Friedman: Flames have begun extension talks with Gaudreau & Eichel speculation

[Poe969]

Honest question to everyone. If the Flames weren't good enough and the only real changes were to replace Gio with Zadorov and add Coleman, how is that not a failing grade? Adding Coleman will help a bit but replacing Gio with Zadorov is a step backwards. The world knew the team needed to make changes and significant ones at that yet the arguable take a step to the side instead of forward. This team has been side stepping for far too long and the longer things drag out, the more it looks like this team will be in the same spot as last year. D

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Poe969

Honest question to everyone. If the Flames weren't good enough and the only real changes were to replace Gio with Zadorov and add Coleman, how is that not a failing grade? Adding Coleman will help a bit but replacing Gio with Zadorov is a step backwards. The world knew the team needed to make changes and significant ones at that yet the arguable take a step to the side instead of forward. This team has been side stepping for far too long and the longer things drag out, the more it looks like this team will be in the same spot as last year. D

The only positive is that Tre is out if they fail again

[talladega.25]

I look at the moves that other teams made this off-season and upgrades were apparent and abundant. We will never know what Treliving's phone log will look like, however, going back to the Colorado Series collapse, changes needed to be made. Factor in the past two years and this team has bottomed out even more, while assets and money have been thrown out to keep the mediocrity constant.
For a while I thought Eichel would land here, that was BT's big play, however, I think that probability is dwindling each day. The Gaudreau signing or trade should have been made by now, his FA status will only loom over this team which is not recipe for success.

Looking at the results of each season is one thing but for those that have watched the games, the effort level of this team that manufactures results have been brutal. This was an off-season to make change no matter what because the on-ice product was pathetic from so many 'top end' players. Replacing the intangibles that those players bring with a higher 'Give a rats a$$' from new players coming in would have upgraded this team. I am a big fan of Sutter but this core has burned through coaches, you can't teach a player to buy-in when it has been so apparent for so long that they dictate their success. Heck, we even saw that last year when this team faltered down the stretch under DS and missed the playoffs.
Sorry but the 13's, 23's, and 11's on this roster won't move the needle for this group and here we are again with those individuals expected to lead the way!

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Poe969

Honest question to everyone. If the Flames weren't good enough and the only real changes were to replace Gio with Zadorov and add Coleman, how is that not a failing grade? Adding Coleman will help a bit but replacing Gio with Zadorov is a step backwards. The world knew the team needed to make changes and significant ones at that yet the arguable take a step to the side instead of forward. This team has been side stepping for far too long and the longer things drag out, the more it looks like this team will be in the same spot as last year. D

I'll preface this by saying I wanted to see more change too.
But hope would be based on
- A full season of Sutter
- A roster that more closely aligns to how he wants the team to play

I do think Coleman is going to be a very good signing and he will be a more impactful player than some are expecting

That being said I don't see them as anything more than a bubble team.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by talladega.25

I look at the moves that other teams made this off-season and upgrades were apparent and abundant.

Are they?
Examples please.
Philly made big changes for sure. Not sure if it's an upgrade though.
NJ added a big piece in Hamilton.
Chicago made some big moves to open their contending window. Could prove to be a mistake.

Who else made a big jump forward?

[Bingo]

How would Brendan Parker know if the Flames are done? Are we really suggesting Treliving makes sure the FlamesTV host is in the know about future acquisition plans?

If they go to camp with this team it's because plans fell through, this isn't the planned roster with cap space.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Bingo

How would Brendan Parker know if the Flames are done? Are we really suggesting Treliving makes sure the FlamesTV host is in the know about future acquisition plans?

If they go to camp with this team it's because plans fell through, this isn't the planned roster with cap space.

The only thing in the back of my mind is if they have reduced BT's budget due to anticipated lower attendance coming back, including perhaps if they are seeing lower season ticket renewals.
I suspect it's more what you are saying, but the possibility of a reduced budget from the top is in the back of my head.

[ComixZone]

Just found out that the Flames do not have any plans for STH sessions this year. I think this a good load of garbage from the Flames.

[talladega.25]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Are they?
Examples please.
Philly made big changes for sure. Not sure if it's an upgrade though.
NJ added a big piece in Hamilton.
Chicago made some big moves to open their contending window. Could prove to be a mistake.

Who else made a big jump forward?

Good question.

Teams that made multiple moves under the premise of getting better:
Boston, St. Louis, Philadelphia, Chicago, Florida, Vancouver, Winnipeg, Toronto, and LA.. Vegas to an extent. Carolina even revamped their goalie tandem and shook up their D outside of their existing Top 3.
A lot of comparable markets to what Calgary is or hopes to be in terms of league status/contenders.

While we can debate if the Philly and Chicago moves as being successful, they felt that they needed to shake-up their rosters and did so. If I was a Blackhawk player, my outlook would be drastically different (Improved) than what it was last year with MAF and Jones coming in. Philly has a whole new D core, so that will obviously change that outlook there.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Are they?
Examples please.
Philly made big changes for sure. Not sure if it's an upgrade though.
NJ added a big piece in Hamilton.
Chicago made some big moves to open their contending window. Could prove to be a mistake.

Who else made a big jump forward?

I'm baffled by the claims of other teams making big improvements. I was underwhelmed by almost every team. And some of the moves (see Duncan Keith) were just nuts.

Aside from the Devils and maybe the Kings, pretty unimpressive.

[Southside]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Just found out that the Flames do not have any plans for STH sessions this year. I think this a good load of garbage from the Flames.

How did you learn this? Odd they would make that decision and already.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by talladega.25

Good question.

Teams that made multiple moves under the premise of getting better:
Boston, St. Louis, Philadelphia, Chicago, Florida, Vancouver, Winnipeg, Toronto, and LA.. Vegas to an extent. Carolina even revamped their goalie tandem and shook up their D outside of their existing Top 3.
A lot of comparable markets to what Calgary is or hopes to be in terms of league status/contenders.

While we can debate if the Philly and Chicago moves as being successful, they felt that they needed to shake-up their rosters and did so. If I was a Blackhawk player, my outlook would be drastically different (Improved) than what it was last year with MAF and Jones coming in. Philly has a whole new D core, so that will obviously change that outlook there.

Vancouver? Seriously?

Philly's moves have been discussed. Boston overpaid for almost every player they got. Florida signed one player (I don't think Thornton counts any more). Toronto made the same kind of moves that are being criticized here. Nick Ritchie - who is good but no better than Coleman, and Kase, who didn't even play last year. And they signed Mrazek to back up.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by talladega.25

Good question.

Teams that made multiple moves under the premise of getting better:
Boston, St. Louis, Philadelphia, Chicago, Florida, Vancouver, Winnipeg, Toronto, and LA.. Vegas to an extent. .

It's hard to remember all the moves but did all those teams really make more significant changes than the Flames did? What did the Jets do? I like what they did but it wasn't huge.

I think most of these teams more or less made about the same level of changes as the Flames.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

It has definitely been an underwhelming offseason, but "winning" the offseason isn't really a thing. Sometimes it works out, often times it doesn't. Making trades to shake things up leads to trading talent for volume, such as the Dion or Gilmour moves.

Hard to anticipate any flashy moves until the Eichel situation clears up. I would be ok with the Flames going into the season with some room for young guys to push and some cap space to allow for moves into the season.

[talladega.25]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Vancouver? Seriously?

Philly's moves have been discussed. Boston overpaid for almost every player they got. Florida signed one player (I don't think Thornton counts any more). Toronto made the same kind of moves that are being criticized here. Nick Ritchie - who is good but no better than Coleman, and Kase, who didn't even play last year. And they signed Mrazek to back up.

Sorry but I disagree there.
Toronto
In:Ritchie, Kase, Bunting, and Kampf. Mrazek in Goal. The first three names are solid middle 6 F's and Mrazek will be a cheaper 1b option with similar metrics (2 years) than Freddie A.

Boston
In: Foligno, Haula, Nosek, Hall (Retained Asset) and Ullmark. None of those guys are a major over-pay. Maybe Ullmark but he was carrying a horrible team in Buffalo for a few years.

Florida
In: Reinhart, Thornton (doesn't move the needle on the ice, I agree) and Mountour (Retained Asset)

[Drunk Uncle]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

Who in the division other than Vegas is that much ahead of the Flames? I would argue the Flames are pretty much even with 3 or 4 teams fighting for 2nd and 3rd spots in the division.

I'm not willing to bet Seattle catches lightning in a bucket like Vegas did. They have more chance of being a bottom feeder than a contending team. Anaheim and San Jose should, for all intents and purposes, be terrible. So you're left with Calgary, Edmonton, Vancouver, and maybe LA fighting for two play off spots. And I don't think Calgary loses to any of them, TBH.

Maybe it's the optimist in me once again, but I expect a Sutter led Flames team (even with no changes) getting second or third in the division.

Vancouver and Edmonton are wildcards to me. Calgary could finish 2nd IMO but I think the expectation for me is 3rd or 4th.

The biggest benefit I think is that we will be playing a style of hockey that works in the playoffs all year long so my expectation is that this team wins at least one round this year and the optimist in me thinks we can win 2 rounds.

[talladega.25]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

It's hard to remember all the moves but did all those teams really make more significant changes than the Flames did? What did the Jets do? I like what they did but it wasn't huge.

I think most of these teams more or less made about the same level of changes as the Flames.

Adding 2 Top 4 Potential D helps the Jets cause.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Originally Posted by talladega.25

Sorry but I disagree there.
Toronto
In:Ritchie, Kase, Bunting, and Kampf. Mrazek in Goal. The first three names are solid middle 6 F's and Mrazek will be a cheaper 1b option with similar metrics (2 years) than Freddie A.

Boston
In: Foligno, Haula, Nosek, Hall (Retained Asset) and Ullmark. None of those guys are a major over-pay. Maybe Ullmark but he was carrying a horrible team in Buffalo for a few years.

Florida
In: Reinhart, Thornton (doesn't move the needle on the ice, I agree) and Mountour (Retained Asset)

You need to show the "Out" to assess whether the moves actually move the needle.

[Gaskal]

I'm kind of surprised that the Flames seem done given the earlier insider rumors of Tkachuk wanting out. Figured Treliving wants this resolved by the start of training camp, same as Eichel with the Sabres.

You don't want that kind of a distraction cloud hanging over your team. Especially considering that he's been in the conversation before for future Flames captain and face of the franchise.

[taxbuster]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

Almost 200 pages and 4,000 posts and no significant progress.

Ha ha...exactly what I was going to say!!