[Game Takes] Jets 4 Flames 1

[Bingo]

Game Takes: Jets 4 Flames 1

- terrible 7 minutes to finish the second
- Tkachuk continues to fight it
- Too many unforced turnovers lead to a loss
- Markstrom can only do so much

[PegCityFlamesFan]

Was Tkachuk benched in the 3rd? I was listening in the background and hes one guy I didn't hear about once this game.

[Cheese]

I dont think Ive ever seen the Flames give up so many breakaways, 2 on ohs and 3 on ohs. Is that systemic or just brain farts?

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Cheese

I dont think Ive ever seen the Flames give up so many breakaways, 2 on ohs and 3 on ohs. Is that systemic or just brain farts?

Strictly lack of focus.

Its the details they simply arent getting done. A bit of non-chalance in their for sure (that Backlund give away being the most obvious) but mainly guys simply aren't doing what they need to nor being were they need to.

Shout out to you though Bingo...having written these things way back when, its games like this that are so difficult to get through. Sometimes their is just nothing to say yet you have to. It sucks. Kudos for slogging through it though and doing so with excellence.

[Moneyhands23]

Coach has lost the room?

[Toonage]

Every coach loses the room with these guys.

But, to my point last night, they keep bringing in coaches who want them to play a style that doesn't suit them. Doesn't matter if you're a hard ass or a player's coach. If you keep trying to shove that square peg in the round hole you'll get the same apathy from your team.

[bludawg]

Originally Posted by Moneyhands23

Coach has lost the room?

Yup. Lost it quicker than Gulutzan. Pretty impressive.

[ricardodw]

I am leaning towards a Coaching upgrade.

Ward seems like he is out to get a bonus by making the replacement level players (Nordstrom, Simon, Leivo, Nesterov) into success stories. They all have been given a greater chance to fail than the guys that have been working their way up in the Flames system.

When you a Lucic and Ryan to the replacement level players it is pretty obvious that the Flames do not have the depth to roll 4 lines, They have basically talent for 2 top lines (now that Gaudreau and Monahan are playing closer to their potential)

Last night in a 3-1 3rd period of an important game defense TOI

Andersson 8:05
Gio 6:18
Valimaki 7:40
Tanev 6:29
Hanifin 4:05
Nesterov 5:40

What the heck? Hanifin has been the Flames best d-man of the season so far. Was he so awful last night to have his ice time cut rather than increased? Was he hurt?

[flambers]

Flames played the quiet boring style of a game, very little emotion.

Inconsistent type of style is a huge concern...

Lack of offense is a big issue for this club, so far this season

[Textcritic]

I wonder how much of last might was fatigue. It was the last game in a five-game trip in seven days, with four straight nights stuck in a hotel in Winnipeg. That would suck the soul out of anyone.

Sent from my SM-G960W using Tapatalk

[Jeff Lebowski]

I think they have to put Tanev with Gio, Andersson with Hanifin. I read it was Valimaki - Andersson but that is too much pressure on young guys.

I realize Tanev - Hanifin was working fantastic but it's about balancing the pairings so you can cover the ice and cover for each other. I love all the D but everyone has strengths and weaknesses and the above pairings, IMO, cover some weaknesses by having more mobile added to give some security.

Nesterov - Valimaki is good but I understand you want to move Vali up because he's playing well but splitting the Tavev - Hanifin (for now) is best way to keep some balance.

I think Tkachuk is playing through something - he's not moving the same and the abundance quick touch passes reaffirms that to me.

Ward sounded on the verge of blowing a gasket in his post game to me. Good. He needs to be more ruthless and more tactical. The hard thing to say is Backlund and Gio are below their level. With Backlund he seems not mentally into it sadly. I've seen in previous games he doesn't even handle easy pucks and it leads to zone time against. He just isn't mentally into it and if it's because of ego and TOI that is total BS (though I obviously don't know what he's thinking).

Gio and Backs are 900 and 700 games and they are not getting the job done right now. Hate to say it but everyone can see it.

Ward needs to, instead of going to blender, reduce ice time, skip shifts for guys who keep making the same mistakes because different linemates doesn't change the repeating of mental errors or poor performance.

As I stated elsewhere, the Peters first season team was able to beat any style of opponent on the way to second in the league. I don't think Ward has made drastic changes to style of play (other than defensive zone) it's just that the players are not executing - I think it's because they have too much leash and Ward needs to be harder on them and more ruthless.

I don't think you can play any line and pairing vs top line opponents so the coaches need to be more tactical. Need some hard driving decisions and if it bruises the pride of players that's on them. It should be all about winning games not about keeping some guys feeling involved.

If guys are being outworked it's because they feel no concern about losing ice time. If guys keep making the same mistakes it's because they feel secure. Hartley used to say the word comfortable is bad in hockey and they guys look comfortable.

[442scotty]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Every coach loses the room with these guys.

But, to my point last night, they keep bringing in coaches who want them to play a style that doesn't suit them. Doesn't matter if you're a hard ass or a player's coach. If you keep trying to shove that square peg in the round hole you'll get the same apathy from your team.

But what style can this team play then? This team needs a much better coach and several players dumped. Bring up some eager farm kids and let them play . Surely they will play with more energy while improving their skills.

[Burning Beard]

Originally Posted by 442scotty

But what style can this team play then? This team needs a much better coach and several players dumped. Bring up some eager farm kids and let them play . Surely they will play with more energy while improving their skills.

North-South Dmen join the rush style hockey. They have a good defense and elite goaltending and its not like the current system is cutting down on the odd man rushes.

Put up 2 or 3 early goals then shut it down with Markstrom.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

I am leaning towards a Coaching upgrade.

Ward seems like he is out to get a bonus by making the replacement level players (Nordstrom, Simon, Leivo, Nesterov) into success stories. They all have been given a greater chance to fail than the guys that have been working their way up in the Flames system.

When you a Lucic and Ryan to the replacement level players it is pretty obvious that the Flames do not have the depth to roll 4 lines, They have basically talent for 2 top lines (now that Gaudreau and Monahan are playing closer to their potential)

Last night in a 3-1 3rd period of an important game defense TOI

Andersson 8:05
Gio 6:18
Valimaki 7:40
Tanev 6:29
Hanifin 4:05
Nesterov 5:40

What the heck? Hanifin has been the Flames best d-man of the season so far. Was he so awful last night to have his ice time cut rather than increased? Was he hurt?

The answer is quite simple. Ward and this staff are not good coaches.

[Strange Brew]

Treliving has had nearly seven years to build a forward group. The rotating cast of overpaid bottom six players and the lack of change to the core group has been a constant. Adding Lindholm was a win but you need to be more active than that.

Has Ward lost the room? If history is an indication he is due. Peters did. Gulutzan did. Hartley did.

I don't know if it's reasonable to expect much change during the season so I'm prepared to ride it out with these guys and cheer them them on and hope for the best. If the results are the same as they have been, I'd like to see a different plan and architect going forward.

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

I am leaning towards a Coaching upgrade.

Ward seems like he is out to get a bonus by making the replacement level players (Nordstrom, Simon, Leivo, Nesterov) into success stories. They all have been given a greater chance to fail than the guys that have been working their way up in the Flames system.

When you a Lucic and Ryan to the replacement level players it is pretty obvious that the Flames do not have the depth to roll 4 lines, They have basically talent for 2 top lines (now that Gaudreau and Monahan are playing closer to their potential)

Last night in a 3-1 3rd period of an important game defense TOI

Andersson 8:05
Gio 6:18
Valimaki 7:40
Tanev 6:29
Hanifin 4:05
Nesterov 5:40

What the heck? Hanifin has been the Flames best d-man of the season so far. Was he so awful last night to have his ice time cut rather than increased? Was he hurt?

Hanifin was having quite the rough night last night. Some horrible giveaways (4 total), and a -2.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Treliving has had nearly seven years to build a forward group. The rotating cast of overpaid bottom six players and the lack of change to the core group has been a constant. Adding Lindholm was a win but you need to be more active than that.

Has Ward lost the room? If history is an indication he is due. Peters did. Gulutzan did. Hartley did.

I don't know if it's reasonable to expect much change during the season so I'm prepared to ride it out with these guys and cheer them them on and hope for the best. If the results are the same as they have been, I'd like to see a different plan and architect going forward.

It’s only unreasonable to expect change during the season because we’re Flames fans. It’s unreasonable to expect change because the Flames have a GM who isn’t bold enough to enact actual change anymore. “It’s too difficult to make in-season trades”...for the Flames. Most other teams seem to do it without much issue.

Year after year, same quality of coach, same core players. Endlessly rotating overpaid garbage in the bottom half of the roster and expecting improvement is moronic.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I wonder how much of last might was fatigue. It was the last game in a five-game trip in seven days, with four straight nights stuck in a hotel in Winnipeg. That would suck the soul out of anyone.

Sent from my SM-G960W using Tapatalk

Really though it's not a lot different than the bubble. They are staying in the same hotel for all the days and not much in the way of travel. Last night was the first game of the season that resembled the hockey they were playing when they tuned out Peters.

[Bingo]

Maybe I'm just too much of an optimist but I just can't get over the negativity today.

GM has to go.
Coach has to go.
Players have tuned the coach out.

It's a 2-3 road trip, the team is inconsistent and annoying as hell, but I don't think the organization is considering sweeping change 10 games into a very strange season.

Maybe I need to get more mad? I just don't understand the extremes from some I guess.

I'm honestly supposed to believe that the coach that the players all loved and supported after the bubble playoff series is now the enemy in the dressing room after 10 games?

[Roof-Daddy]

Sweeping changes aren't coming.

Some fans are frustrated and want sweeping changes to come because they've been watching this mediocre crap for literally decades.

What is likely going to happen is, whoever is in charge will mostly tinker around the edges, maybe make a big change or two over time, but the team will continue to be an also ran until all it's good young core pieces lose value because they get older and start to suck, or just leave for nothing as free agents. Then, after a few more years of barely making the playoffs or barely missing the playoffs, and getting their asses handed to them by a far superior and better built team when they do get in, they will have to tear down whatever assets are left, get what they can in return and try this rebuilding thing all over again.

Yep, my optimism level isn't as high as others I guess.