2020/2021 Trade Speculation and Rumours

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

He struggled, and yet Monahan was still the Flames points-leader in the 2020 playoffs.


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Yup Dubois was an absolute beast with 10pts in 10 games but Monahan was a monumental disappointment with 8pts in 10 games.

Again we all agree there is a + required to do a Monahan for Dubois deal but I think there is a good amount of overrating Dubois and an even bigger amount of underrating Monahan

[SportsJunky]

I'd love to see a Monahan for Dubois deal. Throw in Kylington or Mangiapane.

I was just looking at different zone entry/exit stats for 2019-2020. Dubois destroys Monahan (I know it isn't Monahan's job). As a matter of fact, Dubois bests everybody on Calgary when it comes to exit/entry stats. He even out performs Gaudreau and Johnny is pretty much elite when it comes to that.

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by Bonded

Yup, I feel Dubois is getting a touch overrated here.

I seem to remember the same was said about Getzlaf, big centers with the ability to carry the play/hold on to the pick are hard to find, give Dubois some decent wingers I think he'll explode to stardom.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Okay pal well Dubois scored his hat trick in a qualifying round against the 8th seeded team who hasn’t won a playoff series since 2004. So he had a monster game in not even real playoffs

What does 2004 have to do with PLD? Not that I’m stuck on that one game by PLD as you seem to be , but show me the one game this year playoff round that Mony single handily won?

Again I like Mony but I haven’t seen enough improvement from him come playoff time to make me think he is the number one center we need. Yes I would love him as a #2 but you have to give to get. I see no scenario where Columbus trades PLC to flames without Mony going back.

I also don’t like when posters think that just because you want a player from another team for your star player means you are over rating in coming player and disrespecting the player out.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

What does 2004 have to do with PLD? Not that I’m stuck on that one game by PLD as you seem to be , but show me the one game this year playoff round that Mony single handily won?

Again I like Mony but I haven’t seen enough improvement from him come playoff time to make me think he is the number one center we need. Yes I would love him as a #2 but you have to give to get. I see no scenario where Columbus trades PLC to flames without Mony going back.

So, I don't get what you are arguing against in this thread. Virtually everyone agrees that a Monahan + deal is what it would take for the Flames to acquire Dubois.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

So, I don't get what you are arguing against in this thread. Virtually everyone agrees that a Monahan + deal is what it would take for the Flames to acquire Dubois.

I’m not arguing on what it takes to get him. If you go back many pages I was probably the first to say mony plus Mangiapane for PLd. I’m arguing if mony is the #1 center we should have come playoff time. For me PLD is better suited for playoffs .

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

What does 2004 have to do with PLD? Not that I’m stuck on that one game by PLD as you seem to be , but show me the one game this year playoff round that Mony single handily won?

Again I like Mony but I haven’t seen enough improvement from him come playoff time to make me think he is the number one center we need. Yes I would love him as a #2 but you have to give to get. I see no scenario where Columbus trades PLC to flames without Mony going back.

In making my comment about beating the lowly Leafs I am mocking your take on the Canucks not being a good enough team. I guess that was supposed to absolve the performance where Monahan was a huge part of a 3 goal comeback to win a series.

Flames beat the crap out of the Jets. Is the 3pt performance in game 3 against the Jets less valued because the flames won 6-2? Would you have fonder memories if it was a come from behind 3-2 win?

Again I think it is universally agreed upon the Flames need to sweeten the pot in a Monahan-Dubois swap but for the Jackets who may be forced to deal PLD due to a trade request I think they would want a C in return.

A Monahan+ package would be an offer they likely entertain. I still think a Laine lead package could be the deal that makes the most sense for the Jackets (even though he is a winger) as Laine has significant more upside than Monahan and Mangipane in my opinion.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

I’m not arguing on what it takes to get him. If you go back many pages I was probably the first to say mony plus Mangiapane for PLd. I’m arguing if mony is the #1 center we should have come playoff time. For me PLD is better suited for playoffs .

Ah, I see. And there I think it is pretty debatable: given that Dubois has such limited playoff experience with a mixture of great and average performances, and given that Monahan has consistently been the Flames top-scoring player in the playoffs year after year. I think Dubois could be a beast, but it is far from certain that he will top out as a better player than Monahan.

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[Robbob]

Yeah, Monahan seems to get a lot of blame for the Flames lack of success it seems. I just have a feeling he is close. He could hit 200 career goals before February (needs 6). He can score goals at the NHL level which is tough, we all just want him to score more in the playoffs. He currently is a .70 pts/gm in the playoffs.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

In making my comment about beating the lowly Leafs I am mocking your take on the Canucks not being a good enough team. I guess that was supposed to absolve the performance where Monahan was a huge part of a 3 goal comeback to win a series.

Flames beat the crap out of the Jets. Is the 3pt performance in game 3 against the Jets less valued because the flames won 6-2? Would you have fonder memories if it was a come from behind 3-2 win?

Again I think it is universally agreed upon the Flames need to sweeten the pot in a Monahan-Dubois swap but for the Jackets who may be forced to deal PLD due to a trade request I think they would want a C in return.

A Monahan+ package would be an offer they likely entertain. I still think a Laine lead package could be the deal that makes the most sense for the Jackets (even though he is a winger) as Laine has significant more upside than Monahan and Mangipane in my opinion.

Monahan would have more value to the Jackets than Laine if they're shipping out their young center. One is a two-way center that can score and one's a more one-dimensional winger that can score. Centers have the edge every time as it's the more coveted position.

But needless to say the would be other comparable packages out there.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Monahan would have more value to the Jackets than Laine if they're shipping out their young center. One is a two-way center that can score and one's a more one-dimensional winger that can score. Centers have the edge every time as it's the more coveted position.

But needless to say the would be other comparable packages out there.

I think any way you slice it Laine has significantly more value than Monahan. Flames table an offer of Monahan and Mangipane and the Jets offer Laine and Roslivic I am not sure which offer the jackets would rather take but I assume the Jets offer. Laine’ potential would be too much for the Jackets to pass up I would think.

Then you have a team like the Habs who would be heavily incentivized to bring in a French Canadian young potential superstar. They could start their deal with Kotkeniemi, or Suzuki and add good prospects. The Rangers have a package around Kakko, the Flyers have a bunch of young pieces.

No shortage of great offers will come in if the Jackets make a move.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Ah, I see. And there I think it is pretty debatable: given that Dubois has such limited playoff experience with a mixture of great and average performances, and given that Monahan has consistently been the Flames top-scoring player in the playoffs year after year. I think Dubois could be a beast, but it is far from certain that he will top out as a better player than Monahan.

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You are making Monahan out to be a playoff performer. Top scoring player year after year in the playoffs? He has led the club in playoff goal scoring once, in 2017. I guess he was tied for lead in points last year, but only 2 goals in 10 games counting the play in round. Zero goals vs Dallas.

[SuperMatt18]

Changing topics a bit....what are New Jersey’s plans here?

They have 9 forwards signed and Bratt is still unsigned as an RFA with camp supposed to open this week.

I guess they could go really young and have guys like Merkley, Boqvist, Nolan, or Mercer, make the roster but you feel like they need to be looking to add a forward.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Robbob

Yeah, Monahan seems to get a lot of blame for the Flames lack of success it seems. I just have a feeling he is close. He could hit 200 career goals before February (needs 6). He can score goals at the NHL level which is tough, we all just want him to score more in the playoffs. He currently is a .70 pts/gm in the playoffs.

I like Monahan; There is no doubt about his ability to contribute offensively and he adds a lot to the team. I just don't see him and Johnny as the main answer on the top line. My preference would be for the Flames to upgrade the top line with players who are hard nosed, driven, physical and consistent. At times the last couple of seasons we seem to lack an identity. There have been a few factors, Monahan's injuries', Johnny shying a bit from contact, and maybe lacking some of his former speed and agility. Teams tend to play them more physically which can be a disadvantage in the grind of the playoffs. I think this can only change with the right mix of players on the top line. I am for keeping, or trading Monahan if we can find the right pieces.

[Sandman]

I've said it before many times-I like Mony, and I believe he's AT LEAST a #1b Center. However, maybe he's not the type of first-line Center that WE need. I think we need a much faster, more play-driving type to play on that line. Johnny is too often the one making zone entries, and plays off the rush-it's too predictable. If we could aquire another C that pushes Mony down the line-up, that would be gold, but it's hard to imagine getting what we want without giving up somebody like Mony-both for trade quality, and cap reasons.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

You are making Monahan out to be a playoff performer. Top scoring player year after year in the playoffs? He has led the club in playoff goal scoring once, in 2017. I guess he was tied for lead in points last year, but only 2 goals in 10 games counting the play in round. Zero goals vs Dallas.

He’s actually been brutal in the playoffs. Ridiculous unwillingness to play with grit or elevate/ hit / block shots / stand up for teammates / play with passion...

Defending playoff Monahan is a really odd take / hill to die on because of how obviously bad he’s been for the most part.

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by Sandman

I've said it before many times-I like Mony, and I believe he's AT LEAST a #1b Center.

So a second line center?

[DeluxeMoustache]

Monahan has proven to be clutch over the years, i would argue evidenced in part by his OT goals.

You don’t trade a guy with his scoring ability and cap hit, plus self awareness and commitment to improvement, if you can instead put them in a position to succeed

Gaudreau is small and Monahan is not overly physical. So is the answer more speed, physicality, or a good all around two way forward? Or to divide their talents? Depends on a lot of things, including the coach and the D, partly

Put Tkachuk on their wing? Is he actually physical, or just irritating? I see him as having good sense and hands. Certainly not the most fleet of foot but a smart player. That’s why he works well with Backlund, who is a rock solid 2 way Center, shifty and can carry the puck, plus Mang who plays with pace.

It’s a staffing and mix issue. They have the players IMO to do well. They have done well with a much worse roster

Coach, it’s your job. Earn your paycheque

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

Monahan has proven to be clutch over the years, i would argue evidenced in part by his OT goals.

You don’t trade a guy with his scoring ability and cap hit, plus self awareness and commitment to improvement, if you can instead put them in a position to succeed

Gaudreau is small and Monahan is not overly physical. So is the answer more speed, physicality, or a good all around two way forward? Or to divide their talents? Depends on a lot of things, including the coach and the D, partly

Put Tkachuk on their wing? Is he actually physical, or just irritating? I see him as having good sense and hands. Certainly not the most fleet of foot but a smart player. That’s why he works well with Backlund, who is a rock solid 2 way Center, shifty and can carry the puck, plus Mang who plays with pace.

It’s a staffing and mix issue. They have the players IMO to do well. They have done well with a much worse roster

Coach, it’s your job. Earn your paycheque

Clutch? For scoring 3 on 3 goals?......Not in my books.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Clutch? For scoring 3 on 3 goals?......Not in my books.

I agree.

Monny’s OT goals are often the result of the space and time Johnny receives while playing 3 on 3.

If hockey was 3 on 3, we likely aren’t having this discussion. Physicality goes out the window.


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