I think Ward is part of the problem, and I think the Flames leadership within the room is part of the problem.
Mark Giordano can't Captain this Flames team past this season, just like Ward can't coach them. As Giordano's play diminishes, his voice will mean less and less in the locker room. Its not a shot at Gio, its reality of aging, and the passing of the torch. Your Captain can't be a guy who works really hard but gets absolutely lit up every shift.
Changing the Captain of a hockey team is a big deal, just like changing the Coach is a big deal. Coaches rely on their Captain and leadership group to keep the players bought into the coaches philsophies and making sure they lead by example.
This is not happening anymore. The days of Gio having a big shift or a game changing play to positively impact the outcome of a hockey game have passed. The days of Gio costing the Flames have just began. Removing the Captaincy does mean Gio doesn't have a place anymore, but he can't be "the guy" anymore. Gio can play 3rd pairing minutes for the rest of his contract, and will be able to perform at a level that is acceptable for this.
Long story short. Calgary needs a new bench boss, who picks a new Captain, who then work together to change the culture of this hockey team.
Treliving might also need to go, as he seems like he's had his fair shot at picking a coach now. I like the guy, and want Calgary to succeed, but every coach Calgary brings in is a 2nd or 3rd tier coach. Maybe the ownership won't allow Tree to pick the guy he wants because of the cost? We do not know, but it is time that they open their wallets and bring a guy in who is a proven winner.
It's difficult to not think what Tortarella would do in charge of the Flames. The coaching staff must be aware of who the problems are in the room. Said problems would be healthy scratched, regardless of salary or tenure. Removal from special teams. Cut icetime. If there is not going to be a strong personality in the room to snap players into line, it's up to the coach.
As much as I like both Gio and Tkachuk, rallying them should be nowhere as difficult as a rift between Iggy and Reg.
__________________
"By Grabthar's hammer ... what a savings."
Why doesn't Ward stop being stubborn and change the system back to the early Peters system with his butt on the line? He was here then so he should be familiar with it. I mean clearly what they are currently doing isn't working. Is he that stubborn or just that stupid? If my job was on the line and I was trying to save it I would be going back to the lines and system that worked.
I think Ward is part of the problem, and I think the Flames leadership within the room is part of the problem.
Mark Giordano can't Captain this Flames team past this season, just like Ward can't coach them. As Giordano's play diminishes, his voice will mean less and less in the locker room. Its not a shot at Gio, its reality of aging, and the passing of the torch. Your Captain can't be a guy who works really hard but gets absolutely lit up every shift.
Changing the Captain of a hockey team is a big deal, just like changing the Coach is a big deal. Coaches rely on their Captain and leadership group to keep the players bought into the coaches philsophies and making sure they lead by example.
This is not happening anymore. The days of Gio having a big shift or a game changing play to positively impact the outcome of a hockey game have passed. The days of Gio costing the Flames have just began. Removing the Captaincy does mean Gio doesn't have a place anymore, but he can't be "the guy" anymore. Gio can play 3rd pairing minutes for the rest of his contract, and will be able to perform at a level that is acceptable for this.
Long story short. Calgary needs a new bench boss, who picks a new Captain, who then work together to change the culture of this hockey team.
Treliving might also need to go, as he seems like he's had his fair shot at picking a coach now. I like the guy, and want Calgary to succeed, but every coach Calgary brings in is a 2nd or 3rd tier coach. Maybe the ownership won't allow Tree to pick the guy he wants because of the cost? We do not know, but it is time that they open their wallets and bring a guy in who is a proven winner.
Guys came to camp from the country club not ready to play. It's not new with this "club", but it's worse this year because of no preseason and a short season. They are all entitled brats.
We have no depth in the system and BT brought in the 3 useless stooges so their jobs are safe. Now the hole is too deep and no time to dig out of it. They are toasted.
Last edited by Flamesfan05; 02-21-2021 at 05:20 PM.
Why doesn't Ward stop being stubborn and change the system back to the early Peters system with his butt on the line? He was here then so he should be familiar with it. I mean clearly what they are currently doing isn't working. Is he that stubborn or just that stupid? If my job was on the line and I was trying to save it I would be going back to the lines and system that worked.
Because it involved being a jerk to get players to commit to it and stick to it.
Ward played good cop I am sure to the players then as he is now. For him to change his style to be a jerk won't work long term as players would see though it. Who knows, maybe that attitude is what he is trying, but rom the last 8 days it appears they aren't really buying in to anything he is saying right now so his credibility ship has sailed.
The Following User Says Thank You to browna For This Useful Post:
Because it involved being a jerk to get players to commit to it and stick to it.
Ward played good cop I am sure to the players then as he is now. For him to change his style to be a jerk won't work long term as players would see though it. Who knows, maybe that attitude is what he is trying, but rom the last 8 days it appears they aren't really buying in to anything he is saying right now so his credibility ship has sailed.
There have been a loooooot of horrible Flames coaches over the years, but the fact Ward is sooooo clearly the worst is honestly kind of impressive.
He's already at the point that every fan despises him to the highest degree except for the ones he pays off to stick up for him here and there
As bad as Gulutzan was, at least he had a system. It didn't work and he stubbornly stuck to it, but it was still a system that gave the Flames good possession.
Ward doesn't have anything. I have no idea what he actually does.
I hate the fact that he became the default coach simply because of the Peters situation, and I hate the fact that the Peters situation got him the job permanently likely due to having to pay out Peters.
The Following User Says Thank You to Firebot For This Useful Post:
I find it hard to believe that an organization that’s more than willing to spend to the cap every year, okays buyouts, okays 8 figure multi year contracts every offseason, would somehow draw the line on something as important to winning and losing as a head coach. It makes no sense. “I’ll let you spend $85 million on the players Brad, but only $1M on the coach.” Please...it sounds completely moronic.
For those that believe the Flames need to find a “good coach”
Has anyone ever thought that Brad Treliving’s idea of a “good” head coach differs from what your version of what a “good” head coach is? Like honestly, he held a 6 week long search and ended up selecting Glen Gulutzan out of the lot, He didn’t interview anyone else when he hired Bill Peters. Ditto for Ward. Like, is it possible that he looks at coaching more so than the basic wins vs loss column? We know Treliving is heavy into analytics, so naturally he’s going to choose coaches who fit that mold. Brad was a 1st time GM as well so maybe he himself is perfectly fine with hiring less experienced “modern day” coaches.
The Following User Says Thank You to Classic_Sniper For This Useful Post:
Ward was never good. There was a 7 game win streak right after Peters was yanked. After that, now that we have implemented his system, we are a .500 team.
And maybe what makes a good NHL coach is one who continually is able to keep his team functioning at a high level.
Maybe the good years are in spite if terrible coaching.
Its like continually buying Lada's and complaining when they breakdown after a year...and blaming the roads and gasoline...Geoff Ward is a Lada.
They were a .500 team before he took over from Peters. Exactly .500 as a matter of fact.
Because it involved being a jerk to get players to commit to it and stick to it.
Ward played good cop I am sure to the players then as he is now. For him to change his style to be a jerk won't work long term as players would see though it. Who knows, maybe that attitude is what he is trying, but rom the last 8 days it appears they aren't really buying in to anything he is saying right now so his credibility ship has sailed.
I remember Duhatsek talking about this on the radio many years ago when Darryl was still GM. I can't remember if Playfair was coach, Darryl was, or if Keenan was. However, he said that the assistant is often the buddy and he's the sounding board for the players, they coach the players trust with vulnerable things. The head coach is the hard tough guy in the room. He's the boss and needs to be hard on you. That makes it hard for an assistant to transition from buddy to hardass. Some guys can do it, many cannot. It isn't common for a teams assistant to successfully transition to head coach with the same team.
Playfair didn't do it and Ward isn't exactly breaking the mind either.
I find it hard to believe that an organization that’s more than willing to spend to the cap every year, okays buyouts, okays 8 figure multi year contracts every offseason, would somehow draw the line on something as important to winning and losing as a head coach. It makes no sense. “I’ll let you spend $85 million on the players Brad, but only $1M on the coach.” Please...it sounds completely moronic.
For those that believe the Flames need to find a “good coach”
Has anyone ever thought that Brad Treliving’s idea of a “good” head coach differs from what your version of what a “good” head coach is? Like honestly, he held a 6 week long search and ended up selecting Glen Gulutzan out of the lot, He didn’t interview anyone else when he hired Bill Peters. Ditto for Ward. Like, is it possible that he looks at coaching more so than the basic wins vs loss column? We know Treliving is heavy into analytics, so naturally he’s going to choose coaches who fit that mold. Brad was a 1st time GM as well so maybe he himself is perfectly fine with hiring less experienced “modern day” coaches.
With respect to your last paragraph, I think many people have thought pretty much exactly that. It was exceedingly obvious when he hired Peters that it wasn’t based on his actual results. It was based on Treliving projecting how he would perform in a different situation.
He has obviously justified his hires, certainly to himself, and the problem is that once you hire a coach, you are stuck with that coach for a pretty long time.
And now it seems, with the full benefit of hindsight, that he is not particularly good at identifying the attributes and qualities that a coach would need to bring to be successful with the roster he built.
And here we are. What he is “perfectly fine with” is not getting the most out of his roster and translating to on ice success. And that’s not good enough
Goaltending wasn’t great, especially Hiller, but Hiller was the second stringer that year and Ramo had a better save % than a goalies who had far better records. Because their team was better, or at least were better coached, or both. Niemi, Lehtonen, Ward, Rinne.
Hartley’s team just wasn’t good, and no, they didn’t like playing for him.
Goaltending wasn’t great, especially Hiller, but Hiller was the second stringer that year and Ramo had a better save % than a goalies who had far better records. Because their team was better, or at least were better coached, or both. Niemi, Lehtonen, Ward, Rinne.
Hartley’s team just wasn’t good, and no, they didn’t like playing for him.
That year was a mess. Dougie Hamilton was awful the first 20, Brodie was out for October, and the three headed goalie monster was there. Amateur hour. It put them in a brutal hole
Hiller wasn’t second stringer, they sent Ramo to Stockton in late Oct. if I recall correctly
And do you not remember how demoralizing Hiller’s GA were for the team? His body language and their response? The team that overachieved the year prior could not outscore the bad goaltending
It was only later in the year the team started turning around and playing consistently when Ramo steadied the tending, and when he blew out his knee, the wheels came right off.
Yeah, Hartley was tough on the team and at the same time, Brad never wanted to keep him. The Jack Adams made it impossible for a rookie GM to fire him. Tre gladly took his first opportunity
The Following User Says Thank You to DeluxeMoustache For This Useful Post:
With respect to your last paragraph, I think many people have thought pretty much exactly that. It was exceedingly obvious when he hired Peters that it wasn’t based on his actual results. It was based on Treliving projecting how he would perform in a different situation.
He has obviously justified his hires, certainly to himself, and the problem is that once you hire a coach, you are stuck with that coach for a pretty long time.
And now it seems, with the full benefit of hindsight, that he is not particularly good at identifying the attributes and qualities that a coach would need to bring to be successful with the roster he built.
And here we are. What he is “perfectly fine with” is not getting the most out of his roster and translating to on ice success. And that’s not good enough
“Getting the most out of his roster,” “getting players prepared,” “players have tuned out the coach,” these are all just a bunch of buzzwords fans use to generalize the criticism of the coach without knowing what the hell is actually going on. I honestly blame the core players in all of this, they’ve had years upon years to figure out how to play together, how to win and how not to win. It’s the same old mistakes and the same old story just with a different suit behind the bench.
What made the players play for Ward last summer that has changed all of a sudden less than 1 month into this season? They even started out strong the very first week when we all had them near the too of the power rankings. If it is indeed another player vs coach thing, then it’s on the players this time because what does it say about the characters in that dressing room who can’t seem to like any coach that stands in front of them? Like they’re such prima donnas that they’ll only play for a Hall of Fame coach or something?
Not a chance, it’s none of these things. It’s not the coaches, it never has been. It’s about a group of individuals with no confidence. A group of players who don’t believe that they can do it. They’ve seen this song and dance before. So they’re sulking right now. Playing lazy. Playing without pride. Waiting for someone else to pick up the slack. Some guys are trying, but even they can’t pick up the rest of the team. If there’s one thing this team really needs it’s a 5-0 victory where everyone snake bitten gets on the scoresheet. Then they can finally build some confidence, build up some swagger and start playing with some damn pride in their craft. They need to stop feeling sorry for themselves already.
