Brad Treliving needs to go

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

You are not supposed to vote yet, old man.

Voter Suppression!

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by troutman

Voter Suppression!

Mail in votes don't count.

[GioforPM]

"Should be but won't"

Should be ONLY because of a "buck stops here" notion. I really think his lack of success is mostly down to events beyond his control. Won't be because it seems pretty useless to fire him with a year left and no real prospect to move forward other than trying to dump assets and rebuild, which he can do.

I think Treliving's actual errors are Neal, Hamonic (but both can be rationalized easily) and arguably his coaching hire decisions, though the process I had the biggest issue with got them Peters and he had the best results.

The fundamental problems with the team, though, actually pre-existed Treliving and unless he was willing to trade Gaudreau, Monahan, Backlund, Bennett and even Giordano much earlier, very difficult to address.

[FlamesAddiction]

It could be worse is what I keep telling myself, but it is time for a change. He won't go down as a terrible GM and when his time is up here, he might even get a chance somewhere else. But now that things seem to have come full circle and a new plan is needed, it's time to bring in someone else.

I wonder if Darryl Sutter becomes the first head coach that gets to pick who his GM is. Honestly, I think that is the only thing that complicates it. A new GM should be able to pick the head coach and with Sutter just being hired on a three year deal, he is unfireable at this time. The only way to make sure that the coach and GM are on the same page is to allow Sutter a veto in who would replace Treliving.

If he does get let go, I think it won't be until the season ends.

[Jacks]

Not sure what to pick. He should be if a better candidate is available, shouldn't be if they don't have a decent successor. Don't think he will be any time soon.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

"Should be but won't"

Should be ONLY because of a "buck stops here" notion. I really think his lack of success is mostly down to events beyond his control. Won't be because it seems pretty useless to fire him with a year left and no real prospect to move forward other than trying to dump assets and rebuild, which he can do.

I think Treliving's actual errors are Neal, Hamonic (but both can be rationalized easily) and arguably his coaching hire decisions, though the process I had the biggest issue with got them Peters and he had the best results.

The fundamental problems with the team, though, actually pre-existed Treliving and unless he was willing to trade Gaudreau, Monahan, Backlund, Bennett and even Giordano much earlier, very difficult to address.

I keep asking myself where this core would have been with better coaching hires right after Hartley. Getting the right coach in place instead of Gulutzan might have helped guide them through some of the difficulties they've had in pressure situations and playoff series. Instead these guys look like they've been scarred for life and lost all confidence over the years. I don't think you can understate how bad Treliving's coaching selections were. I love the Sutter hire but it came way too late for this core.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Igottago

I've been pretty big critic of Tre but I just don't see him going off with a bunch of desperate trades. He strikes me as a level headed guy who will do the best he can for the long term health of the team.

That being said, his time with this rebuild has ultimately failed. The results aren't there and culminating in a season like this, I just don't see how you could possibly let the guy continue. Who knows what the Flames will do though. I think there's a very strong chance there's a new GM this offseason.

Treliving has two years left on his deal after this one, I believe. In a year where there was 0 gate and concession revenues I would be pretty surprised if Treliving is let go. And if he is let go, is he the only one? Does Conroy go? Maloney? Any scouts? Not only are the owners paying the remaining term on those contacts, they are paying for their replacements. If the intent was to bring in a new GM, then why not when Sutter was hired? Why not fire Treliving then and name Malony or Conroy interim GM?

Treliving will get this offseason and next year to correct course. Sacking with with one more year left is far more palatable and consistent with how many teams across the league handle their business.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

The fundamental problems with the team, though, actually pre-existed Treliving and unless he was willing to trade Gaudreau, Monahan, Backlund, Bennett and even Giordano much earlier, very difficult to address.

The thing we'll never know is if he was actually willing, but ownership wasn't (primarily relating to 13 and 23...I doubt he ever wanted to trade Gio, and the others he could've done if he wanted to).

Did ownership want to hear the truth, or want to hear what they wanted to hear (we can make the playoffs then anything can happen)?

I blame Burke for setting the course way too early. I want to blame BT for not correcting course sooner, but I can't be sure whether he wanted to or not.

[dammage79]

I dont know what's going tobhappen once this thing called a season wraps up. I'm curious how much leeway Tree will get during the covid era. Or has their olan always been ride with tree into the new arena?

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Very early in the poll, but looks like a lot here believe he'll be back either way. I think he will be too. The question isn't if he'll make moves, it's who and how many. I think this thing will be blown up, and I think even if he doesn't hit home runs with trades in the offseason there's going to be a lot of addition by subtraction.

[genetic_phreek]

I think Treliving is done here. He had a chance to hire Sutter in the summer and didn't, somehow I feel the ownership forced his hand to do so. Also the fact he hasn't made any trades, I doubt he's going to have a chance to do off season moves and drafting.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

The thing we'll never know is if he was actually willing, but ownership wasn't (primarily relating to 13 and 23...I doubt he ever wanted to trade Gio, and the others he could've done if he wanted to).

Did ownership want to hear the truth, or want to hear what they wanted to hear (we can make the playoffs then anything can happen)?

I blame Burke for setting the course way too early. I want to blame BT for not correcting course sooner, but I can't be sure whether he wanted to or not.

I doubt anyone seriously thought about trading those two guys. Until last year they both kept trending up. Each of them still have defenders who, especially with Gaudreau, insist he's an elite guy who's being held back. The hue and cry over trading either would be incredible - just trading Sven broke this board.

[Erick Estrada]

If the economy was rosier and we weren't in a pandemic I feel ownership would probably fire him based on this disaster of a season and the team trending down over a long tenure. I just don't think they have an appetite to pay him and a new GM when they are paying two head coaches as well.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

If the economy was rosier and we weren't in a pandemic I feel ownership would probably fire him based on this disaster of a season and the team trending down over a long tenure. I just don't think they have an appetite to pay him and a new GM when they are paying two head coaches as well.

For me it’s all about how he executes here at the trade deadline.

No excuses, maximize returns and begin the new era.

Retain on Gio and Johnny, get good returns.

Absolutely no excuses anymore. “Oh times are tough - hard to do a deal in-season”...we heard that last season, yet other teams made moves. Treliving has been an inadequate manager in-season for multiple years at this stage. He needs to execute and show that he’s a GM worth keeping around. It’s a competition between him and the other 31 GMs in the league (Seattle included). Start executing like a top-16 GM, and perhaps the team’s results will start reflecting that.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

The thing we'll never know is if he was actually willing, but ownership wasn't (primarily relating to 13 and 23...I doubt he ever wanted to trade Gio, and the others he could've done if he wanted to).

Did ownership want to hear the truth, or want to hear what they wanted to hear (we can make the playoffs then anything can happen)?

I blame Burke for setting the course way too early. I want to blame BT for not correcting course sooner, but I can't be sure whether he wanted to or not.

Yeah, I keep coming back to this as well. Part of my reluctance to see Treliving replaced is that I have no confidence that another GM will have either the will or the strength to convince ownership to change course. Based on what I have heard, Treliving has amassed a lot of good will with ownership, and I think that if anyone could convince them to start aggressively building through the draft, he is probably the guy to do it.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

The thing we'll never know is if he was actually willing, but ownership wasn't (primarily relating to 13 and 23...I doubt he ever wanted to trade Gio, and the others he could've done if he wanted to).

Did ownership want to hear the truth, or want to hear what they wanted to hear (we can make the playoffs then anything can happen)?

I blame Burke for setting the course way too early. I want to blame BT for not correcting course sooner, but I can't be sure whether he wanted to or not.

Another thing that hasn't really been brought up, unless I missed it, but I wonder if we get to a point where Treliving leaves due to a philosophical differing of opinions. I look to Linden leaving the Canucks and Hextall leaving/dismissal from the Flyers. In both instances it was speculated that Linden and Hextall did not think there teams were ready to enter 'win now' mode while ownership saw it different.

To date it seems like the direction of ownership has been to make the playoffs and compete and it appears Treliving has accommodated that. I do wonder though if he begins to see it differently and decides to excuse himself.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

For me it’s all about how he executes here at the trade deadline.

No excuses, maximize returns and begin the new era.

Retain on Gio and Johnny, get good returns.

Absolutely no excuses anymore. “Oh times are tough - hard to do a deal in-season”...we heard that last season, yet other teams made moves. Treliving has been an inadequate manager in-season for multiple years at this stage. He needs to execute and show that he’s a GM worth keeping around. It’s a competition between him and the other 31 GMs in the league (Seattle included). Start executing like a top-16 GM, and perhaps the team’s results will start reflecting that.

TDL is too soon. He needs the offseason. I doubt there is going to be a strong trade market at this years TDL, it's not the time to maximize return on core parts. Sell off the expiring contracts, retain salary if it helps get more back.

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

Very early in the poll, but looks like a lot here believe he'll be back either way. I think he will be too. The question isn't if he'll make moves, it's who and how many. I think this thing will be blown up, and I think even if he doesn't hit home runs with trades in the offseason there's going to be a lot of addition by subtraction.

You have a lot more faith in this organization than I do. I think we’re primed for another offseason and TDL full of excuses. Prices didn’t make sense, hard to make trades with flat cap, we were close on lots of guys, Sutter needs a full offseason to work with the team, etc.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

...Absolutely no excuses anymore. “Oh times are tough - hard to do a deal in-season”...we heard that last season, yet other teams made moves. Treliving has been an inadequate manager in-season for multiple years at this stage. He needs to execute and show that he’s a GM worth keeping around. It’s a competition between him and the other 31 GMs in the league (Seattle included). Start executing like a top-16 GM, and perhaps the team’s results will start reflecting that.

I think all of the hockey trades made the last calendar year have been extremely underwhelming. The only good one was the Winnipeg/CBJ swap, but that was consummated under fairly unique, extenuating circumstances.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by mrdonkey

You have a lot more faith in this organization than I do. I think we’re primed for another offseason and TDL full of excuses. Prices didn’t make sense, hard to make trades with flat cap, we were close on lots of guys, Sutter needs a full offseason to work with the team, etc.

I guess the difference between you and me is that I consider these pretty valid excuses. If the vision is longer term, then I personally don't think the TDL is the time to make significant changes that are needed. We will see what happens in the off-season, but my expectations are tempered by how flat the NHL trade market has been for the past year.