Seven Days in Kabul

[Azure]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I think you missed a key point here, and it happens constantly. US Intelligence and other intelligence agencies were warned that this would happen, that there would be a fairly rapid collapse. The political leaders ignored the warnings. The same thing happened in 9/11, however in that case it was because the CIA for example was going through an internal war and so the President was flooded with dissenting positions from the CIA at the time.



In this case the warnings were on the same page, and the State Department in the US and the president and probably foreign affairs and the PM ignored the warnings and dragged their feet and moved with next to no urgency.



Now they're trapped in a situation that is not just a military situation, but a Political Bear trap.


With Canada there was a plan in place as far back as Thursday, and the air and troop assets were positioned in Kuwait, and they sat there with no approval from FA or DND because an election was called and the government was too busy with that. (was published earlier today by the Sun).



Now we're back in line of sending planes in when the American's give the go ahead to use he airfield.

It does blow my mind that the government (both US & Canada) wouldn't have a plan in place, pre approved by the President or PM in case poop does hit the fan.

Why on earth do they need to wait for approval?

They already got enough approval to move the assets in place, and then all of a sudden 'oh hey, we can't get a hold of the PM, he is busy trying to buy more election votes.'

What a disaster.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by carmenshoes

So what is the most likely outcome out of all this?

Some people will get out, the respective governments will crow and take photo ops and brag about how they got these refugees out.


A lot of men, woman and children that helped us out during the war, that became friends with the Canadians and Americans that fought over there will die horribly and publicly, and we'll all forget about this in months.


sorry, I'm pretty jaded on the whole f'ing thing right now.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Azure

It does blow my mind that the government (both US & Canada) wouldn't have a plan in place, pre approved by the President or PM in case poop does hit the fan.

Why on earth do they need to wait for approval?

They already got enough approval to move the assets in place, and then all of a sudden 'oh hey, we can't get a hold of the PM, he is busy trying to buy more election votes.'

What a disaster.

How many people did Canada have there? Doesn't seem like it should have been that difficult to get the relatively small number of people out.

[chemgear]

Spoiler!

https://twitter.com/user/status/1427219438101696517

https://twitter.com/user/status/1427214932378996737

https://twitter.com/user/status/1427202980160446466

[cam_wmh]

Thank you

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Azure

It does blow my mind that the government (both US & Canada) wouldn't have a plan in place, pre approved by the President or PM in case poop does hit the fan.

Why on earth do they need to wait for approval?

They already got enough approval to move the assets in place, and then all of a sudden 'oh hey, we can't get a hold of the PM, he is busy trying to buy more election votes.'

What a disaster.

All the people that were trying to get these people out with some using their own money wanted a orderly plan to get them out. Instead we get both governments doing next to nothing until the last minute. Then coming up with asinine and stupid plans instead of having a plan with some speed and urgency (Here go to www.Foreignaffiarsisstupid.com and fill in a bunch of forms. Instead of, we'll send in special forces before the Taliban gets here, here are your rally points, we'll have staff from the embassy or Foreign affairs to do intake. here are these planes, we'll deal with the deeper paper work and check boxes once your away from the invading murder cult, and in Kuwait or wherever.



Marc Garneau's head should roll for this (no irony intended).


I was joking with a friend, that during the Cuban missile crisis, Dief delayed and dragged out when Kennedy asked for Canada's help because Dief hated Kennedy and his feelings were hurt because Kennedy took 6 days to talk to him, and wanted to give him the typical Canadian passive aggressive bullshyte.



Dief refused to raise our alert level and sat on his hands. And Harkness the defense minister and Admiral Dyer ignored Dief raised the Alert level and increased surveillance flights basically telling the PM to go F himself. Because of that the Canadian Forces found Soviet Subs off the coast of Halifax heading to Cuba and warned the Americans. This forced Dief to get off of his a$$ and help the Americans.



Why am I doing this stupid history lesson? Because part of me bets that some of those Canadian Forces personal who were forced to sit on their hands waiting for a go decision from a government while that's obsessed with an election while watching this unfold on tv fantasized about telling the government to go F themselves, we're going anyways.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

How many people did Canada have there? Doesn't seem like it should have been that difficult to get the relatively small number of people out.

we've been there 20 years, think how many Afghans we've employed over 20 years, they will all be killed if they are outed

[Azure]

I think he was talking more about actual Canadians that are in country, of which I know there are a few.

Nevermind the Afghans we've employed.

The government should fall over this, but instead we'll elect them with a bigger majority.

[afc wimbledon]

'We' the west caused this, at the very least any Afghan that can get out should be offered refugee status no matter whether they were in our service or not, every woman that went to school, got a job, had a life because we told them not to be scared, that we had their back, the least we can do is let them come here

[GirlySports]

I don't know if we 100% caused this. We gave the Afghan government and army everything. Resources, infrastructire, training, weapons and they didn't last a day?

[zamler]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

I don't know if we 100% caused this. We gave the Afghan government and army everything. Resources, infrastructire, training, weapons and they didn't last a day?

Air support and general intel (think electronic surveillance) was key to the Afghan army as soon as that went away they were toast. So I don't think we gave them "everything".

[Manhattanboy]

The cluster$&@“ of ignoring our former soldiers’ pleas for weeks to get the interpreters out should in itself be the reason Trudeau goes down.

[Manhattanboy]

Canadians should be furious over this debacle but of course as suggested above the LIBS will be handed a majority on a silver platter.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

What Trudeau and Canada did (or didn't) do in this situation is just one issue that voters will base their vote on, it's not enough to topple a government. Don't get me wrong.......what is happening there at the moment is brutally heartbreaking to watch, but when voters get in the booth to vote it won't be at the top of the list for most people.

[FlameOn]

US reaches deal with the Taliban for evacuation from Kabul Airport without interference

https://thehill.com/policy/internati...eaders-reached

[Manhattanboy]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

What Trudeau and Canada did (or didn't) do in this situation is just one issue that voters will base their vote on, it's not enough to topple a government. Don't get me wrong.......what is happening there at the moment is brutally heartbreaking to watch, but when voters get in the booth to vote it won't be at the top of the list for most people.

Sad thing is, it won’t be on their lists at all.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

I don't know if we 100% caused this. We gave the Afghan government and army everything. Resources, infrastructire, training, weapons and they didn't last a day?

we caused this when we overthrew the Taliban 20 years ago, hell when we armed the Majahadin 40 years ago, all of this is on us, we created this whole mess.

When we took over the country it became our responsibility no matter how long it took

[Manhattanboy]

nm

[blender]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

we caused this when we overthrew the Taliban 20 years ago, hell when we armed the Majahadin 40 years ago, all of this is on us, we created this whole mess.

When we took over the country it became our responsibility no matter how long it took

That's the thing with Colonialism. You get to just pull up stakes whenever you want. You always get a Mulligan.

[OldDutch]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

Sad thing is, it won’t be on their lists at all.

Its how the Libs work. Be the hand that feeds, and no one will bite it.

We still have people staying home instead of working and collecting COVID relief FFS.

We have super cheap daycare on the way.

We have seniors getting a literal check for nothing.

Who is biting that over going on Facebook and liking a self righteous post then slinking off to vote Justin back in.

Liberals own our slacktivism.