2020/2021 English Premier League

[devo22]

Originally Posted by d_phaneuf

I still can't fully get the sancho thing, greenwood looked incredible at the end of last season

If you have theoretically 100 million

How are you not focusing on other options in more necessary positions

well Greenwood is more of a striker, and I think that's where he'll play long-term. Plus he's only 18 and pretty much the only good option on the right wing, unless you want to play James or Lingard there (yikes). The feeling was that United had pretty much a free run at Sancho this summer, I doubt they will next year.

I'm not even that mad they chose not to do it ... it's a lot of money to put into one basket even without a pandemic, but given the times we live in, I understand that they chose not to pull the trigger. But then you have to take the money and spend it on a number of players in areas where the team needs it. It hasn't happened - they didn't sign a center back, they didn't sign a defensive midfielder, they didn't sign a right wing that can have an impact any time soon. Sooo ... that's bad. I like the Telles deal, I like van de Beek as a player, I like the punts regarding youth (the club also invested heavily in 16-year-olds this summer). But overall, that's a failing grade for sure.

Originally Posted by Bagor

I don't think pitchforks are out fire not signing Sancho. He did right by and I think most fans have no issues with him walking away from that price.

Is that he didn't pursue a plan B.

Everyone else just got business done. He just seemed to do a lot of tyre kicking.

yeah, agreed. It's just maddening that there's apparently no sensible structure and no planning going on. This club needs a complete revamp behind the scenes, but we both know that's not going to happen.

[agulati]

Excited about Partey joining the gunners!

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by Locke

Why would they? I have no idea why he thought that.

Dortmund paid what...£8M for him? And he has been great.

This is the thing about big clubs, the smaller clubs know they have deep pockets. So they either hold out for their price or they keep a great player. Other than the potential that the player will pout and play like crap they hold all the cards.

Sancho is young enough that he has to keep playing well to get a great offer.

It's also not like Dortmund are a poverty club, yes they are a selling club, but they aren't in dire straits financially or anything. They have an elite asset and they can compete for UCL with him there, selling him for a discount was always a pipe dream.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

It's also not like Dortmund are a poverty club, yes they are a selling club, but they aren't in dire straits financially or anything. They have an elite asset and they can compete for UCL with him there, selling him for a discount was always a pipe dream.

Dortmund are a club that have to be run like a Business. They're not Oil Sheikhs or Oligarchs or Americans with an unlimited line of credit.

For them Sancho is a fantastic piece of business.

The Glazers ought to know that. Whats the old saying?

"Buy Low, Sell High?"

But then again, United did come out and say that they were going to exploit their financial muscle against clubs that were hard hit by the COVID pandemic.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

I don't know, online sentiment was pretty universal that United botched Sancho because they had a free run at him this time and probably won't again. Woodward thought Dortmund would fold with his lowball offer and they never budged.

No it wasn't. They didn't want to match the valuation and walked away.

They bidded up to what they thought was a fair price and walked away.

If they really wanted him and thought him value at that price then they they would have met the price. Regardless of whether Dortmund folded or not.

So you think they should have paid the price?
You think by not paying that price and walking away they botched it?
And why will other teams be ready to take a run at him next time sounds when they didn't this time?

[Senator Clay Davis]

Just a blown opportunity for United, coming out of the window they certainly don't look a top four team. Just seems to be the cycle recently, hire a manager when out of UCL, back him, he makes UCL, you don't back him, he doesn't make UCL, then you sack him. Wash, rinse, repeat.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Locke

Dortmund are a club that have to be run like a Business. They're not Oil Sheikhs or Oligarchs or Americans with an unlimited line of credit.

For them Sancho is a fantastic piece of business.

The Glazers ought to know that. Whats the old saying?

"Buy Low, Sell High?"

But then again, United did come out and say that they were going to exploit their financial muscle against clubs that were hard hit by the COVID pandemic.

What makes you so sure in these uncertain markets/times that they will get a better offer for Sancho?

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by Bagor

No it wasn't. They didn't want to match the valuation and walked away.

They bidded up to what they thought was a fair price and walked away.

If they really wanted him and thought him value at that price then they they would have met the price. Regardless of whether Dortmund folded or not.

So you think they should have paid the price?
You think by not paying that price and walking away they botched it?
And why will other teams be ready to take a run at him next time sounds when they didn't this time?

Should they have paid it? Probably, because if there are more teams in for him next summer then the price this summer is probably the floor to get him. They wanted to try and strike a bargain and couldn't bully it through. And they botched it because they were the only ones in. As I just mentioned next summer more teams will probably be in with more post-COVID financial certainty. We'll see, but if you're in UEL next year your odds also plummet. Everything was there to get it done now. For a team that has spent poorly a lot recently, this seemed like the one time the player was worth the money.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Just a blown opportunity for United, coming out of the window they certainly don't look a top four team. Just seems to be the cycle recently, hire a manager when out of UCL, back him, he makes UCL, you don't back him, he doesn't make UCL, then you sack him. Wash, rinse, repeat.

Answer the questions regarding Sancho.
How did they botch it by not paying what Dortmund wanted?

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Bagor

What makes you so sure in these uncertain markets/times that they will get a better offer for Sancho?

If he's the player that everyone seems to think he is, then the valuation will just be more expensive next year if he has another good season.

Plus they weren't really competing with any of the other main EPL teams this year, maybe next year they have City, Chelsea, Liverpool, involved in bidding as well.

If they were willing to offer £91.3m, why not just step it up to the £100M threshold to close the deal. Dortmund aren't some small team you are going to push over, they are a CL team themselves and they can easily just keep Sancho if nobody meets the asking price.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

If he's the player that everyone seems to think he is, then the valuation will just be more expensive next year.

If they were willing to offer £91.3m, why not just step it up to the £100M threshold to close the deal.

Because they're hard negotiators that are doing whats best for the club!!

Again...Dortmund are holding all the cards. Woodward is sitting at the Poker Table with a hand of UNO cards unaware of the fact that....they literally say 'UNO' on the back and everyone can see them.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Should they have paid it? Probably, because if there are more teams in for him next summer then the price this summer is probably the floor to get him. They wanted to try and strike a bargain and couldn't bully it through. And they botched it because they were the only ones in. As I just mentioned next summer more teams will probably be in with more post-COVID financial certainty. We'll see, but if you're in UEL next year your odds also plummet. Everything was there to get it done now. For a team that has spent poorly a lot recently, this seemed like the one time the player was worth the money.

So. You think
1. He was worth the price Dortmund was asking
2. United were the only team that could have afforded him this summer.
3. As we head into COVID'S second wave and the uncertainty associated with it other teams that for whatever reason couldn't afford him this summer will suddenly be able to afford him next summer.
4. When you submit a lower offer than the asking price then walk away you are trying to bully a deal through.

In an alternative world United paid the asking price and bought Sancho and we are listening to your tripe about how they got played by Dortmund and bought a player no other club wanted to go near at that price.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

If he's the player that everyone seems to think he is, then the valuation will just be more expensive next year if he has another good season.

Then one should have expected a bidding at for him.....yes?

[d_phaneuf]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Partey is a great get for Arsenal, but if you were willing to pay the release clause anyway why not do it a month ago?

Get him for cheaper hopefully

Plus they were still trying to sign aouar, if they suddenly pay 45m for partey their price for aouar goes up

It was reported he was staying yesterday, so they get the money to la Liga today

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Locke

Again...Dortmund are holding all the cards. Woodward is sitting at the Poker Table with a hand of UNO cards unaware of the fact that....they literally say 'UNO' on the back and everyone can see them.

You are 100% certain that Dortmund will get a better price fur him next summer?

I'm sure that second part sounds funny in your own head?

[d_phaneuf]

Sanchos price will never be higher than it was today

His contract runs out in 3 years, meaning if they dont sell him next summer, the price on him drops massively

Sancho with 1 year left and it's a cut price deal, so if anything, the leverage moves a bit to united next summer hypothetically, before being completely gone the summer after, see for example Christian eriksen

At that price they are only competing with Madrid anyway, he wouldn't go to city and barca are broke, they had to sell players to even be allowed to bid on them this year

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by Bagor

So. You think
1. He was worth the price Dortmund was asking
2. United were the only team that could have afforded him this summer.
3. As we head into COVID'S second wave and the uncertainty associated with it other teams that for whatever reason couldn't afford him this summer will suddenly be able to afford him next summer.
4. When you submit a lower offer than the asking price then walk away you are trying to bully a deal through.

In an alternative world United paid the asking price and bought Sancho and we are listening to your tripe about how they got played by Dortmund and bought a player no other club wanted to go near at that price.

If United got him for the price right now I wouldn't be mocking them, because Sancho is a top end talent. I think this was United's only chance to get him. Right now United have the look of a 7th place team, not having the UCL money/football next year makes you much less likely to get him. You're right about there being no guarantees Dortmund can get as much, or that they'll be more teams next summer, but there's also no guarantee Sancho wants to go next summer if you're midtable. He was there and available, you didn't get him.

Next summer he could cost more or not be available. The fee wasn't astronomical, it wasn't a clear overpay like Maguire was. As evidence from not having an actual backup plan Woodward thought he could lowball Dortmund and they would eventually fold. He miscalculated and they missed out. It wasn't like you didn't want him, or hoped to get him. He was your #1 target all summer.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by d_phaneuf

Partey is a massive get for Arsenal

Originally Posted by agulati

Excited about Partey joining the gunners!

I guess we’ll see how it shakes down, but he’s not going to have the time and space in the PL. Regardless though, they’ve effectively swapped Gunnersaurus for Partey, and I’m not sure that’s a great deadline day!

And the wrangling about United and their window is amusing. I like VDB, but during the game yesterday they were saying he’s not super happy with the lack of playing time he’s seeing (already!), and that was before he came on for about 25 minutes when the game was out of reach. I have no idea what Woodward was doing though. Pretty clearly you need some defensive help, so you sell Smalling and bring in a 33 year old CF, obviously. That just seems like a terrible idea.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

If United got him for the price right now I wouldn't be mocking them, because Sancho is a top end talent. I think this was United's only chance to get him. Right now United have the look of a 7th place team, not having the UCL money/football next year makes you much less likely to get him. You're right about there being no guarantees Dortmund can get as much, or that they'll be more teams next summer, but there's also no guarantee Sancho wants to go next summer if you're midtable. He was there and available, you didn't get him.

Next summer he could cost more or not be available. The fee wasn't astronomical, it wasn't a clear overpay like Maguire was. As evidence from not having an actual backup plan Woodward thought he could lowball Dortmund and they would eventually fold. He miscalculated and they missed out. It wasn't like you didn't want him, or hoped to get him. He was your #1 target all summer.

Nope. We'd have been subjected to your usual drivel the first time he had a couple of bad games. Like how Fred is probably the worst contract in history or how Rashford is the next Welbeck.

Wtf? The fee wasn't astronomical? They were just looking for the third most expensive free in history after Neymar and Mbappe. Nope.....not astronomical at all.

You keep going on about how Woodward miscalculated.
Explain then why he walked away and didn't return with a late offer of asking price?

Sure he was their #1 target. They didn't get him because they chose not to pay the asking price.
For whatever reason there wasn't a rush of clubs ask lining up to hijack the deal at that price. Why is that?

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Slava

Pretty clearly you need some defensive help, so you sell Smalling and bring in a 33 year old CF, obviously. That just seems like a terrible idea.

Lol.