is a 'I told you so' to other people on this board who didn't think Bennett was good, or to the Flames as some sort of 'punishment'. I loved him as a player here, period, and want to see him have a tonne of success. I always thought that he put in a lot of effort, and that he was instantly ready to stick up for his teammates, and in the playoffs all he seemed to care about was doing anything and everything to win. I love players like him, and will always cheer him on. It is not cheering against Calgary. It is cheering one of my favourite players on (not that I have to justify a single thing).
I hope he does go PPG. Wouldn't surprise me if he ends up with only 40pts, or finishes above PPG. I think he finding his own gear right now, and nobody really knows how well he really ends up as.
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One way or the other there are better centers that have been, and continue to be available now and over the past 7 seasons. Treliving continues to buckshee a roster together that is just never going to work. How does this team not even have 1 legitimate dangerous shooter - a guy who can pull the trigger on the PP? If you're not going to have a dominant center you most certainly need that at a minimum.
Absolve him of responsibility all you want, but we see it time and time again where good GMs are able to make things happen by not being afraid to make a splash and not being scared to make moves outside of brutal FA signings.
Name 3 “dominant centres” that were readily available. And for kicks, explain how they were coming to Calgary.
Treliving was so afraid he went out last year and signed two of the top UFAs out there. Tanev and Markstrom were probably in the top 4 or 5 available UFAs.
Fear to get players is not the issue. Treliving has missed on a few assessments of who to get, though.
Huberdeau, on the other hand, loves to take the puck end to end and is always driving right towards the net. Bennett is great at playing with Huberdeau, as what he can do is bully his way towards the net.
I gotta say I've read a lot of people say things about Huberdeau that don't ring a bell with me at all and this is also one of them. And not picking on you specifically but thought I'd set this straight once and for all:
Huby isn't an end-to-end skater, in fact speed is his worst asset. For that reason you don't see him bringing the puck up the ice, it's Bennett or Tippett on that line (or more likely to) and when he played with Barkov it was Barkov. If Huberdeau had speed to drive end-to-end he would probably be a generational talent. But he doesn't, he's an average skater.
What he is though is an elite playmaker, maybe the best in the league and also maybe the best passer in the league. He's strong on the cycle and in the corners and can puckhandle in a booth. You rarely see him drive to the net unless it's a wide open lane, he's more of a setup guy. Bennett driving the net opens up a lot of space for Huberdeau along the boards.
Maybe CaliPanthersfan can chime in if he agrees with this or not but this is my impression of him after watching a decade of him in the league.
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I gotta say I've read a lot of people say things about Huberdeau that don't ring a bell with me at all and this is also one of them. And not picking on you specifically but thought I'd set this straight once and for all:
Huby isn't an end-to-end skater, in fact speed is his worst asset. For that reason you don't see him bringing the puck up the ice, it's Bennett or Tippett on that line (or more likely to) and when he played with Barkov it was Barkov. If Huberdeau had speed to drive end-to-end he would probably be a generational talent. But he doesn't, he's an average skater.
What he is though is an elite playmaker, maybe the best in the league and also maybe the best passer in the league. He's strong on the cycle and in the corners and can puckhandle in a booth. You rarely see him drive to the net unless it's a wide open lane, he's more of a setup guy. Bennett driving the net opens up a lot of space for Huberdeau along the boards.
Maybe CaliPanthersfan can chime in if he agrees with this or not but this is my impression of him after watching a decade of him in the league.
We can argue about whether Huberdeau receives the outlet pass from before or after the red line...maybe you're right most of time it's after the red line, which is common for all forwards. So my "end to end" might be seen as an exaggeration. It's more like "red line to end".
However, almost all of Huberdeau's highlights are the same. He gains possession drives into the offensive zone and sets up a play at high speed. He either drives to the net himself or sets up a linemate to do that. Once again, doing the things Bennett is bad at.
