Who would you vote for?

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Slava

I voted for Biden (in the poll). I don't think he's good, but he's the least bad IMO.

I know plenty of would-be Trump voters though. There are a lot of reasons, so let me put a few down:

a) The economy: Trump had the economy doing very well, and they don't have the same confidence in Biden.

b) Taxes: Biden will probably increase them and who wants to pay more?

c) Trade: Trump has talked tough on trade and worked hard so that the US isn't taken advantage of. Biden would be much softer.

d) The state of the Democrats: There is a very leftist, socialist element in the democratic party and they should be far away from power.

This poll isn't all that reflective as what I hear in talking to people. I generally avoid the conversation, but people are super worked up and think that one of the two is crazy and shouldn't be in power...and it's really more split than I would have thought in terms of which party that is.

Theres more.

COVID: People want more things to open up safely, especially schools.

Sanctions on China.

2nd amendment.

Cancel culture.

[peter12]

How many voters have "cancel culture" as even a Top 5 issue? 2-3%?

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

The Macleans poll show 32 per cent of Albertans as pro-Trump. So CP members (at least those active in political threads) are not representative of Albertans. Presumably because this site skews young and educated.

I'd like to see a poll of CPers parents.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by peter12

How many voters have "cancel culture" as even a Top 5 issue? 2-3%?

It depends if you have been cancelled!

[Lanny_McDonald]

[QUOTE=Slava;7630842]Really have to jump all over these.

a) The economy: Trump had the economy doing very well, and they don't have the same confidence in Biden.

Which is really dumb. Implemented policy is not felt for two years after a President takes or leaves office. The great economy was a result of Obama policy. The bottom falling out was a result of Trump policy. Trump strolled into the White House and rode the coat tails of Obama's policy and took credit for stuff he did nothing to encourage. He then went and put in place a tax policy that was nothing but a raiding of the Treasury by the rich. That's when the economy went sideways because there was no money in the system to pay for things, because the rich people just took it all out, like they always do. Democrats spurn on good economies. Republicans spend their way into the bad ones. This has been consistent since the 70s.

b) Taxes: Biden will probably increase them and who wants to pay more?

Do your friends make more than $400K? Because those are the ones that are going to experience the tax increase.

c) Trade: Trump has talked tough on trade and worked hard so that the US isn't taken advantage of. Biden would be much softer.

WTF? Trump has been a disaster on trade. Tariffs have been his biggest tool and that has crushed industry in the United States. My god people are dense.

d) The state of the Democrats: There is a very leftist, socialist element in the democratic party and they should be far away from power.

Such a tired stupid talking point. That leftist/socialist movement is five people out of a party of 280ish people. And those people are all junior members. They have no influence or sway. Otherwise Bernie Sanders would be running against Trump right now. There is no leftist/socialist movement. The only socialism that exists in the United States is corporate socialism and the poor paying for the mistakes of the rich and the corporations. Maybe ask your friends when the last time they as individuals got a bailout, and how much that was? Because Wall Street, the banks, the airlines, the car industry, the fossil fuel industry, and so on have been gifted TRILLIONS in bailouts. Yeah, socialism is a real big fear in this country.

I know you're only the messenger Slava, but holy smokes there are a lot of people out there who don't get it.

[indes]

I would vote Biden but most people I know would vote Trump. I've posted a couple times on the lack of critical thinking among the general population. I have no problem listening to anyone's views, until you back them up with Facebook posts.

It's a sad time to be on the right side of the political spectrum. A win for Biden is a win for 99.9% of the "middle class" and democracy so side of the political spectrum be damned.

[Slava]

[QUOTE=New Era;7631002]

Originally Posted by Slava

Really have to jump all over these.



Which is really dumb. Implemented policy is not felt for two years after a President takes or leaves office. The great economy was a result of Obama policy. The bottom falling out was a result of Trump policy. Trump strolled into the White House and rode the coat tails of Obama's policy and took credit for stuff he did nothing to encourage. He then went and put in place a tax policy that was nothing but a raiding of the Treasury by the rich. That's when the economy went sideways because there was no money in the system to pay for things, because the rich people just took it all out, like they always do. Democrats spurn on good economies. Republicans spend their way into the bad ones. This has been consistent since the 70s.



Do your friends make more than $400K? Because those are the ones that are going to experience the tax increase.



WTF? Trump has been a disaster on trade. Tariffs have been his biggest tool and that has crushed industry in the United States. My god people are dense.



Such a tired stupid talking point. That leftist/socialist movement is five people out of a party of 280ish people. And those people are all junior members. They have no influence or sway. Otherwise Bernie Sanders would be running against Trump right now. There is no leftist/socialist movement. The only socialism that exists in the United States is corporate socialism and the poor paying for the mistakes of the rich and the corporations. Maybe ask your friends when the last time they as individuals got a bailout, and how much that was? Because Wall Street, the banks, the airlines, the car industry, the fossil fuel industry, and so on have been gifted TRILLIONS in bailouts. Yeah, socialism is a real big fear in this country.

I know you're only the messenger Slava, but holy smokes there are a lot of people out there who don't get it.

I’m not addressing these, because they’re not my points. I am just talking about what I’ve heard as to why people would vote (or are voting) for Trump.

On a personal scale, I’d vote grudgingly for Biden. Not because I think he’s amazing, he’s just less terrible. But my rationale and the importance of issues to me is completely different from the list I put (although economy is critical to me and I don’t share the same concerns in that vein as the Trump supporters I have talked to).

[Ragnar]

Originally Posted by pepper24

Good points. Most of my US work contacts are all voting Trump as well including blacks and Latinos I know. B and D are their reasons. Providing for their family is top priority.

As it should be. I don't understand the rhetoric in this thread that if you vote Trump you are a bad person. If an individual believes Trump provides a better economic outlook for their family, then that vote is justified IMO. You should not be vilified for choosing your family over other people, or as stated earlier, "the world". Has the world burned since Trump took office? Where is this coming from?

[Looch City]

Found a Trump voter, GET HIM!!

[codynw]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

The CP poll or the actual election votes?

Yes.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

As it should be. I don't understand the rhetoric in this thread that if you vote Trump you are a bad person. If an individual believes Trump provides a better economic outlook for their family, then that vote is justified IMO. You should not be vilified for choosing your family over other people, or as stated earlier, "the world". Has the world burned since Trump took office? Where is this coming from?

I understand the attraction of voting for someone you think is in the best interest of your family, but there has to be some point at which any compassionate person can't justify the trade off and you do indeed become a bad person.

Under Trump over 230,000 Americans have died from Covid 19.
I'd say the world has burned for them and many of those would have been prevented by better leadership.

Trump is openly pushing away from the rule of law and democratic government; attempting voter suppression, admitting he may not leave if he loses the election and attempting to become a dictator right in front of our faces.

Would you trade democracy if it benefits the economic outlook for your family?
Where do you draw the line, if anywhere?

[djsFlames]

It would make us no better than the hard-core Trumpites to witch hunt the Trump voters, but I'd seriously like to understand their line of thinking / justification.

How does one overlook all those character flaws enough to give this man their vote of confidence, particularly through the remainder of this pandemic which he has butchered to this point. I simply don't understand.

Help me to.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

As it should be. I don't understand the rhetoric in this thread that if you vote Trump you are a bad person. If an individual believes Trump provides a better economic outlook for their family, then that vote is justified IMO. You should not be vilified for choosing your family over other people, or as stated earlier, "the world". Has the world burned since Trump took office? Where is this coming from?

If it is true that 80,000 lives could be saved by the New Year with common sense Federal mask requirements, is that more important than your family?

[#-3]

Originally Posted by Ragnar

Has the world burned since Trump took office? Where is this coming from?

Depending on your world outlook.

• Leaving the Paris accords.
  Dismantling Trade partnerships designed to combat a growing Chinese hegemony over global trade.
  Rolling back Environments and Conservation Protections.
  Explicitly incentivizing polluters just to stick a needle in the libs eyes.
  Fueling Nuclear Proliferation.
  Dismantling the infectious disease detection and mitigation programs.
  Doubling down on crack pop unsustainable economic policies
  Stoking domestic social divides, leading to very serious people very seriously musing about the prospects of civil conflict.
  Publicly fomenting sedition and domestic terrorism.
  Very publicly and directly inspiring and endorsing vigilante murderers
  Throwing events that have directly caused the deaths of hundreds of people and indirectly thousands
  Explicitly endorsing cultural and possibly literal genocide

These are conservative problems that go against the maintenance of the pax-americana world order that we have all reaped the benefits of. The world feels like a much much more dangerous place to me because of his actions. Even if we somehow step away from this ledge, that doesn't mean he didn't try to set the world on fire.

And this is to say nothing about the corruption and self dealing that normally seems to get conservatives panties in a bunch.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

It would make us no better than the hard-core Trumpites to witch hunt the Trump voters, but I'd seriously like to understand their line of thinking / justification.

How does one overlook all those character flaws enough to give this man their vote of confidence, particularly through the remainder of this pandemic which he has butchered to this point. I simply don't understand.

Help me to.

You’re not just voting for Trump or Biden. There are a ton of issues that are in play.

[JohnnyB]

So, based on our results here, CP is significantly more left than even the most left states in the US. We make Washington, Oregon and California look like Republican strongholds in comparison.

[Iowa_Flames_Fan]

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

So, based on our results here, CP is significantly more left than even the most left states in the US. We make Washington, Oregon and California look like Republican strongholds in comparison.

You’re equating not supporting Donald Trump with being left wing. I think that’s a mistake: many conservatives don’t particularly like Trump.

[JohnnyB]

Originally Posted by Iowa_Flames_Fan

You’re equating not supporting Donald Trump with being left wing. I think that’s a mistake: many conservatives don’t particularly like Trump.

If they don't like Trump, I would think they must like his policies. Why else would he be getting the votes?

Anyways, it was mostly meant in jest.

[Barnet Flame]

It has more to do with my moral compass than a left/right thing.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

So, based on our results here, CP is significantly more left than even the most left states in the US. We make Washington, Oregon and California look like Republican strongholds in comparison.

I doubt that, I think its more along the lines of plugging noses and voting for Biden.



I think that either candidate Trump and Biden are just poor candidates for the presidency, but Trump is far worse and more destructive and damaging and dangerous.



But I don't have a belief that Biden is going to be a great president or a great choice.