Alabama Says: Guns are Ok, but Sex Toys are illegal

[Daradon]

As I mentioned above, what right does the government have in jurisdiciting how we get our jollies (as long as no harm comes obviously).

And how can you compare that to gun laws that obviously do affect other people?

[worth]

How do gun laws affect other people?

Edit: Guess what i'm trying to say if someone is going to shoot another person, laws aren't going to do anything to deterr this.

Also, on the Obama note, his wife is CFR, which I just found out and which is very interesting.

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by worth

How do gun laws affect other people?

Edit: Guess what i'm trying to say if someone is going to shoot another person, laws aren't going to do anything to deterr this.

Also, on the Obama note, his wife is CFR, which I just found out and which is very interesting.

Guns kill people far more effectively than anyone. So effectively that 5 year olds have done it.

They wouldn't be able to do that with their fists, or knives.

That's how they affect other people.

[LeftWing]

Originally Posted by worth

Guess what i'm trying to say if someone is going to shoot another person, laws aren't going to do anything to deterr this.

It's a simple correlation - liberal gun laws put more guns into the hands of the populous thus increasing the occurrences of violent crime and gun-related accidents.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by LeftWing

It's a simple correlation - liberal gun laws put more guns into the hands of the populous thus increasing the occurrences of violent crime and gun-related accidents.

I don't particularly agree with this unless your talking about accidental death by firearm.

For the most part the people that intend to use guns for crimes are going to find ways to get those guns, and all the gun control laws in the world won't prevent it, unless those laws are universal.

I read about a load of Chinese AK-47's coming into Canada without serial numbers stamped on them, so a gun registry isn't going to stop that or a ban on the firearms.

Selling guns illegally is way to profitable of a venture for somebody whose looking to make a quick buck not to take advantage of it.

The only way to prevent illegal gun use is a really punative penalty for getting caught with the use of guns in a crime, in effect life means life.

Your never going to remove the really exotic weapons from the street any other way.

An AK-47 might be illegal, but I've seen them.

An AR-15 can be modified to a full automatic weapon with 10 minutes of work and two tools.

9mm Uzi's are all over the place, as are desert eagles and 9mm glocks. And those are all banned weapons.

Bet they don't have trackable serial numbers either. And you can't blame the original manufacturers because these things are manufactured in the far east illegally and cheaply and then shipped into Canada through our pourous borders and ports.

Heck, I can even build a silencer and modify a weapon to make use of it with some tubing and steel wool and a really good drill press.

[Vulcan]

To me, lumping all guns into one group doesn't tell the story.
I don't like hand guns or assault rifles as their sole purpose is killing people and having them around is far too tempting. I have no problem with banning these for the general public.
Hunting rifles have a legitimate use in our culture although it seems to be changing with kids growing up in cities and having no real relationship with the wild.

[Looger]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

An AK-47 might be illegal, but I've seen them.

An AR-15 can be modified to a full automatic weapon with 10 minutes of work and two tools.

9mm Uzi's are all over the place, as are desert eagles and 9mm glocks. And those are all banned weapons.

Bet they don't have trackable serial numbers either. And you can't blame the original manufacturers because these things are manufactured in the far east illegally and cheaply and then shipped into Canada through our pourous borders and ports.

Heck, I can even build a silencer and modify a weapon to make use of it with some tubing and steel wool and a really good drill press.

you sound like a fun person to hang out with, Cowperson!

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Looger

you sound like a fun person to hang out with, Cowperson!

err except I'm not cowperson

Quit insulting the poor guy

[Looger]

as to the debate i am pretty on the fence here...

i see hunting gun registration as a list to round 'em up, with three days of food on grocery shelves...

yet i think that guns made for the express purpose of homicide should not be allowed to be manufactured, though obviously porous borders do nothing but drive the street prices up from $100 or whatever in the states to a few hundred here - guns aren't huge and can be broken down.

i think we should have a swiss style reservist gun ownership, which might weed out some people that should not be allowed to own one.

very complex issue...

two christmases ago i was at a gun store (er sporting goods store...), shopping for GPS handhelds, and there was a huge lineup of older germans buying guns as if they were butter (bad joke on the germans, sorry...) - and i got to talking to this older dude, and he said that gun control was a warning sign under hitler.

i've heard some differing reports regarding the third reich and gun control, but regardless of that, to this day gun registry / control is associated with centralized powerful governments in the minds of many.

[Looger]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

err except I'm not cowperson

Quit insulting the poor guy

sorry to both of you!

second time i've done that!

[Daradon]

Nukes don't kill people, every person and country should be free to create nukes

[LeftWing]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

For the most part the people that intend to use guns for crimes are going to find ways to get those guns, and all the gun control laws in the world won't prevent it, unless those laws are universal.

Okay, I think perhaps your logic is a bit flawed.

I would venture to say that the same concept applies to illegal drugs - those that use drugs will find a way to get them no matter what type of enforcement is in effect. However, by having laws against illegal drug use in place, we are keeping a large percentage of people from using drugs that may decide to try drugs if the laws were relaxed.

The same is true for guns, the more relaxed the regulations are, the more people will have guns. That's a fact.

I'm not saying that regulations keep a murderer from getting a gun and killing someone, I *am* saying that a person pushed past their breaking point will be more inclined towards using a gun if it is already in their possesion.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Looger

as to the debate i am pretty on the fence here...

i see hunting gun registration as a list to round 'em up, with three days of food on grocery shelves...

I'm not sure what your getting at, however the majority of people who hunt are doing it as a sporting activity, besides hunting is somewhat of a Canadian tradition, natives do still hunt for some food, and farmers use hunting rifles to get rid of coyotes and other harmful critters on thier land, so I believe that hunting long rifles have to remain protected. However how hard is it to take a hunting rifle, add a commonly available long distant site, and etch a breaking point on the front of a hundred rounds to go from a simple hunting rifle to a pretty deadly sniper rifle with expanding rounds.

Originally Posted by Looger

yet i think that guns made for the express purpose of homicide should not be allowed to be manufactured, though obviously porous borders do nothing but drive the street prices up from $100 or whatever in the states to a few hundred here - guns aren't huge and can be broken down.

You'd never ever stop the manufacturing of it since most of them are made by companies in unregulated countries who have bought the stamping tools and licenses and don't care where thier weapons end up. China is one of the bigger manufacturers of the AK-47 rifle and AKM assualt rifle. Singapore turns out thousands of UZI's a year, and if you want to buy a decent UZI knockoff you can buy a similar gun out of any number of eastern block countries.

In order to stop the flow of weapons like these, you either have to shut down the manufacturers or do a better job of border enforcement. Gun restrictions or registries do nothing to solve the problem and just waste a lot of money.

Originally Posted by Looger

i think we should have a swiss style reservist gun ownership, which might weed out some people that should not be allowed to own one.

Until somebody breaks into your house one night when your out steals your rifle, grinds off the serial numbers and scores the barrel making the weapon untraceable.


[quote=Looger;765577]very complex issue...[/quote

Sorry to play devil advocate on your post.


t

Originally Posted by Looger

wo christmases ago i was at a gun store (er sporting goods store...), shopping for GPS handhelds, and there was a huge lineup of older germans buying guns as if they were butter (bad joke on the germans, sorry...) - and i got to talking to this older dude, and he said that gun control was a warning sign under hitler.

I forgot what book I read it in, but thats very true about the german state. If your truly going to be an authoritarian government the first thing you do is remove guns from the streets. Thats why the American's are so zealous of protecting thier second ammendment rights. Now a lot of european nations didn't come from the gun culture that the American's did, but the American culture is unique even in North America, because Canada didn't put as much emphasis on the right to bear arms and were on thier borders, had similar civil type wars and invasions. I don't know what Mexican gun control laws are like, but they were also a 6 barrel nation.

Originally Posted by Looger

i've heard some differing reports regarding the third reich and gun control, but regardless of that, to this day gun registry / control is associated with centralized powerful governments in the minds of many.

From what I understand the Germans had a fairly liberal gun control position before Hitler came into power, and Hitler made a complete gun ban including rifles, he believed that only the police and the military should have control of the nations fire arms "For the safety and security of germans citizens"

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by LeftWing

Okay, I think perhaps your logic is a bit flawed.

I would venture to say that the same concept applies to illegal drugs - those that use drugs will find a way to get them no matter what type of enforcement is in effect. However, by having laws against illegal drug use in place, we are keeping a large percentage of people from using drugs that may decide to try drugs if the laws were relaxed.

The same is true for guns, the more relaxed the regulations are, the more people will have guns. That's a fact.

I'm not saying that regulations keep a murderer from getting a gun and killing someone, I *am* saying that a person pushed past their breaking point will be more inclined towards using a gun if it is already in their possesion.

I do partially agree with this statement, however I stand by my point that people who are going to commit gun crimes will find weapons outside of the law or a registry. I also read a study a couple of years ago that people that didn't own a gun, but decided to commit a crime usually were able to find and buy an illegal weapon within 48 hours of making thier decision.

[Daradon]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I do partially agree with this statement, however I stand by my point that people who are going to commit gun crimes will find weapons outside of the law or a registry. I also read a study a couple of years ago that people that didn't own a gun, but decided to commit a crime usually were able to find and buy an illegal weapon within 48 hours of making thier decision.

But guns kill so many more people so easily.

As I said above...

Nukes dont' kill people, button pushing people kill people.

Lets allow everyone (and every nation) a nuke.

Wait a minute. U.S. don't like that.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Daradon

But guns kill so many more people so easily.

As I said above...

Nukes dont' kill people, button pushing people kill people.

Lets allow everyone (and every nation) a nuke.

Wait a minute. U.S. don't like that.

I remember a comedian once said Guns don't kill people, people don't kill people, bullets moving really fast kill people.

[worth]

Cars kill people more easily than people walking into each other. Let's make a law against cars.

The gun control laws in this country are rediculious.

The people who go through the trouble of registering their guns and jumping through all the governments regulations are not the ones commiting crimes and shooting others.

I find it funny how people think that if we increase gun control, gun crime will decrease.

All gun control does is limit law abiding citizens from using legal weapons.

Law abiding gun owners are the the reason for gun crime, so punishing them for owning guns doens't make much sense to me. Take illegal guns off the street, find the source of illegal weapons and we will be much safer.

[ricoFlame]

Sex doesn't kill people, sex toys kill people.

[rockstar]

Originally Posted by photon

http://www.boingboing.net/2007/02/15..._upheld_i.html

Link is ok, but link(s) after that might be NSFW.

Could governments please just stay out of the bedroom?

Sounds like pretty a good method of population control to me.

[Burninator]

Originally Posted by worth

Cars kill people more easily than people walking into each other. Let's make a law against cars.

The gun control laws in this country are rediculious.

The people who go through the trouble of registering their guns and jumping through all the governments regulations are not the ones commiting crimes and shooting others.

I find it funny how people think that if we increase gun control, gun crime will decrease.

All gun control does is limit law abiding citizens from using legal weapons.

Law abiding gun owners are the the reason for gun crime, so punishing them for owning guns doens't make much sense to me. Take illegal guns off the street, find the source of illegal weapons and we will be much safer.

I hear this a lot, that illegal guns are the ones commiting crimes. Does anyone have any evidence/stats/articles about this? I've just never read about it, just heard it from people who are pro-guns. Seems to make sense, but I would like to know for sure.