Flames fall 3-2 to the cargo planes

[Infinit47]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Honestly they just need to try Dube there. IMO he's always made more sense on that line then the Tkachuk-Lindholm line.

Or alternatively they could just keep Simon there...the line has performed really well with Simon...no idea why the coaching staff seems to have fallen out of favour with him.

Gaudreau+Monahan+Simon

TOI: 35 Minutes

Corsi For: 57.7%
HDCF%: 53.9%
xGF%: 54.7%

Goals For: 3
Goals Against: 1

Gaudreau+Monahan w/o Simon

TOI: 67 Minutes

Corsi For: 53.9%
HDCF%: 40.9%
xGF%: 55.7%

Goals For: 1
Goals Against: 1

They were playing legitimately good with Simon on their wing until the coach decided that Simon deserved to sit on the bench for a week.

Hmm, those numbers match how those lines looked. Why did Ward scratch Simon?

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Infinit47

Hmm, those numbers match how those lines looked. Why did Ward scratch Simon?

My take is he’s a ####ty coach but that’s just my feelings on him.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

They were playing legitimately good with Simon on their wing until the coach decided that Simon deserved to sit on the bench for a week.

I mean the numbers you just posted were almost identical with the exception of scoring chances, which could just be sample noise. The xGF% is more or less the same. I don't think Simon is stirring the drink. If anything, those would indicate a deceptive eye test - they're playing quite well with or without him but the big events have been unevenly distributed.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

I mean the numbers you just posted were almost identical with the exception of scoring chances, which could just be sample noise. The xGF% is more or less the same. I don't think Simon is stirring the drink. If anything, those would indicate a deceptive eye test - they're playing quite well with or without him but the big events have been unevenly distributed.

I have to agree with this take and it matches my Eye test: Simon is just a warm body who was adequate with Money-Johnny, but didn't add anything to the duo. We need to add someone who will be a positive contributor on that line. Dube is an option, as SM mentioned, but IMO Dube is much better suited to the Tkachuk-Lindholm line. And we need someone decent for Backlund to play with still!

[81MC]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

The thing about Rittich is, we won't see him in the playoffs.

"But we have to make the playoffs!"

... sure. But Vancouver and Ottawa suck. You can write them off. You only have to beat one more team. Winnipeg is totally beatable. And Edmonton is right there, standing on the edge of suck canyon, waiting for a multi-game losing streak to push them over. If this team can't beat one of those two clubs regardless of who's in net, Rittich ain't the issue.

I seriously overestimated the value of this season. Ugh I wish they’d have made ‘regular’ season performance mote important.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Red

To win the division the Flames will have to almost run the table against Montreal and Toronto because you just know they will split with Ottawa

That's ridiculous. The Flames have 8-, 9- and 10-game sets against every team in the Division, which so far break down like this:

Winnipeg: 1-1-1 — 3/6 pts with 10 points on the table
Vancouver: 2-0-0 — 4/4 with 16 points on the table
Toronto: 0-2-0 — 0/4 with 14 points on the table
Montreal: 1-1-0 — 2/4 with 14 points on the table

It is still way too early to be declaring victory or defeat for any team except Ottawa.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I thought it was a pretty boring and lifeless game for both sides tonight. In the end the Jets got one more save and had the better goaltending but neither team really impressed.

Overall though I’m going to try to remain positive with how the season has went so far.

Flames have had the hardest schedule in the league so far according to hockey reference and have gotten through this first stretch at 4-4-1 including the stumble after the break.

Even considering the hard schedule the Flames are 8th in Corsi For % at 5v5, 7th in xGF% at 5v5, but 29th in shooting percentage at 5v5...that should normalize.

In terms of player performance:

Gaudreau, Monahan, Lindholm, Hanifin, and Tanev have all looked great.

Tkachuk, Mangiapane, Dube, Andersson, Valimaki, Nesterov, and Lucic have showed flashes of being good but have been also been poor at times. I think they will find some consistency as the season goes on.

Backlund, Giordano, And Ryan have been very poor by their standards and I have faith they will turn it around with more games to get in a rhythm.

Bennett, Leivo, and Simon have more to give still IMO and I think could be contributors in the right role.

Biggest thing for me is I really think we need to figure out our forward lines but I think once we find some chemistry up front this team could really take off offensively.

Overall the biggest question marks coming into the season were Gaudreau+Monahan, the defense core, and how Markstrom & Tanev would fit in, and so far these have all been positives. Now we just need to get the rest going.

Go Flames Go!

I think this and your other post were absolutely correct.

I think Leivo has been steadily improving, Backlund and Ryan had their best games last outing and Bennett was good the game before. Dube needs to be tried out on the top line - he’s fast, has some offensive instincts, works hard in the corners and has some defensive ability. Valimaki has played more and more confidently.

Lucic needs to be given some video time. He is doing a few things well, but his mistakes have been huge.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

I mean the numbers you just posted were almost identical with the exception of scoring chances, which could just be sample noise. The xGF% is more or less the same. I don't think Simon is stirring the drink. If anything, those would indicate a deceptive eye test - they're playing quite well with or without him but the big events have been unevenly distributed.

Thing is that provides you with better balance in other areas then.

If they are playing about the same with Simon or with Mangiapane doesn't that mean to keep Simon on that line and utilize Mangiapane somewhere else where he's more impactful.

Gaudreau/Monahan looked great, and produced while playing with Simon, why not stick with that to provide more depth elsewhere in the lineup instead of putting Dube/Mangiapane on that line.

I also think that while Lindholm/Tkachuk have looked good together at times, that all three of Mangiapane/Backlund/Tkachuk have looked better on a line with their proven chemistry together.

I would like to see the following line up. Doesn't really give us a top line, but gives us a pretty balanced top 9.

Gaudreau - Monahan - Simon
Dube - Lindholm - Bennett (Haven't seen this line before but feel like they'd be a real pain in the ass to play against)
Tkachuk - Backlund - Mangiapane
Lucic - Ryan - Leivo

Personally I'd like to see them try an approach where they start the game with more balanced lines like this, and then if you need to shorten the bench in the third and load up the top two lines. You can either flip Backlund and Lindholm to load up that line, or move Lindholm back to 13/23 RW to load up that line.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I'm repeating myself but if you rewatch how CGY played right up to the short-handed goal they were very good (clean exits and puck support giving d options to move it quick. They were not letting WPG set up defensively and CGY got a lot of zone time. WPG however got their zone time too and got shots and traffic). First 2 WPG goals were essentially give aways (but one much worse than over - hard truth). CGY comes back to make 2-1. 3-1 goal was tough to give up in that game.

WPG in their 1-2-2 just clogged it up for the second and CGY was unable to get inside and get some action at the net.

I think CGY was playing well enough to start the game that if they got up the tactics are different if CGY leading after 1st period.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

I have to agree with this take and it matches my Eye test: Simon is just a warm body who was adequate with Money-Johnny, but didn't add anything to the duo. We need to add someone who will be a positive contributor on that line. Dube is an option, as SM mentioned, but IMO Dube is much better suited to the Tkachuk-Lindholm line. And we need someone decent for Backlund to play with still!

Backlund between Leivo and Bennett in Mtl looked OK, except frankly, Backlund had a case of the fumbles.

[Burning Beard]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Thing is that provides you with better balance in other areas then.

If they are playing about the same with Simon or with Mangiapane doesn't that mean to keep Simon on that line and utilize Mangiapane somewhere else where he's more impactful.

Gaudreau/Monahan looked great, and produced while playing with Simon, why not stick with that to provide more depth elsewhere in the lineup instead of putting Dube/Mangiapane on that line.

I also think that while Lindholm/Tkachuk have looked good together at times, that all three of Mangiapane/Backlund/Tkachuk have looked better on a line with their proven chemistry together.

I would like to see the following line up. Doesn't really give us a top line, but gives us a pretty balanced top 9.

Gaudreau - Monahan - Simon
Dube - Lindholm - Bennett (Haven't seen this line before but feel like they'd be a real pain in the ass to play against)
Tkachuk - Backlund - Mangiapane
Lucic - Ryan - Leivo

Personally I'd like to see them try an approach where they start the game with more balanced lines like this, and then if you need to shorten the bench in the third and load up the top two lines. You can either flip Backlund and Lindholm to load up that line, or move Lindholm back to 13/23 RW to load up that line.

Get Ward on the ringer. I like these lines!

[8sPOT]

Does Lucic have to play every game? Is he able to sit out? Seems like when he’s on, he’s ok. But when he’s off, he’s a complete liability out there.

Having Lucic in the lineup every game does not represent the best possible lineup. So what gives?

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Red

To win the division the Flames will have to almost run the table against Montreal and Toronto because you just know they will split with Ottawa

If this team splits with Ottawa, truly nothing matters because we'd be in the basement with them.

[Monahammer]

Ottawa was playing with a shooter tutor in net last night. If we split the season series with them everyone managing the organization in any way should be fired so we can start again.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Thing is that provides you with better balance in other areas then.

If they are playing about the same with Simon or with Mangiapane doesn't that mean to keep Simon on that line and utilize Mangiapane somewhere else where he's more impactful.

I see, I thought you were saying that they were significantly better with Simon than without him. What you're saying makes sense based on what I've seen, it's just a question of whether or not there's data to say that Mangiapane is elevating another line combination (Chucky / Backlund) that's performing worse without him. So basically the same exercise you just performed but for wherever you want to slot him in.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Ottawa was playing with a shooter tutor in net last night. If we split the season series with them everyone managing the organization in any way should be fired so we can start again.

If Ottawa is going to have success against any team this season it's likely going to be the Flames. The Flames are struggling to score 5 on 5 and have a penchant for giving up early leads. This is exactly what provides the Senators with their best opportunity to win games. I can't be the only person here that is dreading when these teams meet because of the likely disappointment.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

I see, I thought you were saying that they were significantly better with Simon than without him. What you're saying makes sense based on what I've seen, it's just a question of whether or not there's data to say that Mangiapane is elevating another line combination (Chucky / Backlund) that's performing worse without him. So basically the same exercise you just performed but for wherever you want to slot him in.

Backlund seems to really need Mangiapane right now.

Backlund+Mangiapane

TOI: 50 Minutes

CF%: 52.3%
HDCF%: 66.7%
XGF%: 68.4%

Offensive Zone FO: 37.0%

GF: 1
GA: 1

Backlund w/o Mangiapane

TOI: 60 Minutes

CF%: 51.0%
HDCF%: 40.0%
XGF%: 47.1%

Offensive Zone FO: 37.5%

GF: 2
GA: 4

So I'd say that the Backlund line is benefitting from Mangiapane on his wing a lot more than the Gaudreau/Monahan line benefits from having him there.

[VANFLAMESFAN]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

If Ottawa is going to have success against any team this season it's likely going to be the Flames. The Flames are struggling to score 5 on 5 and have a penchant for giving up early leads. This is exactly what provides the Senators with their best opportunity to win games. I can't be the only person here that is dreading when these teams meet because of the likely disappointment.

Haha, okay. Dreading the senators? Likely disappointment?

Do you truly believe these words? My goodness.

I’ll gladly bet a good sum of cash of the flames winning 7 or more of the 9 against that team. The Sens are THAT BAD.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

If Ottawa is going to have success against any team this season it's likely going to be the Flames. The Flames are struggling to score 5 on 5 and have a penchant for giving up early leads. This is exactly what provides the Senators with their best opportunity to win games. I can't be the only person here that is dreading when these teams meet because of the likely disappointment.

I look forward to it but I am not continually expecting disappointment

[Red]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

That's ridiculous. The Flames have 8-, 9- and 10-game sets against every team in the Division, which so far break down like this:

Winnipeg: 1-1-1 — 3/6 pts with 10 points on the table
Vancouver: 2-0-0 — 4/4 with 16 points on the table
Toronto: 0-2-0 — 0/4 with 14 points on the table
Montreal: 1-1-0 — 2/4 with 14 points on the table

It is still way too early to be declaring victory or defeat for any team except Ottawa.

Time to lighten up and maybe you won't take every post so literally. It clearly upsets you.