[PGT] Flames 1 - Oilers 4

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

Completely agree with the bolded, but thats one piece to this half finished puzzle. The biggest issue is that they have played like in must win games for the past few seasons now, the core group especially. This is under Peters, Ward and Sutter. This squad have no leadership or guys who can slog through the crap to win us games. I'm not sure how a full offseason to prepare is gonna change that.

I’ve thought the same thing as well. They need to find some winners in the offseason. Goal scorers yes. But a few players that would rather die than lose.

The team needs a few leaders.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by dino7c

WTF are you talking about...

I said they often control the play but can't bury their chances. Whoever scores the most deserves to win.

context we are talking about the last 10 games...Flames have out chanced and out possessed the other team in almost all of them but only won half...because they can't score

And that’s the GG argument.

Thinking they look better somehow but just can’t score

They are hanging on to the puck enough to please people who like holding the puck, but they aren’t being particularly dangerous

Heck, Smith went on 3 or 4 adventures and nobody was near the net to capitalize. But by golly if a puck was on the perimeter when Smith ####ed up, the Flames would have been on it

[memphusk]

This isn't on Darryl. This is on sitting on this mess of players for too long. Things are stale. Backlund, Monahan, Gaudreau, Giordano just doesn't work anymore.

[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by memphusk

This isn't on Darryl. This is on sitting on this mess of players for too long. Things are stale. Backlund, Monahan, Gaudreau, Giordano just doesn't work anymore.

I don’t agree with this..

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by 3rd liner

I am worried flames management will write this season off as an anomaly and not change much. Give the core another season. I can’t sit through another season like this.

This season is an anomaly but I highly doubt that will happen. This team has had three seasons starting with 2019 to do something and they've failed. The core has done nothing to convince management to give them another chance.

Strike 3, you're out!

[NewFan]

At least Sutter will demand these players to be the best possible shape when next season starts. Monahan wanted to become 2 way players and gained muscle but it made him slow. I think they need clear goal when they come back next season if they are not traded.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

And that’s the GG argument.

Thinking they look better somehow but just can’t score

They are hanging on to the puck enough to please people who like holding the puck, but they aren’t being particularly dangerous

Heck, Smith went on 3 or 4 adventures and nobody was near the net to capitalize. But by golly if a puck was on the perimeter when Smith ####ed up, the Flames would have been on it

I don't think you understand my "argument" at all

They are statistically out chancing the other team but scoring less goals. The point is the team D has improved drastically under Sutter.

They need more players who can score easily and don't need 15 chances

They are losing games 2-1 because they can't score...its not even debatable

Markstrom's goals against is under 2 in the last 10...5 wins (there's your problem)

[memphusk]

Originally Posted by SeanCharles

I don’t agree with this..

What have these guys done? Yes they put up points but they don't help the team win. They aren't the right mix anymore. It just happens. Like a fart that hangas around too long. All good at first but Jesus it becomes stale.

[Manhattanboy]

Originally Posted by dino7c

I don't think you understand my "argument" at all

They are statistically out chancing the other team but scoring less goals. The point is the team D has improved drastically under Sutter.

They need more players who can score easily and don't need 15 chances

They are losing games 2-1 because they can't score...its not even debatable

Markstrom's goals against is under 2 in the last 10...5 wins (there's your problem)

So true. In Vancouver Markstrom had forwards who could score.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by dino7c

I don't think you understand my "argument" at all

They are statistically out chancing the other team but scoring less goals. The point is the team D has improved drastically under Sutter.

They need more players who can score easily and don't need 15 chances

They are losing games 2-1 because they can't score...its not even debatable

Markstrom's goals against is under 2 in the last 10...5 wins (there's your problem)

You are likely right, if there’s an argument I may not get it 100%

I understand that the D has improved. I agree there for sure

I don’t think though that they are “out playing” teams, and they do suck offensively

It’s not like they are awesome but snake bitten, they are the Brent Sutter years 1 and 3 brand of awful

[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by memphusk

What have these guys done? Yes they put up points but they don't help the team win. They aren't the right mix anymore. It just happens. Like a fart that hangas around too long. All good at first but Jesus it becomes stale.

I highlighted Gaudreau.. I’m not arguing with you about the rest.

I think he could be part of the solution.

He, Lindholm and Mangiapane have been our best forwards all season.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

You are likely right, if there’s an argument I may not get it 100%

I understand that the D has improved. I agree there for sure

I don’t think though that they are “out playing” teams, and they do suck offensively

It’s not like they are awesome but snake bitten, they are the Brent Sutter years 1 and 3 brand of awful

I literally said get some new players who can score

Outplaying in terms of scoring chances and possession...Flames have a higher expected goals almost every game but players are missing open nets not from bad luck but because they aren't good shooters.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by dino7c

I literally said get some new players who can score

Outplaying in terms of scoring chances and possession...Flames have a higher expected goals almost every game but players are missing open nets not from bad luck but because they aren't good shooters.

Ugh

Expected goals is a phantom stat

Best used in hindsight

[nik-]

Originally Posted by dino7c

I literally said get some new players who can score

Outplaying in terms of scoring chances and possession...Flames have a higher expected goals almost every game but players are missing open nets not from bad luck but because they aren't good shooters.

Maybe another good indication that these stats aren't all they're cracked up to be.

[dino7c]

I see its a pitchforks only kinda night

pretty obvious to me lack of offence is the Flames biggest need...they allow the least goals in the league over 10 games and still lose 5 of them

System if fine...find some players who can put the puck in the net

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

It’s not the team quality, it’s the team atmosphere I’m concerned about. You can learn a losing attitude (look up north).

I'm looking up north, and I see a team that's 30-17-2. Where's the losing attitude?

[nik-]

Originally Posted by dino7c

I see its a pitchforks only kinda night

pretty obvious to me lack of offence is the Flames biggest need...they allow the least goals in the league over 10 games and still lose 5 of them

System if fine...find some players who can put the puck in the net

Why wouldn't it be pitchforks? Excavating positives in yet another consistently bad season was four years ago territory, not at this point in a project.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by dino7c

I see its a pitchforks only kinda night

pretty obvious to me lack of offence is the Flames biggest need...they allow the least goals in the league over 10 games and still lose 5 of them

System if fine...find some players who can put the puck in the net

So…

- “system” is perfect for reducing goals against
- failure to score has nothing to do with “system”

One of the worst defensive teams now has the players to defend, but in light of reduced offence, don’t have the players to score?

That’s not pitchforks, friend, it’s trying to discuss whether “system” is enough

Hint : see scoreboard

[memphusk]

Originally Posted by SeanCharles

I highlighted Gaudreau.. I’m not arguing with you about the rest.

I think he could be part of the solution.

He, Lindholm and Mangiapane have been our best forwards all season.

Of course he could, But it won't be him. He looks homesick. The fun isn't there anymore.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

I'm looking up north, and I see a team that's 30-17-2. Where's the losing attitude?

1 playoff appearance in 15 years is likely what he is talking about and really they won a lottery that has moved them from terrible to mediocre