Treliving on the Fan

[Red]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Flames would be better off if Treliving hadn’t inherited players like Gaudreau, Monahan, Gio, Backlund, Brodie, Ferland etc?

I can’t buy that. He wasn’t exactly saddled with those guys.

Some of these guys should have been traded a long time ago, when they had value. Sean Monahan was never a great player. He was always a one trick pony, now his only trick is missing leaving us with a useless player.
Johnny always played scared.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Feaster’s teams never made the POs. And he was incompetent. As in “didn’t know the rules despite his law degree” incompetent.

The “core pieces” Feaster drafted and left are the two guys people complain the most about. The ones most responsible for the country club atmosphere. His other draft picks and trade acquisitions? Laughable. Literally, in the case of Janko. Other teams laughed at that pick.

At least Treliving brought in the guys that people still like - Tanev, Ryan, Mangiapane, Hanifin, Lindholm, Lucic, Dube.

Yes, Feaster was startlingly incompetent. One for one in coaching hires, I suppose

Yes Brad has added some good pieces

And yet Brad seems to have built a losing culture and arguably the most underachieving team we have seen, individually and collectively

[ricardodw]

With the fall off of Gaudreau and Monahan and Gio and basically the whole of the core I would guess that the team needs mentally stronger players.

Monahan when drafted by the Flames went off and put on weight and came to training camp ready to play in the NHL. That was an enormous accomplishment that required an extreme focus and dedication to the game

Fast forward 8 years and 31 million dollars USD it appears the drive is gone.

The bulk of the Flames roster is populated by extremely financially secure people.

The hardest working most engaged Flames imho seem to be Mangiapane, Dube and Lucic.

Mangiapane is close to reaching financially security. 3.3 M so far. If Dube were not to play in the NHL anymore he would likely have to go find a real job. Lucic is the consummate professional. He probably picked that up in Boston.

The coaches and management need to get the players to put the team first. That doesn't seem to be the case with the Flames.

Sutter knows the power of Team and will likely advise to bring in players that might not be as talented but more committed to team.

[calumniate]

4th liner on the 1st line. Monahan probably injured. Gaudreau is on an island by himself right now.. if you ask me he should play with backs and eat bread.. or frigging any other combination of players. His stock and any good will towards the flames is plummeting right now

[ricardodw]

Tre should be fired for his handling of Bennett. When Bennett came out and asked to be traded and the Flames basically agreed that became an season ender.

The rest of the team watched what was going on with Bennett and probably were not impressed. He finished last season as the Flames #1C in important games and came back as a 3-4 winger.

Half the team was going WTF and figuring Bennett was bailing on the team and the other half would have been thinking they could be treated as badly as him.

The coach got fired. It became Tre's problem when the trade me request came in and was made public and he screwed the pooch.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by calumniate

4th liner on the 1st line. Monahan probably injured. Gaudreau is on an island by himself right now.. if you ask me he should play with backs and eat bread.. or frigging any other combination of players. His stock and any good will towards the flames is plummeting right now

If you were Gaudreau, where the team was letting you get slashed and hacked and pushed around for couple of years you would be wondering what sort of team you want to play on the year after next.

Putting Ritchie on his line probably was the Flames direct response to his complaints and what could be done to make him happy.

[agulati]

If Monahan is indeed injured, shut him down for the year. It makes no sense to stretch it, with our chances at the post season almost done mathematically. If he is to regain some value (either in trade or in continuing with the team) it would be better the sooner he gets a surgery. It will give him good amount of time to recover.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

He finished last season as the Flames #1C in important games and came back as a 3-4 winger.

Our #1C who was not getting top defensive competition, and was playing alongside noted wingers Milan Lucic and Dillon Dube?



Bennett is a mecurial player. It's probably related to reffing and confidence why he gets better in the playoffs. But let's not pretend Bennett is a playoff monster who can put us on his back and will us to series wins like an actual #1C could. That is how people around here define #1C right? Bennett has never done that either. And worse, Bennett is one of the worst players in the entire nhl during the regular season.

[GioforPM]

Bennett is better in the POs and he does elevate somewhat, but his PO play is hugely overstated. He can get away with a lot more, and he had a bunch of points off of stuffing in 3rd attempt rebounds, and similar plays. Dube impressed me more last POs.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Lol he was on waiver

Kylington is done as a Flames as soon as somebody wants him

They may not even resign him this summer

People seem to really struggle understanding what it takes to make a waiver claim.
- cap space
- team space

You can’t just claim a guy if your team and taxi squad are full. You’d have to put a guy on waivers... and it would have to be the NEXT DAY. So, too late. He’s cleared. Making waiver claims isn’t some super easy thing to do where every team can pluck a guy they like. More likely than not you would need to make an internal move first. This is why, even in typical years, we see people clear waivers and then get traded.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Bennett is better in the POs and he does elevate somewhat, but his PO play is hugely overstated. He can get away with a lot more, and he had a bunch of points off of stuffing in 3rd attempt rebounds, and similar plays. Dube impressed me more last POs.

Yeah, it is funny how perceptions are formed: playoff beast Sam Bennett over his career has -2 points and +3 EVS points in 30 playoff games than utterly useless playoff-performer Sean Monahan.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Yeah, it is funny how perceptions are formed: playoff beast Sam Bennett over his career has -2 points and +3 EVS points in 30 playoff games than utterly useless playoff-performer Sean Monahan.

He just needs better line mates or a new coach.

He is on his usual 20something point pace once again which is actually not as bad as usual when compared to the rest of the dead weight on the club.

What a complete cluster fata things are.

There are more than a couple guys on this team that are candidates for change of scenery stuff....he would be right near the top behind Johnny.

[Strange Brew]

How much better off would this team be if Gaudreau had requested a trade over a year ago.

[Erick Estrada]

Playoff Bennet doesn't change the fact that Sam is a bust. It happens. Certainly not going to blame the GM for that one as THN and others had him ranked as the top prospect that draft. Could the Flames have done a better job developing him? Probably but the player himself just hasn't translated to the NHL. I really hoped he could turn the corner but its just not going to happen at last in Calgary. If Treliving can get anything for him at the deadline that would be great but if Seattle takes him in the expansion draft I'm also good with that as it's just time to move on.

I will say one thing when it comes to amateur scouting. When you hear the phrase "he's like a bull in a china shop" used on a top prospect run, run far away. Players like Yakupov and Bennett with okay skills that skate well and are physical can dominate junior players only to be rendered as average or below average players against men.

[keenan87]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Playoff Bennet doesn't change the fact that Sam is a bust. It happens. Certainly not going to blame the GM for that one as THN and others had him ranked as the top prospect that draft. Could the Flames have done a better job developing him? Probably but the player himself just hasn't translated to the NHL. I really hoped he could turn the corner but its just not going to happen at last in Calgary. If Treliving can get anything for him at the deadline that would be great but if Seattle takes him in the expansion draft I'm also good with that as it's just time to move on.

I will say one thing when it comes to amateur scouting. When you hear the phrase "he's like a bull in a china shop" used on a top prospect run, run far away. Players like Yakupov and Bennett with okay skills that skate well and are physical can dominate junior players only to be rendered as average or below average players against men.

I don't like Treliving as a GM but I will completely agree with this. I was ecstatic when the Flames drafted Bennett.

My disappointment is that Sam Bennett should have been traded this past off-season. Many people (including myself) bet that he would not be able to replicate his playoffs in the regular season and that is exactly what happened. His value was the highest it had been over the past few years and the GM was not able to capitalize. We are now at the point where many would be happy to get anything for him.

[nieuwy-89]

I just finished reading Brian Burke's book and one of his rules is that if a player requests a trade, he will grant it. But that player will not play any more games for his team.

They should have shelved Bennett as soon as his trade request went public. His play this season has not improved his value. If anything they would have been best by having "playoff Sam" as the last impression the league got of him.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by keenan87

I don't like Treliving as a GM but I will completely agree with this. I was ecstatic when the Flames drafted Bennett.

My disappointment is that Sam Bennett should have been traded this past off-season. Many people (including myself) bet that he would not be able to replicate his playoffs in the regular season and that is exactly what happened. His value was the highest it had been over the past few years and the GM was not able to capitalize. We are now at the point where many would be happy to get anything for him.

I very seriously doubt it. I tend to think that there are very few surprises in the NHL, and also that player values do not fluctuate as dramatically as fans imagine. GMs know who Sam Bennett is, and they have for a while.

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[CliffFletcher]

Bennet should have been traded when it became evident he would not be a scorer at the NHL level - which was three seasons ago. Since then, they’ve been trying to turn him into a two-way player, with zero success. But even if it had worked (which was always a long-shot, given his thick-skulled stubbornness), the kind of player they wanted to turn him into is easily available through UFA signings.

Bennet is the worst example of overvaluing a player in the Treliving era. Knowing what they knew about Bennett, they should have moved him back when they could have got some value back in return. Ottawa didn’t hesitate to move a recent first-rounder in Lazar when they saw he wouldn’t pan out. Neither did the Islanders with Reinhart. There’s no excuse for letting Bennett’s value decrease to close to zero.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Bennet should have been traded when it became evident he would not be a scorer at the NHL level - which was three seasons ago. Since then, they’ve been trying to turn him into a two-way player, with zero success.

Three years ago maybe they did shop him and didn't get much interest but if Treliving traded Bennett for a second three years ago then people would have been pissed. Reinhart was a bad trade the day it was made and I don't think a real comparable as Chiarelli was off his rocker.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by nieuwy-89

I just finished reading Brian Burke's book and one of his rules is that if a player requests a trade, he will grant it. But that player will not play any more games for his team.

They should have shelved Bennett as soon as his trade request went public. His play this season has not improved his value. If anything they would have been best by having "playoff Sam" as the last impression the league got of him.

Agree 100%.

In fact I believe there is a split in the room because of it.

It may be entirely coincidence but the club was 4-3-1 when the request happened IIRC. Then he was sat for a game or 2.

Since that time, they are 11-16-2 i believe.

They certainly do not play for one another which is a huge indication there is no chemistry and probably friction within. Maybe its not Bennett still being here but it 's something.


Darryl will identify it and Treliving will address it....just not going to make a difference for this season but hopefully cleans the slate for next year.