To me it is the Rangers that make the perfect fit. An offer around Lafreniere+Kakko+cap would likely beat any offer the Flames or another team would make.
Depends on what the Sabres want to do though. Neither Kakko or Lafreniere are tearing up the NHL and they both have value but neither is sure bet. If they want some more established pieces I think the Flames could put together a decent offer. That would be a total rebuild move from them for that Rangers package.
I don’t see any chance the Sabres entertain a deal that sends Eichel to the Flames unless Tkachuk is part of the package. I don’t see why they would accept a deal that centers around 26 year old Monahan, 24 year old Hanifin. If Eichel goes the Sabres are heading toward another rebuild.
To me it is the Rangers that make the perfect fit. An offer around Lafreniere+Kakko+cap would likely beat any offer the Flames or another team would make.
Tkachuk+Mangiapane+Dube might make them take a long hard look though
There's no way NYR offer up Lafreniere right now, his ceiling is at least Eichel, on top of that for them to include Kakko. I agree that offer beats not just what Flames can do but just about any offer any team would do which makes no sense for NYR to put on the table.
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Depends on what the Sabres want to do though. Neither Kakko or Lafreniere are tearing up the NHL and they both have value but neither is sure bet. If they want some more established pieces I think the Flames could put together a decent offer. That would be a total rebuild move from them for that Rangers package.
Hanfin at 24 isn't exactly old lol.
He is also not a proven top pairing Dman. He was picked 3 spots after Eichel but I just think if the Sabres move Eichel they will do it at the draft for the largest package of young assets they can. I think they would pivot to rebuild around Dahlen, Cozens, Quinn, and the other similar aged assets they would be getting in return.
I could be wrong and would love to make a trade for Eichel around Monahan, Hanifin, Bennett, 1st but I just don’t see it.
You guys would really give up two important roster players (or more) plus Bennet and a 1st for Eichel. Wtf?
How exactly does he get us out of this mess, absent the roster players?
Flames would just end up being a different kind of broken.
We're in this mess because of the non absent roster players. And if we're a different kind of broken, it's better than being the same kind of broken we have been enduring for many many years.
Eichel does so many things for us.
1. Eichel + Gaudreau > Mony + Gaudreau
2. Eichel adds speed
3. Eichel has a chip on his shoulder vs McDavid
4. Eichel has great hair
I'm sure there are more advantages with Eichel.
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He is also not a proven top pairing Dman. He was picked 3 spots after Eichel but I just think if the Sabres move Eichel they will do it at the draft for the largest package of young assets they can. I think they would pivot to rebuild around Dahlen, Cozens, Quinn, and the other similar aged assets they would be getting in return.
I could be wrong and would love to make a trade for Eichel around Monahan, Hanifin, Bennett, 1st but I just don’t see it.
I disagree for a couple of reasons.
1. I think that both ownership and fan base are completely disillusioned with the idea of a "rebuild". You're not going to get a much more favorable draft oriented rebuild than the sabres have gone through with top picks, and they still have a garbage team to show for it.
2. There's also ample league evidence that going for broke with mostly rookies and young players on a rebuild is a total loser game. Look no further than north on the QE2 for that.
3. The players we are proposing are long term controllable at much more reasonable balanced value than Eichel. Monahan's next contract will probably be in the same $ range, while Hanifin is locked up at relative value.
What this package does give them is a very reasonable 1C to shelter Cozens on the 2nd line until he's ready to take the reins. Then Monahan folds into an excellent 2C. Hanifin gives them a stalwart LD to put behind Dahlin and help balance their roster. Then they still get good potential in Zary and a 1st that looks pretty middling this year. Bennett also seems to hold minor value still.
This is a good package for a rebuilding club. The players are all still young, 1 still has more upside to develop into (Hanifin, maybe Bennett), you don't leave your roster with an absolute gaping hole on the top (crushing the spirits of remaining players), and you get two premium future pieces to boot.
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1. I think that both ownership and fan base are completely disillusioned with the idea of a "rebuild". You're not going to get a much more favorable draft oriented rebuild than the sabres have gone through with top picks, and they still have a garbage team to show for it.
2. There's also ample league evidence that going for broke with mostly rookies and young players on a rebuild is a total loser game. Look no further than north on the QE2 for that.
3. The players we are proposing are long term controllable at much more reasonable balanced value than Eichel. Monahan's next contract will probably be in the same $ range, while Hanifin is locked up at relative value.
What this package does give them is a very reasonable 1C to shelter Cozens on the 2nd line until he's ready to take the reins. Then Monahan folds into an excellent 2C. Hanifin gives them a stalwart LD to put behind Dahlin and help balance their roster. Then they still get good potential in Zary and a 1st that looks pretty middling this year. Bennett also seems to hold minor value still.
This is a good package for a rebuilding club. The players are all still young, 1 still has more upside to develop into (Hanifin, maybe Bennett), you don't leave your roster with an absolute gaping hole on the top (crushing the spirits of remaining players), and you get two premium future pieces to boot.
I am not buying what you are selling at all there.
I see no way they take a 26/27 year old with 2 years left on his deal as a main piece in a trade for a better player who is 2 years younger. Makes absolutely no sense. They didn’t get anywhere with Eichel they are not getting anywhere with Monahan.
If they don’t go for picks and prospects they likely would target a player line Brady Tkachuk or other young players drafted from 16-19 who are young but already established.
You are already mentioning that both Monahan and Hanifin would move to the 2nd line C and second pair D roles. Why would Buffalo target this for their franchise player they embarrassingly tanked to get.
Bennett? The guy might not get qualified let alone be a valuable piece of this deal. Zary and the 1st are fine enough pieces but every single team has those. I don’t think 2 years of Monahan or 3 years of Hanifin that leads them to UFA status qualifies as long term team control
You honestly can’t be serious with that post above? No one would be gullible enough to believe this is the type of package Buffalo would want or the best they would be offered.
Look at Dubois as a perfect example. No doubt the Flames were offering Monahan+(likely Bennett) and Jarmo shut it down. I don’t see how Hanifin, 1st and Zary on top of that get a clear upgrade for the Flames in Eichel.
I would absolutely love it but just like the Jackets with Dubois the ask from the Sabres almost certainly starts with Tkachuk.
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We're in this mess because of the non absent roster players. And if we're a different kind of broken, it's better than being the same kind of broken we have been enduring for many many years.
Eichel does so many things for us.
1. Eichel + Gaudreau > Mony + Gaudreau
2. Eichel adds speed
3. Eichel has a chip on his shoulder vs McDavid
4. Eichel has great hair
You guys would really give up two important roster players (or more) plus Bennet and a 1st for Eichel. Wtf?
How exactly does he get us out of this mess, absent the roster players?
Flames would just end up being a different kind of broken.
We have 8 forwards worth protecting in expansion right now and can only protect 7 so this mitigates the risk of losing something of value for nothing on the forward front.
Hanifin would hurt losing given how great he is playing this year but having said that his value is pretty high and, I know it’s really early to say but, Valimaki will become a top 4 dman in due time and we have players like Mackey, Kylington and Lerby (who by all accounts looked great in the short preseason camp) who are fellow LHD within the system that can fill the gaps.
If a guy, who is reportedly on the block, like Montour can be part of the deal it softens the pressure put on the young guys.
You could still shelter Valimaki/Mackey/Kylington by bringing Montour in. I know it would shift our strength to RHD but given our depth of LHD it actually makes some sense.
Hanifin and Bennett were reportedly nearly traded for an upgrade on forward in Hall so the organization seems to be comfortable with losing them already and with the expansion draft looming the rumours have been the Flames wanting to do a 2-for-1 forward deal anyways.
I know Hanifin has looked great this year but maybe that is more a product of Tanev?
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Look at Dubois as a perfect example. No doubt the Flames were offering Monahan+(likely Bennett) and Jarmo shut it down. I don’t see how Hanifin, 1st and Zary on top of that get a clear upgrade for the Flames in Eichel.
I would absolutely love it but just like the Jackets with Dubois the ask from the Sabres almost certainly starts with Tkachuk.
I would still give up Tkachuk for Eichel as a base as well. I am just not sure if the Sabres who want to win are going to go for two complete lotto tickets when that is all they have been doing.
Also, this is all predicated on Eichel demanding out and getting it which I think it unlikely anyways
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From LeBrun Insider Trading (who has a history of being probably the most connected insider when it comes to the Flames):
"Flames GM focused on team self-improving.
Pretty quiet on the trade front, which is not to say Treliving isn't talking to a lot of teams. He's actually notorious among his peers for checking in with every single team in the league every few days or so, which is where some of this noise comes from. But I don't sense anything is imminent, so that solution has to come from within."
Nothing too surprising given the logistics of making a trade this season.
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Yeah, Treliving just doesn't have a history of making in-season trades. The only in-season moves of note during his entire tenure has been the trading away of Glencross and Hudler. Everything else are just small, wasteful trades like Gus for a 3rd, Forbort for a 4th etc.
Whether we like it or not, Treliving apparently doesn't believe in/hasn't been able to execute when it comes to improving/altering the team once the season gets going.
We'll see what happens, but this season - whichever way it goes - is likely going to play itself out with mostly the same roster it has today.
Yeah, Treliving just doesn't have a history of making in-season trades. The only in-season moves of note during his entire tenure has been the trading away of Glencross and Hudler.
Whether we like it or not, Treliving apparently doesn't believe in/hasn't been able to execute when it comes to improving/altering the team once the season gets going.
We'll see what happens, but this season - whichever way it goes - is likely going to play itself out with mostly the same roster it has today.
The fact that this is a 56 game season and you make a deal and the new player misses 7-8 games to quarantine (unless you trade with a direct competitor) it is going to be very tough for Canadian teams to make in season trades.
As you said all Treliving’s moves have been deadline selling or buying (outside of a scrub deal like Granlund for Shinkaruk or Knight for Shore). Glencross, Hudler, Baertschi, Russell traded for futures and futures used to add Stone, Lazar, Fattenberg, Gustafson, Forbort.
It is so tough to make major in season deals with the cap as it pretty much needs to be money in/money out.
