2021 Blue Jays Season Thread - Page 123 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Wastedyouth · 06-01-2021, 08:38 AM

Hilarious that people are losing their minds so early in the season.

The Blue Jays have dealt with some pretty significant injuries, a very tough schedule and not playing at home in an actual MLB calibre stadium and are still very good and very competitive.

Maybe hold the phone on firing everyone into the sun just yet?

Enoch Root · 06-01-2021, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Until you get an in-depth behind the scenes reporter, this will always be speculation, so it's a fool's errand to try and answer it effectively, but you look at evidence of progression in young players. I'll just give one example: Vladimir Guerrero.

Yes, natural talent in spades, but he had a rough last year and wasn't anything special the year before that. I wouldn't doubt at all that Montoyo talked to him about his conditioning and off-season training regimen. Not only that, they worked with him to develop him into a 1st baseman instead of 3rd baseman. It's not easy to switch to first base on a whim, and he's been quite solid if not downright good this year at the position after being moved there at the last minute the previous year.

Then you get into his ridiculous batting stats and it's clear that Montoyo has helped him to reach his full potential. This isn't to say that Charlie is the reason Vladimir is successful because he has so much talent, but you could see that talent go to waste in previous years. I think you have to give the Jays coaching staff credit for getting him back on track and excelling, and that staff is led by Montoyo.

That's not getting into the progression or improvements to others in the organization since he arrived. Hell, even Grichuk looks like a different player now compared to when he came to the team.

Again, I'm of the opinion that they need a better strategist during games, but Montoyo does have value as a coach. He just might be a victim of the Peter Principle in this case.

Montoyo isn't the hitting coach. And it is impossible to say how much of the behind the scenes coaching falls to him.

However, let's assume it's a lot. Great - he should be a coach. None of that makes him a good manager. He is a terrible manager, and it is costing the team games. A young team that is trying to learn how to win.

Blaster86 · 06-01-2021, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

A young team that is trying to learn how to win.

Have they not been winning?

flames_fan_down_under · 06-01-2021, 03:22 PM

Taking out Ross Stripling who has an ERA of 5+ and using your best tools in the pen to lock down a victory makes sense to me. Who knows if Matz absolutely blows it in the afternoon then you're using a long man like Thornton and you don't even end up using Romano or Dolis. It didn't work out. Montoyo botched the second game by not having a guy warming up and leaving Chatwood in, and that was obvious. But I don't think taking out Stripling was a bad call, he has been pretty brutal all season and deserves a short leash.

transplant99 · 06-01-2021, 05:15 PM

Ray is DEALING...lol...like he is pissed off from his last start.

Good to see.

KootenayFlamesFan · 06-01-2021, 05:26 PM

This is the version of Ray that the fans like. He's not joking around so far.

Enoch Root · 06-01-2021, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blaster86

Have they not been winning?

lol

Does a team have to go 0-162 for the manager to be bad? Pretty sure you can contribute more than that.

KelVarnsen · 06-01-2021, 05:58 PM

Vladdy!

nixon45 · 06-01-2021, 05:58 PM

Vladdy!!!

First HR of the season in Buffalo of course it was him

Enoch Root · 06-01-2021, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flames_fan_down_under

Taking out Ross Stripling who has an ERA of 5+ and using your best tools in the pen to lock down a victory makes sense to me. Who knows if Matz absolutely blows it in the afternoon then you're using a long man like Thornton and you don't even end up using Romano or Dolis. It didn't work out. Montoyo botched the second game by not having a guy warming up and leaving Chatwood in, and that was obvious. But I don't think taking out Stripling was a bad call, he has been pretty brutal all season and deserves a short leash.

How he pitched in April is not as important as the fact that he gave up 1 run in his last 2 appearances, over about 11 innings.

And his pitch count was something like 68 IIRC.

Montoyo wasted a reliever, and it bit him in the ass in the 2nd game. It's pretty cut and dried, IMO.

transplant99 · 06-01-2021, 05:59 PM

Boom!!

Enoch Root · 06-01-2021, 05:59 PM

Vladdy!

This kid is pretty good.

flames_fan_down_under · 06-01-2021, 06:00 PM

Vladdy Jr!

flames_fan_down_under · 06-01-2021, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

How he pitched in April is not as important as the fact that he gave up 1 run in his last 2 appearances, over about 11 innings.

And his pitch count was something like 68 IIRC.

Montoyo wasted a reliever, and it bit him in the ass in the 2nd game. It's pretty cut and dried, IMO.

And yet they won that game and the series.

Enoch Root · 06-01-2021, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flames_fan_down_under

And yet they won that game and the series.

Also an empty retort.

The first game was won before (and regardless of) the decision to pull Stripling.

The second game was lost because of it. If they don't blow that game, they move back to within a half game of the Yankees. But Montoyo gave it away.

When you're in a division with Tampa, Boston and the Yankees, you can't just throw away wins like that.

Seriously, how can you defend it? It was stupid. Period. You can argue (wrongly, IMO) that he doesn't cost them many games, but there is no defending the decisions he made on Sunday.

Anyway, I have discussed this enough. Back to the Vladdy show!

Enoch Root · 06-01-2021, 06:10 PM

So Guerrero's stats so far this year:

HRs: 1st in the majors
Avg: 4th *
RBIs: 2nd
OBP: 2nd
SLG: 1st
OPS: 1st

Best hitter in baseball so far this year

* corrected

transplant99 · 06-01-2021, 06:11 PM

I think those of you that believe Montoya is mismanaging this club are nuts.

This is one of the youngest rosters in MLB and they have not played a real home game in 18 months, have oodles of injuries right now, yet are still in the race for the most difficult division in the AL.

Over the last 2 seasons they are a combined 59-53 with no games in Toronto and again one of the youngest teams around.

Montoya has made some mistakes for sure and last game was really odd but his body of work for what he has had to deal with is pretty friggin good.

Enoch Root · 06-01-2021, 06:15 PM

that's the same argument some were making for Ward: they have won some games, so what's the problem?

The problem is that they are not winning as many as they could be.

Enoch Root · 06-01-2021, 06:20 PM

The Jays have the 8th best record in the AL.

With 2 more wins so far, they would be in a playoff position right now.

If you want to make the playoffs, you can't give games away like that

holden · 06-01-2021, 06:41 PM

Good for Buffalo to show up for the game. Respect.