BC to become first province with prescribed safe supply

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

becasue the governments foray into pot has gone so well.....well i guess we will see where this goes. as a working taxpayer i hate the idea of funding this stuff, but i get there is a cost to not doing it as well.

all i can say is that between cries for UBI, $10/day daycare, government funded prescription durgs, dental care psot-secondary education etc how far are we away from marginal income tax rates of 80% or more given how far teh government is currently in the glue.

Hopefully close! All that stuff sounds fantastic.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

becasue the governments foray into pot has gone so well.....well i guess we will see where this goes. as a working taxpayer i hate the idea of funding this stuff, but i get there is a cost to not doing it as well.

all i can say is that between cries for UBI, $10/day daycare, government funded prescription durgs, dental care psot-secondary education etc how far are we away from marginal income tax rates of 80% or more given how far teh government is currently in the glue.

Has it gone poorly? I'd have thought they're bringing in more tax money than legalizing has cost. Also would figure there's less strain on police and the courts. And finally, normal guys like me are no longer criminals, which is my favourite part TBH.

[undercoverbrother]

I think this could be a good thing, especially if it facilitates help some individuals kick their habit through gradual reduction in strength of what they are using.

[PaperBagger'14]

Originally Posted by guzzy

what dispensary are you buying edibles from? The chocolates are usually around $4 and the gummies are $7-10. I have never seen a $15 edible.

I do agree price is a bit steep but it cuts down on my drinking.

Nova Cannabis, their website only shows 1 edible right now and it's a chocolate for $12. The blueberry gummies I used to buy were around the $15 mark.

https://novacannabisstore.com/pages/...on=baked-goods

[psyang]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

I think this could be a good thing, especially if it facilitates help some individuals kick their habit through gradual reduction in strength of what they are using.

I'm curious about this too. Does the program have any mandate to reduce usage, or is it only to ensure safe supply?

[TheIronMaiden]

A cost of care analysis will be very interesting.


I would imagine that the cost associated with responding to an epidemic of O.Ds will dwarf any cost associated with providing a safe supply.

[CroFlames]

I'm not too sure I'm a believer in this program. It just doesn't feel "right" for the government to be handing out hard drugs to people, but of course the situation is reaching a point where something needs to be done. Then I read this post:

Originally Posted by flames_fan_down_under

I am a firefighter in Vancouver and am face to face with the opioid epidemic at a level not many people can understand. It's hard to put into words how defeating this problem is, how all encompassing it can be sometimes, and how the ripple effect of this problem means high burnout rates with our partner agencies like paramedics and other first responders and less adequate resources and care for other people calling 911 who aren't overdosing. I am hopeful that this can do some help, but harm reduction measures like this and safe injection sites are just a bandaid masking so many other humongous problems that need to be tackled upstream, serious investments in mental health support, better treatment and support of those with chronic health issues that doesn't involve prescribing opioids, more supportive housing the list goes on and on. I am sure that this program aims to direct those on the safe supply to these supports. I guess when when you revive the same person who has overdosed three times in one day it's hard to get optimistic about these sorts of things.

and I know that something needs to be done, so it may as well be this. Likely not the silver bullet, but I'm glad we are starting to think outside the box.

Then I read this post.

Originally Posted by Yoho

Poor thing.
If the jobs too tough for you quit.

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

I'm not too sure I'm a believer in this program. It just doesn't feel "right" for the government to be handing out hard drugs to people, but of course the situation is reaching a point where something needs to be done.

This is where I'm at, too. There is something that really feels wrong about the gov't handing out hard drugs to addicts. I can't help but feel a bit of irk about 'muh tax dollarz!' going to 'this'. But...something needs to be done, and what we're doing now clearly isn't enough.

I just don't know how to feel about this. =/

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

This is where I'm at, too. There is something that really feels wrong about the gov't handing out hard drugs to addicts. I can't help but feel a bit of irk about 'muh tax dollarz!' going to 'this'. But...something needs to be done, and what we're doing now clearly isn't enough.

I just don't know how to feel about this. =/

It feels like this is a last resort to prevent them from getting poisoned to death on the streets. It needs to be paired with much better policy and support. This is trauma care, stop the bleeding at all costs. I'm OK with that. But in the medium and long term we need to do much better.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

This is where I'm at, too. There is something that really feels wrong about the gov't handing out hard drugs to addicts. I can't help but feel a bit of irk about 'muh tax dollarz!' going to 'this'. But...something needs to be done, and what we're doing now clearly isn't enough.

I just don't know how to feel about this. =/

I don't get the hesitation about the government handing out drugs. If it's cheaper than using healthcare and emergency services to deal with ODs, and the drugs are safer so there are fewer ODs in the first place, where's your concern? If it's about tax dollars, it seems to me the goal of this program is to reduce the spend and keep people safer and allow our resources to be used elsewhere. What's the downside?

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I don't get the hesitation about the government handing out drugs. If it's cheaper than using healthcare and emergency services to deal with ODs, and the drugs are safer so there are fewer ODs in the first place, where's your concern? If it's about tax dollars, it seems to me the goal of this program is to reduce the spend and keep people safer and allow our resources to be used elsewhere. What's the downside?

Perpetuating addiction. You can see in the short term it's a good policy. But the really tough work is getting people out of it. If you only hand out free drugs, well, that's just government enabling people to die as addicts later.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

becasue the governments foray into pot has gone so well.....well i guess we will see where this goes. as a working taxpayer i hate the idea of funding this stuff, but i get there is a cost to not doing it as well.

all i can say is that between cries for UBI, $10/day daycare, government funded prescription durgs, dental care psot-secondary education etc how far are we away from marginal income tax rates of 80% or more given how far teh government is currently in the glue.

The cost of the government supplying safe drugs is likely to be insignificant compared to the current cost of managing the problem. Will it work? Who knows.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Perpetuating addiction. You can see in the short term it's a good policy. But the really tough work is getting people out of it. If you only hand out free drugs, well, that's just government enabling people to die as addicts later.

Yeah but that is already widely accepted as a key piece of safe supply (getting people out of it). It’s at least half of the whole idea.

It IS the next step. If it doesn’t come to fruition than it’ll be a monumental failure.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Perpetuating addiction. You can see in the short term it's a good policy. But the really tough work is getting people out of it.

Well, part of the point is referring people to treatment, the goal of which is to get people out of it. I don't know if it will actually accomplish that, I think perhaps there's a whole sales job about the plan here that isn't coming across (here's how it will not only save lives but also money in both the short and long term, etc).

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I don't get the hesitation about the government handing out drugs. If it's cheaper than using healthcare and emergency services to deal with ODs, and the drugs are safer so there are fewer ODs in the first place, where's your concern? If it's about tax dollars, it seems to me the goal of this program is to reduce the spend and keep people safer and allow our resources to be used elsewhere. What's the downside?

Do we know that's the case?

I agree with others that something has to be done and if this will work, I'm all for it.
But I would be curious to see the financial projections of the plan.

Also are the safe drugs provided for free or the user has to purchase them?

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I don't get the hesitation about the government handing out drugs. If it's cheaper than using healthcare and emergency services to deal with ODs, and the drugs are safer so there are fewer ODs in the first place, where's your concern? If it's about tax dollars, it seems to me the goal of this program is to reduce the spend and keep people safer and allow our resources to be used elsewhere. What's the downside?

Speaking solely for myself...it feels like the government is using 'my' money to reward bad/addictive behavior. I realize that it's a 'me' issue, and that this is probably one of the better options to actually help these people.

I mean, I've been told all my life that drugs are bad. I've been through almost all of the 'war on drugs'. I've grown up through the "Just Say No" campaign. I've been told my entire life that if you are a drug addict, you are a bad person and it's your fault and you should feel bad about it.

And now, after 4.5 decades of that, the government is like "Nope, we've changed our minds. Let's give these addicts their drugs". So there's a part of me that's like "So now we're giving out free drugs? I've been told my entire life drugs are bad, and we're GIVING them out now? WTF?" Most of me realizes that that part of me is more hindbrain, but it's still there.

I realize that it's a sort of knee-jerk reaction in me, and I'm dealing with it. But that doesn't change how it feels right now. It kind of feels like I've spent my entire life being the 'good, responsible' child, and now my parents are asking me to loan my irresponsible ne'er-do-well brother MORE money, due to his bad decisions.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

I've been told my entire life that if you are a drug addict, you are a bad person and it's your fault and you should feel bad about it.

... Really? Have you been told similar things about alcoholism?

I understand a lot of this sentiment but thinking drug addicts are bad people because they're drug addicts makes zero sense to me.

[Scornfire]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

Speaking solely for myself...it feels like the government is using 'my' money to reward bad/addictive behavior. I realize that it's a 'me' issue, and that this is probably one of the better options to actually help these people.

I mean, I've been told all my life that drugs are bad. I've been through almost all of the 'war on drugs'. I've grown up through the "Just Say No" campaign. I've been told my entire life that if you are a drug addict, you are a bad person and it's your fault and you should feel bad about it.

And now, after 4.5 decades of that, the government is like "Nope, we've changed our minds. Let's give these addicts their drugs". So there's a part of me that's like "So now we're giving out free drugs? I've been told my entire life drugs are bad, and we're GIVING them out now? WTF?" Most of me realizes that that part of me is more hindbrain, but it's still there.

I realize that it's a sort of knee-jerk reaction in me, and I'm dealing with it. But that doesn't change how it feels right now. It kind of feels like I've spent my entire life being the 'good, responsible' child, and now my parents are asking me to loan my irresponsible ne'er-do-well brother MORE money, due to his bad decisions.

I can appreciate that there's some self awareness here. But ya, keep fighting that thought process.

[dammage79]

Being an addict can push you to do bad things to get your fix. Doesn't mean you're a bad person. You just in the grips of a serious addiction.

I have a few friends who have gone down the rabbit hole and aren't coming out. I still care for them but all I can do is help when I can in basic day to day stuff. Like clean their kitchen or laundry.

I have an open invitation to anyone that when they're ready to try and get put of it, I'll take em wherever they need to go and get them started.

Problem is, for some who are self medicating their mental health issues, they've already been rung through the government support system and come out worse than when they went in, with poor prescription monitoring, proper guidance and a administrative system that is compassionless for the most part. So they won't ask for help to clean up and just keep self medicating.

Clean safe drugs is probably the best the government can do right now because from what I've seen, nothing else they do seems to help.

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

... Really? Have you been told similar things about alcoholism?

Yes, actually. My parents were very much against 'choice' vices like drinking, smoking and drugs, and if you 'fell into that trap', it was your own fault and your responsibility to take care of. I realize my case is far from the norm in that regard.