The Deal With Geoff Ward

[Macindoc]

It's time for Ward to go. He seems to have found a way to get the worst out of every single player with nonsensical line combinations, with a complete absence of any in-game adjustments other than the line blender, and with the ongoing development of a dump-and chase system that simply doesn't suit the team's personnel or today's NHL. The season is a write-off anyway, so may as well try to get some chemistry going and show off the Flames' assets if they're going to blow it up anyway. At least then we'll know what the Flames actually have in terms of assets, because at the moment, do to his sheer incompetence, I have no idea.

[Inglewood Jack]

Imagine Ward’s whiteboard of set plays

- hard work
- compete level
- skating
- move feet
- structure
- attention to detail

Of course, why didn’t the players think of that?? They’re only among the 700 most elite hockey athletes on the planet, they obviously got to this level without having done any of these things.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Inglewood Jack

Imagine Ward’s whiteboard of set plays

- hard work
- compete level
- skating
- move feet
- structure
- attention to detail

Of course, why didn’t the players think of that?? They’re only among the 700 most elite hockey athletes on the planet, they obviously got to this level without having done any of these things.

Well, they seem to have forgotten.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

https://twitter.com/user/status/1362283482588700674

This may be the worst response I've ever seen from a head coach in the NHL.

Literally every sentence includes a common, overused hockey cliché that ultimately means nothing.

In a hundred words here, Ward has said absolutely nothing.

I noticed this after our playoff losses.
His answers sound like a parody of a sports coach. Feels like you're watching SNL or something like that.

[browna]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

True, but Sutter was as much a button pusher as a lot of coaches people dislike. He said so himself. The Kings tried to lock him out of the DR. And Carcillo really ripped him as an abusive coach (not just yelling). Doughty kind of dissed him as well.

None of the Flames loved him either for pushing buttons. But if it works as far as team results, a lot of that is forgiven. Pouty Doughty got two Stanley Cup rings thanks to Sutter and soon as things started turning the least bit south with the team success, again, after 2 Stanley cups, he plays the public victim card. Solid leadership right there.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by browna

None of the Flames loved him either for pushing buttons. But if it works as far as team results, a lot of that is forgiven. Pouty Doughty got two Stanley Cup rings thanks to Sutter and soon as things started turning the least bit south with the team success, again, after 2 Stanley cups, he plays the victim card.

I’m not saying it’s fair criticism, though Carcillo’s allegations are serious. I’m saying the “players liked playing for straight-shooting Sutter” is a bit of a myth.

[SeanCharles]

Just a prediction but maybe Trelving is primed to become President of Hockey Operations in the near future and Conroy to take Tre’s place.

Ward is a placeholder until Conroy has a chance to hire his guy when he takes over.

I never understood bringing Ward back. Treliving got a free pass on Peters and blew it IMO.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I’m not saying it’s fair criticism, though Carcillo’s allegations are serious. I’m saying the “players liked playing for straight-shooting Sutter” is a bit of a myth.

Iggy seemed to like him ok. Admired some things he maybe didn’t fully appreciate at the time. Went back to LA for a second helping

https://www.nhl.com/flames/news/just...uy/c-305337750

I don’t know what to think of Carcillo. Lots of data points on both sides of the ledger.

I have heard many post Sutter players telling affectionate stories about their time under him.

Not the place to litigate Carcillo vs Sutter, though

Ward seems to be nice but struggling with results. And some player management

[Manhattanboy]

What would the Flames record be without Markstrom? Or Johnny?

We are incredibly lucky to have 8 wins.

[Psytic]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

What would the Flames record be without Markstrom? Or Johnny?

We are incredibly lucky to have 8 wins.

If Rittich was the starter they'd be second last probably. Without Markstrom its debatable if they are better than the Nucks.

[Moneyhands23]

At the end of the day I think he has lost the room, or at least the players are not buying in on his "system"

[Erick Estrada]

We can no longer look at games at hand as the Flames have largely caught up to the teams ahead of them and they sit outside of the playoffs. Geoff Ward hockey is not entertaining nor is it winning hockey. I thought Treliving couldn't hire a coach worse than Gulutzan but he did just that in an offseason where there were some quality head coaches available.

[tvp2003]

Originally Posted by Moneyhands23

At the end of the day I think he has lost the room, or at least the players are not buying in on his "system"

The problem I have with Ward’s messaging is that he’s putting it all on the players to play his “system” which requires very precise breakouts with low margin for error. But also play with emotion. And skate fast too (but only once you execute the perfect breakout, because if someone is expecting it you’re not going anywhere).

Meanwhile, coach will throw out the same cliches like “effort” and “compete”. Yesterday we got the bonus of random line combos with taxi squad guys on the top line and then back on the fourth line and vice versa. You can’t tell me the players saw the lines yesterday and didn’t say WTF?!?

It should be no surprise — especially with this group — if they’ve lost confidence in the coach. Sure, if they execute perfectly they’ll have success. But that’s a lot to expect on a consistent basis, and especially if other teams are prepared for it and you’ve got no counter.

Hopefully this Vancouver series is a big wake up call for Ward, as it’s up to him to respond because the roster is what it is.

[Erick Estrada]

I'm sure I'm not the only person that has worked under a boss that was in over his/her head and everyone in the building knew it. It's really hard to feel good about what you are doing at your job when you don't think your boss knows what he/she is doing. I don't think it's any different in a locker room when the players scratch their heads and lose confidence. When you look at the general effort level in the 4 games against the Canucks that looked to me like a team that lacks enthusiasm. They are pretty well going through the motions and look like a group of players putting in time to get through their 56 games with visions of going home and getting away from their workplace.

[Rhettzky]

Two big things jump out at me about Ward from last night. First, you prepare for a game with set lines and lots of us disagreed with those lines but I can handle him making his own calls. But in a shortened season with no pre-season and no real chance for a team to bond you really need to work to build some consistency in the line-up. Instead he just mixes the lines all game long when faced with adversity. How can you expect Ritchie to have success playing on a line with Gaudreau and Monahan 15 games into a season that he hasn't even had a game in much less any practice time with those two?

Second, Vancouver played agressive and when they got a lead they just clogged up the neutral zone which is the same tactic they've used on every penalty kill. They have done this in every game, so how are we not prepared for it at this point? Last nights power play we kept trying to do the same cutesy drop back play against 4 guys holding the blue line. The problem with a drop back play against a team who is holding the line is that our forwards follow the puck up, then pretty much have to stop with the other team at their blue line. Then we drop the puck back to a forward coming with speed (when they actually connect the pass anyway) and he tries to dipsy doodle through 8 players standing between center ice and the opposition blue line. How the hell is this supposed to work and why are we beating it to death against a team that has clearly adapted to it? It's insanity to me that they don't have a plan 'B' on the power play against this tactic because we are going to see it a whole lot this season.

They really need a coaching swap and fast or this season could be lost. And the window is closing on this group so we can't really afford to waste anymore time with sub-par coaching.

[loob job]

I wish we would just hire Gerard Gallant. That's all.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Rhettzky

Two big things jump out at me about Ward from last night. First, you prepare for a game with set lines and lots of us disagreed with those lines but I can handle him making his own calls. But in a shortened season with no pre-season and no real chance for a team to bond you really need to work to build some consistency in the line-up. Instead he just mixes the lines all game long when faced with adversity. How can you expect Ritchie to have success playing on a line with Gaudreau and Monahan 15 games into a season that he hasn't even had a game in much less any practice time with those two?

Second, Vancouver played agressive and when they got a lead they just clogged up the neutral zone which is the same tactic they've used on every penalty kill. They have done this in every game, so how are we not prepared for it at this point? Last nights power play we kept trying to do the same cutesy drop back play against 4 guys holding the blue line. The problem with a drop back play against a team who is holding the line is that our forwards follow the puck up, then pretty much have to stop with the other team at their blue line. Then we drop the puck back to a forward coming with speed (when they actually connect the pass anyway) and he tries to dipsy doodle through 8 players standing between center ice and the opposition blue line. How the hell is this supposed to work and why are we beating it to death against a team that has clearly adapted to it? It's insanity to me that they don't have a plan 'B' on the power play against this tactic because we are going to see it a whole lot this season.

They really need a coaching swap and fast or this season could be lost. And the window is closing on this group so we can't really afford to waste anymore time with sub-par coaching.

There’s lots to complain about but you chose (a) a thing that worked with Ritchie and (b) a powerplay entrance that worked (and doesn’t operate like you describe) and that (c) they did move away from during the game (with no success). The plan on the drop back pass isn’t for Gaudreau to skate the puck into the zone. It’s for him to assess the coverage and make a short pass to an open man who gains the zone (and then they set up). And they started to try and fake the bump back (but Valimaki lost the puck) and also just went with straight rushes.

[Lanny_McDonald]

I hate to break it to you folks, Ward ain't going anywhere until Treliving is fired, and that ain't happening until the season has ended. With Ward in place the season is pretty much done. As Rhettzky pointed out, the players (especially Tkachuk) appear to be playing out the string and burning off another disappointing year off their contracts and leaving but a crack in the window for this core. It's over folks, and it all lands on the head of Brad Treliving. Ward never should have been extended and that decision has washed away any positive benefit from other moves. So get used to the losses piling up and the frustrations building until fans start tuning out the team, which is just starting. Only when that hits critical mass will the ownership pull their heads out of their asses and book Treliving a one way ticket on the next SpaceX flight to the sun.

[Wolfman]

Originally Posted by New Era

I hate to break it to you folks, Ward ain't going anywhere until Treliving is fired, and that ain't happening until the season has ended. With Ward in place the season is pretty much done. As Rhettzky pointed out, the players (especially Tkachuk) appear to be playing out the string and burning off another disappointing year off their contracts and leaving but a crack in the window for this core. It's over folks, and it all lands on the head of Brad Treliving. Ward never should have been extended and that decision has washed away any positive benefit from other moves. So get used to the losses piling up and the frustrations building until fans start tuning out the team, which is just starting. Only when that hits critical mass will the ownership pull their heads out of their asses and book Treliving a one way ticket on the next SpaceX flight to the sun.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I'm sure I'm not the only person that has worked under a boss that was in over his/her head and everyone in the building knew it. It's really hard to feel good about what you are doing at your job when you don't think your boss knows what he/she is doing. I don't think it's any different in a locker room when the players scratch their heads and lose confidence. When you look at the general effort level in the 4 games against the Canucks that looked to me like a team that lacks enthusiasm. They are pretty well going through the motions and look like a group of players putting in time to get through their 56 games with visions of going home and getting away from their workplace.

I have my doubts that this group has lost confidence in the coach. This is the exact kind of coach that the players go to back for. A players coach that seems to let the vets run the country club. They went to back for Ward this off season and they did the same for Gluz. When hard coaches have been at the helm , they play good for a season and then loose interest in playing for that kind of coach. Look at Hartley and Peters as examples. Tre really screwed up this off season going back to Ward . He should have hired a better , tougher coach and any vet that backed Ward in the off season should have been traded.

They need a better coach but this core needs a big change. Keeping this core intact for a different coach will last a season at most until they grow tired of him , if he is a hard coach.