Superstore staff in Alberta vote in favour of strike action

[Slava]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Trying to decide which is the better joke here.

Do I go with “nobody wants the SS to earn a better wage, we saw what they did the last time they were well funded” or do I go with “I keep giving superstore more money for my groceries, but they insist on giving back the difference and calling it ‘change’”

Neither are great, so I’m just gonna float both up there. But to your actual point, they’re trying to “fend off” Costco, right? A company that does, in fact, pay better and from what I’m told, does alright by their people. Wonder how that works? How did Costco crack the code?

It might be virtue signalling to you because you’re not willing to pay more, but it’s a bit condescending to suggest people don’t get the equation. People understand, and people are willing to pay more. People do shop local, and go to farmers markets, etc. These aren’t new concepts you’re talking about. Hell, I pay more for eggs and meat in cases where I know the animals are treated better. I’m certainly willing to pay more across the board knowing the actual people are treated better, and I often do.

Right, some people pay more. But some people shop entirely on price. If the cart full of groceries is $30 cheaper at Superstore, they’re buying there as opposed to say Coop.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Slava

Right, some people pay more. But some people shop entirely on price. If the cart full of groceries is $30 cheaper at Superstore, they’re buying there as opposed to say Coop.

…sure, who is suggesting otherwise? Some people go to one because it’s closest, some people only have one option at all.

Do you think there’s much overlap between the people who shop entirely on price and the people advocating for the workers at the grocery store they shop at to get paid more?

[Slava]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

…sure, who is suggesting otherwise? Some people go to one because it’s closest, some people only have one option at all.

Do you think there’s much overlap between the people who shop entirely on price and the people advocating for the workers at the grocery store they shop at to get paid more?

I have no idea how it would breakdown. Personally, I can't stand shopping at Superstore. I'm not going to pretend it's anything altruistic, I just hate the layouts, think paying for a cart is annoying and I find the stores filthy. But, I can also find a lot of products there that I can't get elsewhere, and it's definitely cheaper.

Is there a potential strike date set at this point, or where is that in the process now that the vote has taken place?

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Slava

You can shop around for lawyers and find a cheaper one? I mean really, you could just represent yourself and save all the money. I probably can skip the “fool for a client” line here.

Some people can, others can’t. Which group do you think is larger?

[Slava]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

Some people can, others can’t. Which group do you think is larger?

I have no idea? But what's your point? You think that paying a lawyer should be cheaper, so go find a cheaper one. People do this with everything, all the time. I have no idea what you do for a living, but presumably there are cheaper options and some people go that route.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Slava

Is there a potential strike date set at this point, or where is that in the process now that the vote has taken place?

Last I heard they are still trying to negotiate a final offer. If talks break down the Union would have to give the company 72 hours notice before going on strike.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

Slava has basically captured the essence of the issue. Everyone is virtue signalling about pretty much everything these days, but very few actually put their money (or effort) where their mouth is.
Want the SS workers to earn a better wage? Pay more for groceries. Want to show your disapproval of China? Pay more for everything. Want to support local businesses? Pay more. Talk is cheap.
Lablaws has pretty thin margins. They are not in a position to gouge anyone, given they have to fend off Costco, Walmart and Amazon... So, really, it is about what you are willing to pay...

Just because you pay more for your product does not mean the workers get paid any better.

If you want to know which companies pay their workers better, the only way is really to ask around or try to google it yourself, and that's not really a workable solution for most people or in the large scale.

Ooh, I know. We should have a law which forces stores to post their median monthly pay for that store at the door, so customers could be better informed when they make their shopping decisions.

I'm sure this idea would take on like wildfire.

I generally agree with your point though that most people don't really care that much... But I also don't think public sympathy is what should dictate worker salaries.

[GGG]

What I like about private unions is that we quickly will find out the employee value.

Are there replacement workers in the market who are willing to work for X pay. What rate will replacements be paid?
How much profit and corporate value are will be lost to meet union demands.

A strike is a natural extension of the market. Assigning virtues to either side is rather meaningless.

The narrative that these corps are owned by rich evil canals just isn’t true. It’s a high dividend stock held by everyone’s retirement savings. It appears they had an operating income of 700 million on 13 billion in sales. That doesn’t seem like an unreasonable profit made on the backs of workers.

Anyway the market will callously determine the value of workers during the strike. Go Market

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

Slava has basically captured the essence of the issue. Everyone is virtue signalling about pretty much everything these days, but very few actually put their money (or effort) where their mouth is.
Want the SS workers to earn a better wage? Pay more for groceries. Want to show your disapproval of China? Pay more for everything. Want to support local businesses? Pay more. Talk is cheap.

But surely there’s a way we can make the world more compassionate and fair without me personally having to make any sacrifices.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

But surely there’s a way we can make the world more compassionate and fair without me personally having to make any sacrifices.

Well there are a few options. “Government”, “corporrations”, “the rich” could all pay so we don’t have to.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

"They should go work at Costco."

it came across as more of an ignorant comment than anything else posted in this thread.

loblaws has 136,00 full and part time employees. didn't look up to see what safeway, save-on etc, have.
how many open positions does Costco have right now?

telling someone to "just get a better job" isn't offering a solution.

And yet expecting a solution after all these years of crappy pay and crappy conditions is probably a bit naïve, no?

I support the strike 100%. Especially against these greedy bastards.

But don't kid yourself. Hundreds of people quitting and going to work somewhere else would open their eyes as well.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

But surely there’s a way we can make the world more compassionate and fair without me personally having to make any sacrifices.

Holy #### Cliff, I bet nobody who’s read this thread has thought about that at all!

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Slava

I have no idea? But what's your point? You think that paying a lawyer should be cheaper, so go find a cheaper one. People do this with everything, all the time. I have no idea what you do for a living, but presumably there are cheaper options and some people go that route.

People who can’t afford even the cheapest lawyers just go look for cheaper ones? I’ll have to take your word for it.

The point is you could make an argument for why almost any job could pay less so unless you’re unemployed it’s hypocritical to argue that someone else shouldn’t be seeking to be better compensated because it will cost others money.

It was also ludicrous for Vlad to suggest a company that has been caught price fixing in the past “can’t afford to gouge their customers”.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

People who can’t afford even the cheapest lawyers just go look for cheaper ones? I’ll have to take your word for it.

The point is you could make an argument for why almost any job could pay less so unless you’re unemployed it’s hypocritical to argue that someone else shouldn’t be seeking to be better compensated because it will cost others money.

It was also ludicrous for Vlad to suggest a company that has been caught price fixing in the past “can’t afford to gouge their customers”.

I think there is a disconnect here in whether people should want to be paid more money. Of course that is fine, and I happen to support that. But to suggest that "the company can afford it, so they'll just take it out of their profits" is just pure fantasy. No one is doing that.

Look at stores like Community Natural Foods. They have paid a living wage for years, which more businesses could and should do. But the prices are notably higher. It's not hypocrisy at all to point out that higher wages are going to mean higher costs for consumers...it's reality.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Azure

And yet expecting a solution after all these years of crappy pay and crappy conditions is probably a bit naïve, no?

I support the strike 100%. Especially against these greedy bastards.

But don't kid yourself. Hundreds of people quitting and going to work somewhere else would open their eyes as well.

Do you know what a strike is?

You’re essentially arguing that if everyone stops working there it won’t change a thing, but at the same time if people stop working there it’ll change thing for the better.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Slava

I think there is a disconnect here in whether people should want to be paid more money. Of course that is fine, and I happen to support that. But to suggest that "the company can afford it, so they'll just take it out of their profits" is just pure fantasy. No one is doing that.

I don’t really think anyone is arguing that. There is a balance though, as a company can be put in a position where they will lose customers if they increase their prices too much. I think why people are having a hard time with your position is because you’re, perhaps unintentionally, making it seem like the price increase from frontline workers getting a raise is going to become a significant hardship for consumers.

Look at stores like Community Natural Foods. They have paid a living wage for years, which more businesses could and should do. But the prices are notably higher. It's not hypocrisy at all to point out that higher wages are going to mean higher costs for consumers...it's reality.

To my knowledge Superstore is one of the highest paying grocery retailers, yet they have far and away the lowest prices. That’s the reality.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

I don’t really think anyone is arguing that. There is a balance though, as a company can be put in a position where they will lose customers if they increase their prices too much. I think why people are having a hard time with your position is because you’re, perhaps unintentionally, making it seem like the price increase from frontline workers getting a raise is going to become a significant hardship for consumers.



To my knowledge Superstore is one of the highest paying grocery retailers, yet they have far and away the lowest prices. That’s the reality.

First, I’m not suggesting that this will be a hardship for consumers. I’m pointing out that inflation and inflationary pressures are in the media a lot these days. We just saw a federal party base their campaign around the rising cost of living. I don’t think it’s a stretch to suggest that rising wages at a grocer would add to that concern.

But if you’re right and Superstore is already one of the highest payers in the sector, why are they being hammered in this thread for not paying enough?

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Slava

But if you’re right and Superstore is already one of the highest payers in the sector, why are they being hammered in this thread for not paying enough?

I will admit to having no idea how much grocery workers make at the various stores, other than having heard costco pays more. I would have thought from this thread that Superstore is at the bottom.

If they already make more than comparable workers elsewhere it probably makes it harder for them to win a strike, because they'll be easier to replace. This is still probably a good time to do it from a public sympathy point of view- I bet less people would cross a picket line now.

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Trying to decide which is the better joke here.

Do I go with “nobody wants the SS to earn a better wage, we saw what they did the last time they were well funded” or do I go with “I keep giving superstore more money for my groceries, but they insist on giving back the difference and calling it ‘change’”

Neither are great, so I’m just gonna float both up there. But to your actual point, they’re trying to “fend off” Costco, right? A company that does, in fact, pay better and from what I’m told, does alright by their people. Wonder how that works? How did Costco crack the code?

It might be virtue signalling to you because you’re not willing to pay more, but it’s a bit condescending to suggest people don’t get the equation. People understand, and people are willing to pay more. People do shop local, and go to farmers markets, etc. These aren’t new concepts you’re talking about. Hell, I pay more for eggs and meat in cases where I know the animals are treated better. I’m certainly willing to pay more across the board knowing the actual people are treated better, and I often do.

You are misreading my post. Where did I say that I dont want to pay more or that SS shouldn't pay its workers more? All I pointed out is that SS is not in a monopoly position, so their margins are thin, and any wage rise will be passed on to the consumer. You just need to be willing to pay more to support whatever position you are taking. I am willing to pay more to "repatriate" production from China. Other stuff - on a case by case basis...

[Slava]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

I will admit to having no idea how much grocery workers make at the various stores, other than having heard costco pays more. I would have thought from this thread that Superstore is at the bottom.

If they already make more than comparable workers elsewhere it probably makes it harder for them to win a strike, because they'll be easier to replace. This is still probably a good time to do it from a public sympathy point of view- I bet less people would cross a picket line now.

Yeah, I also don’t know what workers are paid in relation to other stores. I’m surprised after reading this thread that workers there (Superstore) are paid more.