2021 Off season: You're in charge, what would you do?

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by blender

Lots of good comments in this thread.
One thing that I think many of us are overlooking in our desire for change is the risk of the team getting worse.

As a fan, I do not regard finishing 28th in the league as a worse outcome than finishing 20th. Especially if it means better odds of drafting top prospects. I’d honestly prefer Ottawa’s roster and place in the standings to the Flames right now.

[Poe969]

Agreed, we're arguably in one of the worse positions and have been for a long time. Not good enough to make the playoffs but not bad enough to get a high end prospect. I'll take finishing 31st overall over 17th overall...especially these next 2 years.

[MrMike]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

As a fan, I do not regard finishing 28th in the league as a worse outcome than finishing 20th. Especially if it means better odds of drafting top prospects. I’d honestly prefer Ottawa’s roster and place in the standings to the Flames right now.

And I’d prefer watching a hopeful young roster rather that underperforming vets.
Give me 3-5 years of that and ten good years following it over consistent mediocrity.

[Toonage]

I'm in charge? Well, after watching him execute the trades of the only players I was comfortable with him moving and having previously made sure I got the coach I wanted, correcting that mistake I'd thank Brad Treliving for his time and his efforts and wish him well in his future endeavors.

I'd then get on the horn with the guy Darryl Sutter likely speaks to on a routine basis, Dean Lombardi, and bring him on board in the same role Treliving held. GM with full autonomy.

Get that done immediately once the season ends.

Then I'd probably hop on my rich guy jet and do rich guy stuff.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by blender

Agreed, and it is annoying that for the last 2 years you couldn't read any article about him that didn't refer him as future captain. Like its his birthright.

Another fun bit of info. We all know about his dad being an ex NHler , him growing up around the rink his whole life, seeing first hand what it’s like, yadda yadda

For as much as his father had a long career and regular season success (1065 points in 1202 games, .89 points per game) he also dropped off in the playoffs (.63 points per game)

I understand he was tough in contract negotiations as well. At least Keith earned his cheque during the regular season when he was getting paid

I do not see how this ends nicely. Brad has painted himself into a corner and the player gives the impression he is bigger than the team.

On topic of the thread, I’d have had Brad turn over the keys the day the Flames were mathematically eliminated. Someone else needs to start fixing this

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Toonage

I'm in charge? Well, after watching him execute the trades of the only players I was comfortable with him moving and having previously made sure I got the coach I wanted, correcting that mistake I'd thank Brad Treliving for his time and his efforts and wish him well in his future endeavors.

I'd then get on the horn with the guy Darryl Sutter likely speaks to on a routine basis, Dean Lombardi, and bring him on board in the same role Treliving held. GM with full autonomy.

Get that done immediately once the season ends.

Then I'd probably hop on my rich guy jet and do rich guy stuff.

I feel like if significant change is going to come to the roster it will be with Treliving at the helm. I feel like a GM change will result in the “evaluation period” where that new GM wants to understand the org from the inside so I doubt someone new comes in and blows it up with the exception of Lombardi who I think has the type of relationship with Sutter that he would come in and make major changes to try and build a group that Daryl can win with.

Conroy, Pascal, Maloney also do not need the evaluation period so there are potentially 4 options to move on from Treliving and still make sweeping changes to the roster.

If the mandate is to win and the new GM does not get to pick a coach then I think it will be a job that is tough to attract the top candidates. Lombardi makes a lot of sense if they do go in another direction

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by TOfan

well, what were the other offers for Brodie? we don't know.

I'm speculating, actions speak louder than words kinda thing, but it seems to me Treliving was prioritizing the acquisition of a 2C. were there any other centermen dealt that offseason through to the 2020 TDL? If so, what was the package that acquired said 2C? Did the other team want a D like Toronto did? Did Valamaki's injury change the Flames position at all?

You need two GM's to agree to a trade. Treliving doesn't get to pluck whomever he wants from other teams rosters.

I don't recall saying he could pluck who he wanted. I gave an example of a team that had a deal fall apart and in short order, they were still able to accomplish their objectives.

Part of the skill of being a GM is being able to get things done isn't it?

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

I feel like if significant change is going to come to the roster it will be with Treliving at the helm. I feel like a GM change will result in the “evaluation period” where that new GM wants to understand the org from the inside so I doubt someone new comes in and blows it up with the exception of Lombardi who I think has the type of relationship with Sutter that he would come in and make major changes to try and build a group that Daryl can win with.

Conroy, Pascal, Maloney also do not need the evaluation period so there are potentially 4 options to move on from Treliving and still make sweeping changes to the roster.

If the mandate is to win and the new GM does not get to pick a coach then I think it will be a job that is tough to attract the top candidates. Lombardi makes a lot of sense if they do go in another direction

I expect a roster change, but nothing more substantial than 1 or 2 players. I don't think a new GM with the direction of ownership and the scouting report of a trusted friend/coach in Sutter and understanding of the market and read on players would have much difficulty or would need much time to make decisions for the franchise. Especially in Lombardi's case, coming from Philadelphia where many (myself included) think a Gaudreau deal for example could come to fruition.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

This kind of reinforces the notion that a change at the top can provide a positive jolt to the organization.

Treliving is not incompetent or dumb but just like the roster, it doesn't seem like it's working.

Two offseasons ago, the Leafs were looking to move Kadri for defense help. They had a trade with Calgary for Brodie but it fell apart. The next day they move him to CO.

Meanwhile Calgary goes into the next season with the same roster as the prior year and end up losing Brodie and Jankowski for nothing. Not ideal.

Oh, I’ve been pretty consistent: it’s a results oriented business, so I have no problem with axes falling, either with Ward or with Treliving, even if I happen to disagree with various ales on what they were or were not doing wrong. With Treliving, I could see the point of every single move he made. The two biggest mistakes he made for me were not mistakes in assessing what was needed, but more on picking the wrong player to acquire for that need (and even there, there were arguments in favour of the player and hindsight is working hard for some people).

[Vinny01]

I agree Lombardi makes a lot of sense but I also think we are looking at more than 1-2 player turnover.

[CalgaryFan1988]

Originally Posted by Goriders

I’d try and see if I could get anything for monahan, tkachuk or anderson.

This is the attitude I don't get.

Do you think it's possible you can't get anything for either of those 3 players?

Do you think they would clear waivers?

I mean, of course they can get something for them and we can not sell for pennies on the dollar.

With that attitude, I'm starting to understand how so many people trade their cars in every 2 years and end up going bankrupt.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Oh, I’ve been pretty consistent: it’s a results oriented business, so I have no problem with axes falling, either with Ward or with Treliving, even if I happen to disagree with various ales on what they were or were not doing wrong. With Treliving, I could see the point of every single move he made. The two biggest mistakes he made for me were not mistakes in assessing what was needed, but more on picking the wrong player to acquire for that need (and even there, there were arguments in favour of the player and hindsight is working hard for some people).

I too find that watching this team is often best with various ales

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

I too find that watching this team is often best with various ales

God, that was supposed to say “takes”. How did that even happen?

[Toonage]

We watch the Flames, drinking is always on the mind

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

This is the attitude I don't get.

Do you think it's possible you can't get anything for either of those 3 players?

Do you think they would clear waivers?

I mean, of course they can get something for them and we can not sell for pennies on the dollar.

With that attitude, I'm starting to understand how so many people trade their cars in every 2 years and end up going bankrupt.

Can you imagine the vultures that would circle if you made it clear you were trading everyone. The stink bids you’d get?

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I don't recall saying he could pluck who he wanted. I gave an example of a team that had a deal fall apart and in short order, they were still able to accomplish their objectives.

Part of the skill of being a GM is being able to get things done isn't it?

Well Dubas got it done but that was a bad deal for the Leafs. Kerfoot is a mediocre player with a 3.5M cap hit and Barrie walked for nothing and the Leafs missed the playoffs last year. They were able to get their guy in Brodie at the end of the day.

Would you have been happier if Treliving pivoted from that deal and made a bad trade?

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Can you imagine the vultures that would circle if you made it clear you were trading everyone. The stink bids you’d get?

That’s where Tre has to promote the Sam Bennett result

“See how Bennett’s doing in Florida? Imagine what Matthew Tkachuk can do for you!”

(Not sure how he attracts *any* players to Calgary though when basically admitting that this is where people underachieve)

[nik-]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

That’s where Tre has to promote the Sam Bennett result

“See how Bennett’s doing in Florida? Imagine what Matthew Tkachuk can do for you!”

(Not sure how he attracts *any* players to Calgary though when basically admitting that this is where people underachieve)

Brad Treliving shouldn't be doing anything else but getting fired.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Oh, I’ve been pretty consistent: it’s a results oriented business, so I have no problem with axes falling, either with Ward or with Treliving, even if I happen to disagree with various ales on what they were or were not doing wrong. With Treliving, I could see the point of every single move he made. The two biggest mistakes he made for me were not mistakes in assessing what was needed, but more on picking the wrong player to acquire for that need (and even there, there were arguments in favour of the player and hindsight is working hard for some people).

Sure, but that is a very low bar wouldn't you agree? I believe, Treliving is a smart guy and he doesn't do things without some reason. But you could look at every single pro sports transaction and in the vast majority of cases. argue the reason for why it was done by both sides.

The successful teams do it better.

For example I understand why he traded a 3rd for Bollig. IMO it doesn't make it a smart deal. I also understand why Boston moved on from Dougie Hamilton, which doesn't mean it wasn't a great deal for the Flames.

[the_only_turek_fan]

A small part of me thinks we are not going to get the massive overhaul that we all think is going to happen.

I would not be surprised if this team is the exact same come October.