Friedman: Flames have begun extension talks with Gaudreau & Eichel speculation

[Roof-Daddy]

The Flames can't officially sign Gaudreau to an extension until July 28th, but they can agree to one before hand and just wait to make it official.

[Icon]

Originally Posted by saillias

So from the latest on Elliotte Friedman's hit with Steinberg today.

...

As for us, the Flames have been interested but Friedman sounds skeptical we have the pieces to do it.

Skeptical we're caving on giving up the pieces to do it you mean.

The ask from Buffalo is likely one more piece than teams are willing to cope with right now. Someone will cave, either just by giving up that piece, or Buffalo taking the best option they can.

Risky obviously for other teams in that they don't want to overpay if they don't have to.

Risky for the Sabres in that they can run out of suitors if teams leave the table and make moves in free agency instead.

I think we see someone break and Eichel is traded before free agency starts.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

Eichel last season before traded: potential career limiting injury. Seguin was 21 and on the upswing , eichel is 24 and potentially broken + declining. Seems like similar value to me.

Edit: Eichel isn't damaged goods? So he isn't damaged or he isn't good? I'm pretty sure he's damaged, not sure if he will be good though ��

Right, they're similar value because... as I said... you're guessing at the damage and the prognosis. Of course they're similar value... to you. My point was that it's silly to assume we know.

And it doesn't even make sense. You think that if Eichel is damaged goods, broken and on the decline with a limited career ahead of him... he has similar value to Seguin? I'd guess at that point he has almost no value at all.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by mikephoen

For me, and I think a lot of others, the only reasonable way out of mediocrity is a complete rebuild. But since we've had to accept that the Flames will not do this any time soon, then going all in on Eichel is only other way out of mediocrity.

If they aren't going to do the smart thing, they can at least do the bold thing.

Yeah, that’s pretty much where I’m at. I’m resigned to the fact the Flames aren’t going to implement the strategy they should implement. So I’m left hoping they do a good job of carrying out a bad strategy.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Honestly if you woke up tomorrow to the news that the Flames acquired Eichel who could honestly say they wouldn't be excited.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Yeah, that’s pretty much where I’m at. I’m resigned to the fact the Flames aren’t going to implement the strategy they should implement. So I’m left hoping they do a good job of carrying out a bad strategy.

That's a concise summary of precisely how I feel.
Go big or go re-build.

And they won't do the latter.

[PepsiFree]

Yup, whatever *this* is that they're doing, just do it well.

Swing for the fences, give us some hope.

The only thing that would be disappointing is doing nothing, and with the cap space they have, I don't see it.

Get in on Eichel, Landeskog, whoever. Ship out a core guy if you have to.

In the great words of McDavid: "let's go."

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by saillias

So from the latest on Elliotte Friedman's hit with Steinberg today.

The team that seems to want Eichel the most is Minnesota. But they will have trouble making the money work with the huge buyouts they just did.

Anaheim is the team that everyone seems to think makes the most sense in terms of assets, prospect pool and fit but they aren't willing to pay up.

Montreal and also NYR seem to be trying to lowball the Sabres.

As for us, the Flames have been interested but Friedman sounds skeptical we have the pieces to do it.

The Risto return has probably emboldened Kevyn Adams in his ask. Steinberg mentioned in discussion with Logan Gordon he thinks the price will come down I don't really agree

I think Minny won’t be able to make the numbers work, and that will leave one of the teams waiting for the price to come down to land Eichel. Still think it’s Anaheim and they won’t have to give up Zegras or Drysdale.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Did you miss where Eichel doesn't play with *every* player on the team? One guy doesn't decide if a team is a contender or not. Neither does one line.

Again, no specifics about Eichel, just "the team got worse!" as though that's a measure of a player.

Well, when you say that Eichel makes players around him better, that extends to the whole team, because when you're at that supposed elite level your play lifts everyone's play. Crosby does it. McDavid does it. All of the elite players have done it. When you're elite, you carry your team and the team gets better because of it. Hence the argument that Eichel is not elite. If Eichel were elite, he would have Buffalo trending better, not worse, right? Seems that's brush we paint our players and team with, so why is it different for guy that has failed miserably in Buffalo?

IDK man if you watch every Buffalo game, have at it. You also watch every Ottawa game, and Florida game, and watch Arizona whenever you can. Whenever a team or player comes up, you've watched all the games. It's impressive, so kudos to you I guess.

I never said I watched every Buffalo game. You did. I never said I watched every game of any team. You did. That's your attempted dodge to discredit. Pretty transparent and something you like to do.

I just think it's weird that Eichel hasn't played since early March, and in that time you've gone from "would trade Tkachuk, Monahan, Hanifin, and a 1st for Eichel and Risto" or "Tkachuk, Lindholm, Hanifin, and a 1st for Eichel and Reinhart" to "EICHEL BAD DO NOT WANT! EVERYONE IS OBSESSED!" Like, what Buffalo games have you been watching the last two months? Clearly, they changed your mind.

Don't equate suggested trades to counter those made by others as my endorsement of going after a player, which is exactly what you're doing. The post you're referring to says just that.

"I can't see Buffalo including a salary dump in the deal. That would hurt the value they are going to get out of Eichel. Why would they limit the return they are likely to get out of this. Frankly, a deal I could see happening would be a 1st line center, a 1st line winger, a top four defenseman, and a pick or two for Eichel and another asset with value. So for the Flames I would think the deal would be Monahan, Lindholm, Hanifin, 2022 1st rounder ($16.175) for Eichel and Ristolanen ($15.4M). I think that is a very high price to pay for the Flames and one they should think long and hard on. That's a tough package for other teams to match IMO and would really make the Sabres better."

See, never endorsed the trade and said the Flames should think long and hard about a trade like that. And that was before we found out about his neck injury. Now, you're a smart kid, but you should stop misrepresenting what people say the way you are. It only looks bad on you when you do stuff like that.

To answer your loaded question, wWhat has changed that makes Eichel less and less attractive? I dunno? A neck requiring surgery? And then demanding surgery that has never been done on an NHL player? That seems pretty relevant don't you think? Or do you regularly buy stuff that is need of repair and pay way over market value for that product? I would hope not, because I think you're a smart kid, and that's a real stupid thing to do.

[Badgers Nose]

If they go with win now, I hope they buttress with some absolute barbarians to keep all the expensive talent safe.

One thing we can expect once Sutter has time to make his mark is that anyone that slashes Johnny’s bird bones, or cross checks Money’s back is going to have to answer for it.

That’s even more true if we get Eichel.

You can’t trust NHL value village officiating and discipline department to keep players safe.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

If they go with win now, I hope they buttress with some absolute barbarians to keep all the expensive talent safe.

One thing we can expect once Sutter has time to make his mark is that anyone that slashes Johnny’s bird bones, or cross checks Money’s back is going to have to answer for it.

That’s even more true if we get Eichel.

You can’t trust NHL value village officiating and discipline department to keep players safe.

They already have Lucic and Ritchie for that

[Kipper_3434]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Right, they're similar value because... as I said... you're guessing at the damage and the prognosis. Of course they're similar value... to you. My point was that it's silly to assume we know.

And it doesn't even make sense. You think that if Eichel is damaged goods, broken and on the decline with a limited career ahead of him... he has similar value to Seguin? I'd guess at that point he has almost no value at all.

What I said was "potentially damaged goods" and "has a career limiting injury/is likely declining" . Not sure whats left to be disputed there. The circumstances around Eichel clearly should lower his value. Not only does he need surgery, he's demanded a trade and also Is already signed to big money long term. All 3 of those factors lower value, we aren't talking about trading a peak performing player, we're discussing a player that might return to those levels, saying he's equal to 21 year old Seguin in value may be generous.

[blankall]

The issue with a complete rebuild is that it's such a gamble. For all the success stories with the tanks, there seems to be multiple teams like Edmonton, Buffalo, Arizona, NYI, etc..teams that are stuck with losing season after losing season but don't look anywhere closer to a cup.

On top of that, out-tanking the seriously bad teams is hard to do. With the new lottery, the odds of actually getting that franchise player are low, even if you do manage to finish bottom 4.

Quite frankly, I'm not even sure the tank does guarantee any kind of success. The idea that you have to have multiple franchise centers to win, seems outdated now. That notion was also heavily skewed by the Crosby era.

At least with the Eichel acquisition, he's somewhat of a known quantity. We know he is the franchise centre.

The main issue with Eichel is his injury. Hopefully the Flames' doctors have done their due diligence on this already. If anyone is going to work through an injury and recover, it's a guy like Eichel. He's ultra competitive and has devoted his life to winning a cup. He's not quitting at age 24.

[kyuss275]

As much as speculation on Eichel is fun , I’m getting worried that an extension for Johnny will not be coming by Wednesday. Think it’s a mistake not to have him signed or traded by July 28th. Hopefully news tomorrow but I won’t hold my breath.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

I never said I watched every Buffalo game. You did. I never said I watched every game of any team. You did. That's your attempted dodge to discredit. Pretty transparent and something you like to do.

Don't equate suggested trades to counter those made by others as my endorsement of going after a player, which is exactly what you're doing. The post you're referring to says just that.

"I can't see Buffalo including a salary dump in the deal. That would hurt the value they are going to get out of Eichel. Why would they limit the return they are likely to get out of this. Frankly, a deal I could see happening would be a 1st line center, a 1st line winger, a top four defenseman, and a pick or two for Eichel and another asset with value. So for the Flames I would think the deal would be Monahan, Lindholm, Hanifin, 2022 1st rounder ($16.175) for Eichel and Ristolanen ($15.4M). I think that is a very high price to pay for the Flames and one they should think long and hard on. That's a tough package for other teams to match IMO and would really make the Sabres better."

See, never endorsed the trade and said the Flames should think long and hard about a trade like that. And that was before we found out about his neck injury. Now, you're a smart kid, but you should stop misrepresenting what people say the way you are. It only looks bad on you when you do stuff like that.

To answer your loaded question, wWhat has changed that makes Eichel less and less attractive? I dunno? A neck requiring surgery? And then demanding surgery that has never been done on an NHL player? That seems pretty relevant don't you think? Or do you regularly buy stuff that is need of repair and pay way over market value for that product? I would hope not, because I think you're a smart kid, and that's a real stupid thing to do.

On the first point, you’re right that you’ve never said you watched every game, but you’ve always “watched the games.” Whether it’s as many as you can, or whenever you get the chance, or “most” of them, etc. How many Buffalo games have you watched? This is not a weird “attempt to dodge discredit” thing, relax. How many Buffalo games have you watched and which one should I watch to see it the way you do? Name a game.

On the second, the trade proposals, which you said would work for both teams, and something you advocated over giving up prospects, were pulled from the thread about Eichel being denied his preferred neck surgery. Don’t make it out like this stuff just dawned on you once you realised he needed surgery and wanted an experimental one. My question is one of curiosity: what changed since May 12?

As I said, your opinion doesn’t track based on what I’ve seen and what I’ve read. So educate me. No platitudes, no cliches. Let’s go, what am I watching, what’s changed in your mind since mid May.. The condescending filler is kind of dorky and not convincing me much, tbh. You’re not that good at it. Give me some substance here so I can see what you’re seeing.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Friedman on the Fan:

Did not hear Johnny’s name over the weekend. Doesn’t think he was out there from a trade perspective.

Flames trying to define new identity

Flames looking for Defence

Flames still listed as being in on Eichel. Buffalo is after four “futures” (prospects/picks)

Dube, Kylington, 1st, 1st.

Considering the chances of us ever realistically being able to draft an Eichel, and our penchant for drafting in the middle of the pack regardless, I don't have any problems with giving up our next two 1st round picks.

I mean, I'm not even convinced that's enough value to get him anyway.

[GreenLantern2814]

Tkachuk, Mangiapane, 1st, 2nd

I would bet Bread is the sweetener Tre doesn’t want to add. He’s hoping they bite on Dube or anyone else.

[mile]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

As much as speculation on Eichel is fun , I’m getting worried that an extension for Johnny will not be coming by Wednesday. Think it’s a mistake not to have him signed or traded by July 28th. Hopefully news tomorrow but I won’t hold my breath.

https://flamesnation.ca/2021/07/26/w...u-makes-sense/

Steinberg sounded confident that it would get done in his Flamesnation article today:

Johnny Gaudreau’s future in Calgary is perhaps the team’s biggest storyline this summer, of which there are many. It has been my belief for some time Gaudreau and the Flames would end up agreeing on an extension, and that remains the case today. I believe it’ll happen and if/when it does, assuming a fair deal for both sides, I think it’ll be a good thing for the organization and the city.

When Tre was asked about it in his post-draft presser he didn't say anything, but I just got a good vibe from him. I think it gets done. I’m not sure if it’ll be by Wednesday, but I’m not worried.

I really need something to be excited about. I hope this and the Eichel trade happens.

[MrMike]

I don’t think Tkachuks on the table yet. I bet it’s Monahan and a mixture of Dube/first/second/Zary.

[howard_the_duck]

The Ducks should be all over Eichel, and are at a much more realistic stage of the franchise to push the chips to the middle to build around their future stable of Comtois, Zegras, Jones, Drysdale, McTavish, you name it.

Really hope they step up and we don’t overpay. I’d love Eichel for the ensuing excitement, but I really think it’s the wrong move for the franchise.

I think our quickest path to rebuild could be staying the course, even if we haven’t committed to labeling that a rebuild, and not dealing our only futures ahead of these franchise altering draft classes.