Friedman: Flames have begun extension talks with Gaudreau & Eichel speculation - Page 137 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Ashasx · 08-05-2021, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dino7c

9M is a 90 point player...Tkachuk is a 60-70 point player IMO

Freaking out after you already lost isn't my idea of bringing it

You think a 90 point player only gets $9 million in today's market?

ComixZone · 08-05-2021, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashasx

You think a 90 point player only gets $9 million in today's market?

Yeah, 90 point players who put up the defensive game that Tkachuk does? That's an $11M+ player, also - there really aren't any of them out there. That'd be like taking Marchand and Bergeron's best career years, putting them at 24 years old, and putting them into this current market.

djsFlames · 08-05-2021, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashasx

You think a 90 point player only gets $9 million in today's market?

Not sure ever since the Oilers ####ed the market.

colbym72 · 08-05-2021, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Not sure ever since the Oilers ####ed the market.

How did they mess up the market? If anything, McDavid saved the market because no one else will get more than him

dino7c · 08-05-2021, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashasx

You think a 90 point player only gets $9 million in today's market?

1M for 10 points is the going rate give or take...I hope other teams are as hyped on Tkachuk as some of you. I don't remember him having this many fans on here when he was dragging his ass last season.

Is he amazing defensively or has he played his entire career with Backlund or Lindholm

ComixZone · 08-05-2021, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Not sure ever since the Oilers ####ed the market.

I put most of it on Dubas out in Toronto. Edmonton locked up their guys for 8 years at least. Dubas handed out a 5 year contract with an AAV of $11.64M to Matthews. That broke the damn market, and is who we can thank for Tkachuk's crappy 2nd contract as it was in direct response to the Matthews reset.

TheIronMaiden · 08-05-2021, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Not sure ever since the Oilers ####ed the market.

Them and NYR with the Artemi Panarin contract.

Ashasx · 08-05-2021, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dino7c

1M for 10 points is the going rate give or take...I hope other teams are as hyped on Tkachuk as some of you. I don't remember him having this many fans on here when he was dragging his ass last season.

Is he amazing defensively or has he played his entire career with Backlund or Lindholm

$9M AAV is what you might expect for somebody like Gaudreau who is relied on solely for producing points.

Tkachuk does more than just put up points. Plays against the hardest competition and keeps his head above water, regardless of who is playing with.

Lanny_McDonald · 08-05-2021, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Yeah, 90 point players who put up the defensive game that Tkachuk does? That's an $11M+ player, also - there really aren't any of them out there. That'd be like taking Marchand and Bergeron's best career years, putting them at 24 years old, and putting them into this current market.

Except Tkachuk is nothing like you describe. He isn't a 90 point player. He isn't some defensively strong player. He's a solid 55-65 point player that is decent defensively. Lets not get crazy about what Matthew Tkachuk is. What he is exceptional at is being a #### disturber, but one who doesn't fight his own battles. That wears on a team.

dino7c · 08-05-2021, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashasx

$9M AAV is what you might expect for somebody like Gaudreau who is relied on solely for producing points.

Tkachuk does more than just put up points. Plays against the hardest competition and keeps his head above water, regardless of who is playing with.

Well he has played his entire career with Backlund or Lindholm so it's hard to say. He is decent defensively but I think it's being overblown a bit.

I don't want to give him away but I would trade him for a solid package before giving him 9M. Especially if he is questioning Sutter and his playing time. He certainly didn't earn more playing time last season.

Flame On · 08-05-2021, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Except Tkachuk is nothing like you describe. He isn't a 90 point player. He isn't some defensively strong player. He's a solid 55-65 point player that is decent defensively. Lets not get crazy about what Matthew Tkachuk is. What he is exceptional at is being a #### disturber, but one who doesn't fight his own battles. That wears on a team.

What specific battles hasn't he fought? He's had plenty of fights and some even we as a fanbase seemed to agree he shouldn't have even had to.
We can see the pattern of the team as a whole not having what it takes to rise to the challenge of the playoffs and big games, but now we're to believe they are good enough to be team-mates to a guy that attracts attention? Someone they drafted knowing his character and style?

ComixZone · 08-05-2021, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Except Tkachuk is nothing like you describe. He isn't a 90 point player. He isn't some defensively strong player. He's a solid 55-65 point player that is decent defensively. Lets not get crazy about what Matthew Tkachuk is. What he is exceptional at is being a #### disturber, but one who doesn't fight his own battles. That wears on a team.

He's a high-end 200 foot LW'er. He's a 0.8 PPG player through 349 games.
I know you're not a big analytics guy, but Tkachuk has been very very impressive over his career.

He's tied for the 12th highest PPG in the league at his position since he entered the league (...but the player who wants to be here is 3rd during that same time, so yay for us). The guy is absolutely one of the best LW'ers in the game, and the return we get for him should (I imagine, WILL) show that.

I also wasn't saying Tkachuk was a 90 point player, I was saying there aren't any 90 point players that play like Tkachuk. Marchand's 18/19 season is the closest thing to it in recent memory. This idea that Tkachuk doesn't fight his own battles is also a crock. He fought a good amount, including a goofball like Kassian. Tkachuk never backed down.

Monahammer · 08-05-2021, 02:14 PM

Here's a bit of a loop but I think might hold merit:
Forsberg+Glass for Tkachuk+x (I'm thinking Kylington)

Then use Glass+package of our futures for Eichel.

Forsberg has been rumored to be unhappy with the arvidsson trade. He would look nice here. Tkachuk is the better piece for a few reasons though so we get the extra value in glass.

Vinny01 · 08-05-2021, 02:14 PM

I have always wondered what the teammates thought of the highlights of a masked Tkachuk throwing up his hands in disbelief as they choked away a 3-0 lead to get spanked 7-3 in game 6 against Dallas? Lots of shots of him facepalming while the team was embarrassing themselves.

Ashasx · 08-05-2021, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vinny01

I have always wondered what the teammates thought of the highlights of a masked Tkachuk throwing up his hands in disbelief as they choked away a 3-0 lead to get spanked 7-3 in game 6 against Dallas? Lots of shots of him facepalming while the team was embarrassing themselves.

Hopefully the team was just as embarrassed as Tkachuk was.

atb · 08-05-2021, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Except Tkachuk is nothing like you describe. He isn't a 90 point player. He isn't some defensively strong player. He's a solid 55-65 point player that is decent defensively. Lets not get crazy about what Matthew Tkachuk is. What he is exceptional at is being a #### disturber, but one who doesn't fight his own battles. That wears on a team.

I think Tkachuk has the skillset to be a 40 goal, 90 point player, but he definitely has some maturing to do to get to that level. Was really hoping this growth would happen with the Flames but it's looking less likely that will be the case. My biggest fear is trading Matthew then watching this growth happen elsewhere followed by him being a dominant player with leadership quality for a number of years.

DeluxeMoustache · 08-05-2021, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ComixZone

I put most of it on Dubas out in Toronto. Edmonton locked up their guys for 8 years at least. Dubas handed out a 5 year contract with an AAV of $11.64M to Matthews. That broke the damn market, and is who we can thank for Tkachuk's crappy 2nd contract as it was in direct response to the Matthews reset.

Yeah, they screwed up the leverage that teams had over RFAs, with no really good reason. Dummies

PeteMoss · 08-05-2021, 02:23 PM

Unless the Flames are motivated to trade Tkachuk - he has no leverage and will be back.

Ashasx · 08-05-2021, 02:24 PM

I really feel like this rumour is just piggybacking the same rumour from a month ago that was denied by Flames management.

From 31 Thoughts:

Quote:

2. This is what I can tell you about the rumours that Matthew Tkachuk wants out of Calgary: When the news about Seth Jones got around, no one was thrilled it had leaked, but no one denied it. Same for Oliver Ekman-Larsson being available and Dougie Hamilton free to talk to other teams. With Tkachuk, there’ve been firm denials. I do believe the Flames refused to include him in any Pierre-Luc Dubois trade talks last season.

What could have changed in the last month?

Knut · 08-05-2021, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashasx

I really feel like this rumour is just piggybacking the same rumour from a month ago that was denied by Flames management.

From 31 Thoughts:

What could have changed in the last month?

Maybe Treliving is trying to keep things under wraps so that he can maximize the return.