Renewed passenger rail service between Banff and Calgary?

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by GGG

Essentially people like trains because poor people take buses. That 50% of the reason is emotional not logical really is frustrating. I really struggle with government policy being based around people’s prejudices on the other hand whatever you invest in needs to be used so you have to take it into account.

Public transportation + traffic = buses.

Public transportation - traffic = trains.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by timun

Per passenger-mile flying is many times safer than rail. Bus is safer than rail.

Flying by plane, but what about hang glider, zeppelin, hot air balloon or jet pack?

[Boreal]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

Public transportation + traffic = buses.

Public transportation - traffic = trains.

Unless it’s a street car like in Toronto, then everyone drives on train tracks.

[Boreal]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

So let’s spitball this. I live in the deep SE and I could drive to Say Johnson canyon to check out the ink pots or take the train.

. Leave my house at 6.15 to drive downtown to catch a 7.00 am train ( I have to pay to park in calgary)
. Train leaves downtown at 7. Stops in the NW, Morley and Canmore. So 30 to 45m in stopped time, plus about lest say 75minutes of rail time
. I have to then catch a shuttle to Johnson canyon - 30 to 45m
. So it is now what about 9.45 and I am at the trail head

Or I could leave directly from my house via a private vehicle and be at the trail head by 8.30

And with my own vehicle I likely have flexibility on when I want to leave. With the train, I am likely locked in leaving at a certain time and I have to catch a shuttle back to the train, then do the whole process in reverse.

So instead of being home by 4 it is likely more like 7.30.

Seems like an appealing way to spend a whole day.

Of course at this moment, driving is still reasonably cheap and my time has value. With the group in Ottawa, they are likely die to crank up taxes on gas, so maybe that changes things a bit.

This has epic boondoggle written all over it.

Why don’t you just drive to Waterton. It’s only a 30-40 minute difference than a drive to Banff.

You know, being that mega projects are all about you and your experience, and not about a massive influx of tourism dollars to experience the Rockies without a passenger vehicle or while being stuck in traffic.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Redliner

I knew the locomotive engineer who was killed in that wreck. The Transport Canada report on the accident has not been released yet, but a lot of things had to (and unfortunately did) go wrong in order for that to happen. Obviously when people lose their lives things get emotional and everyone wants someone to blame, but I would argue that railway companies in Canada are actually extremely safety-focused and that incidents like the Field Hill runaway are very much the exception to the rule. Mile for mile, rail transport is at least ten times safer than driving or flying.

Firstly, I’m sorry for your loss, I know some people who knew the victims as well, it was really a devastating situation.

I don’t disagree that rail safety has greatly improved, however I strongly disagree that it is because railway companies are “extremely safety-focused”. While many improvements have been made to industry safety standards, it isn’t the companies leading the charge, it’s their employees who fight to negotiate and recently even had to strike to get those improvements.

Most rail accidents are preventable, however changes to unsafe practices generally aren’t implemented until after something bad that could have been prevented happens. Lac-Mégantic is a good example of this.

[Boreal]

Originally Posted by GGG

Essentially people like trains because poor people take buses. That 50% of the reason is emotional not logical really is frustrating. I really struggle with government policy being based around people’s prejudices on the other hand whatever you invest in needs to be used so you have to take it into account.

No they don’t. In Toronto street cars and buses are one and the same and no one cares as long as it stays on schedule.

It is way more complex that your emotional oversimplified rhetoric. Mode is irrelevant, frequency and consistency in transit matter most so people can reliably predict and plan their daily movement with trust.

Frequency is what a passenger vehicle provide. You choose when you want to leave. Everyone’s frequency creates traffic.

However this is for municipal transportation networks.

Rail service to Banff isn’t municipal transportation.

It’s both region transportation and a recreational experience, especially for tourists coming into the region. It removes multiple barriers to experiencing the Rockies. Renting a car, riding a bus, sitting in traffic or navigating through traffic.

If someone lives far away from convenient rail access, move closer or drive. Enjoy parking and navigating traffic, if you don’t move.

These kinds of projects are what draw and retain a talented work force that will live in communities with enjoyable access to this kind of infrastructure.

[Northendzone]

Originally Posted by Boreal

Why don’t you just drive to Waterton. It’s only a 30-40 minute difference than a drive to Banff.

You know, being that mega projects are all about you and your experience, and not about a massive influx of tourism dollars to experience the Rockies without a passenger vehicle or while being stuck in traffic.

Google tells me Calgary to Waterton is 272k while calgary to banff is 129k - now i live in the deep SE, so getting to Wateton is a little easier for me but that is a massive driving day to go to waterton for the day.

i personally don't beleive that there is enough money out there to pay for and support this project without lots of subisidies - and like any subsidized programs you could argue wether or not it is worth it.

i wonder how many people would change their vacation plans if they knew there was a train available from calgary to banff. from what i have seen it would seem many of the asians that come to banff, are part of tours that travel via bus.

to me to make this really appealing for locals you will have to have a lot of bus options from the banff station.

to me part of the appeal/problem point that banff's proximity to calgary. to me jasper is way nicer, but it is a 4 hour drive from edmonton
, so jasper does not become as crowded with day trippers. i am trying to think of anotehr national park in canada that is so close to a major city and the only similar place i can think of is whistler - which seems to have a similar traffic challenge.

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by GGG

Essentially people like trains because poor people take buses. That 50% of the reason is emotional not logical really is frustrating. I really struggle with government policy being based around people’s prejudices on the other hand whatever you invest in needs to be used so you have to take it into account.

Trains are way more comfortable than buses. They are wider, longer, have better visibility, are smoother, get closer to nature outside of the city, easy to walk around - just a better overall experience. Most of the world uses trains and they aren’t limited to the non-poor.

All of the above is subjective - obviously they both get you from point A to point B. A train would be much more appealing to tourists IMO though.

[Sliver]

$100 says this won't happen within the next 15 years. If anybody wants to take the bet, I'm willing to bet up to three of you.

There is no way - on god's green earth - this is viable.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Sliver

$100 says this won't happen within the next 15 years. If anybody wants to take the bet, I'm willing to bet up to three of you.

There is no way - on god's green earth - this is viable.

The only way it happens is with a bunch of handouts. It runs for 5 years, fails, CP takes over the newly twinned track, and says "thankyouverymuch".

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

I think it would've had a way better chance if we'd done that whole "Olympics" thing.

[Boreal]

Originally Posted by Sliver

$100 says this won't happen within the next 15 years. If anybody wants to take the bet, I'm willing to bet up to three of you.

There is no way - on god's green earth - this is viable.

You’re right. It’s not like there has ever been passenger rail service from Calgary to Banff. Might as well go to the moon.

Why don’t you bet yourself and if you lose spend the $100 on a train ride?

[MoneyGuy]

Yeah, neither this flawed scheme nor the Edmonton-Calgary link are viable. I can’t believe people are serious about the Banff link, especially.

[BlackArcher101]

The question should be, how much money has the Waterous' donated to the UCP

[Flames0910]

Jeff Davison is campaigning on this now.

Not a fan of his stance on the green line but this would be a silver lining if he wins the mayor’s seat. Very interesting to see him make the comparison to the stampede (3x the economic benefit!). Pretty clear he sees the $$ signs… gotta pay for that new arena somehow!

https://twitter.com/user/status/1417553343132561410

[Ducay]

I disliked Jeff since I met him last election campaigning, sh*t like this makes me dislike him even more. We have such larger fish to fry than a rail link boondogle to Banff

[mrkajz44]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

The only way it happens is with a bunch of handouts. It runs for 5 years, fails, CP takes over the newly twinned track, and says "thankyouverymuch".

I really don't think we as an online Flames community are qualified to own and operate twinned train tracks.

[sleepingmoose]

It's honestly not even really a municipal issue - it's a Federal and Provincial one. So what he thinks or campaigns on doesn't really matter.

[peter12]

Buses beat out every form of public transportation except for subways.

[Suave]

No really seeing how it would spark $1.2 billion for Calgary, when Banff itself only generates $3 Billion in economic activity.