Ongoing Sci-Fi, Comic Book Movie Thread v2

[Nadal Fan]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Oh, I don't mean critic reviews, I mean the type that are posted in this forum. Other than you, I think it has been universally panned here as a disaster. I don't trust critics one bit. I understand wanting to watch it yourself, which I'll probably do eventually. I don't understand paying $30 to do it.


The imdb reviews are not good either...
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt7126948...ws?ref_=tt_urv

That makes sense, ya I get it most people aren't fans of it on this site lol. I did enjoy it but I'm definitely in the minority here.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Locke

As a general rule I avoid movies that are below 6.0 on IMDB because you can kind of rely on those to regress to the mean and give you an idea about the quality of a movie.

Sitting at 5.6 right now and thats propped up by a lot of "Professional" 8s and 9s from the early screenings.

I'm with Fuzz. I'm going to watch this movie, if for no other reason than to bask in the trainwreck, but I'm sure as hell not renting it for $30.

And its sounding more and more like Jenkins was the weakest link here. Which does not bode well for Star Wars.

I'll say this about Jenkins and star wars. She's maling Rogue Squadron. Something she knows intimately about the protagonists her whole life. Pilots. I have a lot more faith in her doing a fighter jet movie telling stories about the kind of people she was raised by and around her whole life than I do about a comic book hero.

Theres a sequence in ww84 you'll see where if you listen and watch, you'll know she will make an amazing movie about fighter pilots.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

I don't understand the career trajectory of some of the big players in Hollywood right now. Jenkins did Monster, then a series of one-off television gigs, landed Wonder Woman (good for her) and now a huge remake of Cleopatra followed by Star Wars. That's quite a leap.

It feels like she's following in the footsteps of Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman and David Benihoff in people who must talk just a fantastic game. To a lesser extent JJ Abrams and Snyder Cut are in this group as well, as people how are propped up not based on work in the field, or outstanding achievement.

Why is sci-fi and fantasy a dumping ground?

Meanwhile David Fincher and Denis Villeneuve have to fight tooth and nail to get their projects made.

God I hate Hollywood sometimes.

[trackercowe]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Even a 1.0 graded book is worth about $20k. Not bad.

Just a 1.8, bought it from Heritage a couple years back for 21k. I have a pretty crazy comic collection, but since Action 1 and Tec 27 are probably out of reach I went with All-Star 8 to begin with.

Patty Jenkins brings up an interesting conversation I had. Many critics also said they appreciate her filmography and had great expectations in this movie. Why is that? What has she done to deserve such acclaim and trust? Monster and Wonder Woman were good, but not classics.

So why is Jenkins so well thought of? I know this may come off as sexist, but is she treated so positively because she's a woman working in a man's world? I watched the Chris Stuckman review, which is quite on point, yet the first thing he did was praise Jenkins. I thought to myself, why? She is not a Fincher or Villeneuve. I think there might be a sense of fear in labelling this movie poor as some might consider you sexist for not enjoying her work. Almost every negative review has said something similar, praising Jenkins forb some unknown reason (like she's Kathryn Bigelow).

Another thing I've been pondering is that I don't think 1984 is feminist propaganda, but clearly much of it is forcing misogany. All the men in the movie are revolting caricatures with their jaws on the floor for Diana and Barbara. They're complete pigs devoid of humanity. Even the henchmen and people working for Lord, every single one is a man. Also when someone wishes for evil acts to occur (like the heart attack) its always a man. Lord only has evil men make wishes (including the awful performance by whoever played the president). Barbara turns "evil" because that random alcoholic forces himself upon her. So even she changes because she lives in a male dominated society. She also wants to get with Lord... But that story is quickly dropped. I'm not sure if anyone else noticed this during the movie, but watch it carefully next time and see if I'm wrong; hopefully I am!

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Nm

[Nadal Fan]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Meanwhile David Fincher and Denis Villeneuve have to fight tooth and nail to get their projects made.

God I hate Hollywood sometimes.

Villeneuve is in my top 5 for favorite directors, but after BR2049 (which was fantastic and I loved it) made $260 million on a $185 million budget he was given $165 million to make Dune. I wouldn't feel bad for him, he still gets to make what he wants.

Jenkins took $150 million and made WW which made well over $800 million and followed it up with $200 million to make WW84.

At the end of the day it's a business but if the first Wonder Woman made as much as BR2049 I guarantee she wouldn't be given $165 million to make her next movie.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

For the first time in this thread I can say this unequivocally: Nadal Fan is totally right.

Though it effectively puts Jenkins in the same directorial category as Michael Bay; i.e., we'll keep giving you large budgets regardless of how good the movies you make are as long as they continue to perform at the box office.

[trackercowe]

Or Colin "I single handily ruined Jurassic Park and almost ruined Star Wars " Trevorrow.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Nadal Fan

Villeneuve is in my top 5 for favorite directors, but after BR2049 (which was fantastic and I loved it) made $260 million on a $185 million budget he was given $165 million to make Dune. I wouldn't feel bad for him, he still gets to make what he wants.

Jenkins took $150 million and made WW which made well over $800 million and followed it up with $200 million to make WW84.

At the end of the day it's a business but if the first Wonder Woman made as much as BR2049 I guarantee she wouldn't be given $165 million to make her next movie.

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

For the first time in this thread I can say this unequivocally: Nadal Fan is totally right.

Though it effectively puts Jenkins in the same directorial category as Michael Bay; i.e., we'll keep giving you large budgets regardless of how good the movies you make are as long as they continue to perform at the box office.

Well duh. You guys think this is new info?

Doesn’t make my post any less true.

[Inglewood Jack]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

For the first time in this thread I can say this unequivocally: Nadal Fan is totally right.

Though it effectively puts Jenkins in the same directorial category as Michael Bay; i.e., we'll keep giving you large budgets regardless of how good the movies you make are as long as they continue to perform at the box office.

Based on the success of WW 1918, by all means give Jenkins a load more cash for the sequel if you think you have sufficient evidence of a gifted director at the plate. But then they were like, hey why don’t you also be writer and producer as well, since those must be inherent skills that every good director has.

This is likely just another case of George Lucas effect, where you have one person with uncontested control of too much, in particular the things they aren’t even good or proven at.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Inglewood Jack

Based on the success of WW 1918, by all means give Jenkins a load more cash for the sequel if you think you have sufficient evidence of a gifted director at the plate. But then they were like, hey why don’t you also be writer and producer as well, since those must be inherent skills that every good director has.

This is likely just another case of George Lucas effect, where you have one person with uncontested control of too much, in particular the things they aren’t even good or proven at.

IMO nearly all of the problems with WW1984 start with the flimsy script. As you say, writing is a different skill than directing.

[Nadal Fan]

I will say I hope they bring back Allan Heinberg to write the third one. Dude gets Wonder Woman and wrote some of the first one. He also wrote several Sex and the City episodes, including the one when Carrie dates a comic store owner. And also would be cool if Zack Snyder came back to write the third one as well, as he also wrote some of the first one.

[trackercowe]

Keep Zack Snyder away from the DCEU please and thank you. He's rubbish. Back up a truckload of money to Chris Nolan and Emma Thomas. Let them take over this show, maybe they can attempt to salvage all this if rebooting isn't an option.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by Nadal Fan

I will say I hope they bring back Allan Heinberg to write the third one. Dude gets Wonder Woman and wrote some of the first one. He also wrote several Sex and the City episodes, including the one when Carrie dates a comic store owner. And also would be cool if Zack Snyder came back to write the third one as well, as he also wrote some of the first one.

Great point on Heinberg. I'm quite willing to hang WW84s problems more on Johns at this point than I am on Jenkins.

I don't think WW84's performance is worth a whole lot of detailed discussion or in-depth analysis tbh. It seems like a pretty typical case of a sequel underdelivering compared to its progenitor. The history of movies is littered with cases like this across all eras and genres.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Really hard to tell who to blame without more info. Could be studio, DCEU (like Johns), director, writer, actor interference etc.

Most of the time it’s a combo of them all. When a idiot studio heads push a bad script with a director in over her head with an actor who has command of the franchise, it is not a recipe for success.

[Locke]

This is the infuriating part about DC.

They had Time, Talent, Budget and loads of quality source material. And this was the best they could do.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by trackercowe

Or Colin "I single handily ruined Jurassic Park and almost ruined Star Wars " Trevorrow.

The World franchise is just a parody of Park, as far as I see it.

And yes, even the "Allen!" entry is above the new CGI monstrosities. Head, shoulders and d### above them

[FireGilbert]

Does anyone else see the DC logo and produced by Zack Snyder at the start of these movies and immediately go:

[trackercowe]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

The World franchise is just a parody of Park, as far as I see it.

And yes, even the "Allen!" entry is above the new CGI monstrosities. Head, shoulders and d### above them

You win this round good sir... yes like Jaws they should have let Spielberg do his one thing and got the hell out of there.

Matter of fact I am shocked we haven't had any kind of Jaws reboot!

[Nadal Fan]

The biggest problem is that Snyder always wanted to do a 5 movie epic but WB wanted a MCU style universe of films. They never ironed this out and hence we get 2 different time lines. Both Jenkins and Waan have said their movies will follow the Snyder Cut universe and not the Justice League released in theatres. I think if the Snyder films were part of their own universe they would have been more well recieved by fans and critics.