2019/2020 Trade Speculation and Rumors 2.0

[PepsiFree]

Gaudreau definitely reminds me of Kessel. Great players, a few general questions around what motivates them, can’t carry a team on their own but could be an absolutely crucial piece to a winning team if they are the secondary type guys.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Kessel is such a weird player.
Seems clear he is out of shape
He's worn out of his welcome in many places despite being productive.
He was a big part of their latest Stanley Cup but shortly thereafter they wanted nothing to do with him.

Just a very odd player. He probably will net out well over 1,000 points and is a champion.
But does he make the hall of fame? Probably not.

Kessel was basically the role that Gaudreau needed to have on this team if we were going to be a serious contender. Third forward with still serious offensive threat potential.

We're just missing those two other small pieces.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Gaudreau definitely reminds me of Kessel. Great players, a few general questions around what motivates them, can’t carry a team on their own but could be an absolutely crucial piece to a winning team if they are the secondary type guys.

we have agreed twice in two days...is the apocalypse upon us?

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Bonded

There was definitely some friction and weirdness.

https://www.bardown.com/phil-kessel-...rade-1.1330769

Fair enough but they just lost to a 12 seed because they couldn't score

[SportsJunky]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Yep, Kessel was a loser out of shape bum with no commitment...until he lead the Penguins in scoring on the way to the Stanley Cup.

Gaudreau didn't forget how to play hockey or get figured out in a few months....he is an elite playmaker but needs to play with top talent IMO.

Ah, the Sammy Benzo argument.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Just a very odd player. He probably will net out well over 1,000 points and is a champion.
But does he make the hall of fame? Probably not.

Ex-Leaf. Ex-Penguin. American born. 1,000 points. Multiple Stanley Cups. Yes, he goes to the HHOF.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by SportsJunky

Ah, the Sammy Benzo argument.

Nope.

The Bennett argument is simply "play him with NHL players", and hey look - it's right!

[SportsJunky]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Nope.

The Bennett argument is simply "play him with NHL players", and hey look - it's right!

Are we saying it's right now? The theory is proved out? Just checking. I want to be on the right side of history here.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by SportsJunky

Ah, the Sammy Benzo argument.

Except Gaudreau has already had 78, 84, and 99 point seasons

[Calgary4LIfe]

I don't buy the Monahan for Ristolainen rumour at all - not one bit. Flames had Giordano coming off as the #1 D in the league, and part of arguably the best (or one of the best anyway) complete pairings in the NHL. They have Hanifin who is young and still getting better.



Organizationally, they have NOBODY who can put up numbers like Monahan at C. Nobody. There isn't anybody on the team right now or coming up the pipeline. Flames already established a good history of having a defensive corps 'nearing the best in the NHL', and winning jack squat with it. They have never won a cup without defence AND a #1 centre. Came close in '04 I guess.


Plus, when did Ristolainen get the "do not acquire" stamp from Calgary? It was a while ago, no? Further evidence that the Flames weren't going to give up Monahan. The only way that this rumour had legs is if this was about a much bigger package.


I am still clinging onto hope that the Flames manage to retain Gaudreau and Monahan, sign Hall, and try and run 3 better lines. Of course it is going to be extremely difficult to make the cap work, but boy would that be a difficult team to defend against. Of course in this - my little dream - Calgary also hires Laviolette and he figures out a system for the players. I remember one poster (I forgot who - sorry, I am forgetful) that spoke to someone in the Flames org who felt confident that they could bring in Hall next season, and they were going to keep Gaudreau while they were at it. Of course that was before Covid, and maybe with the top line's production, that might not be the plan any longer anyway...


I just see a team that if you just continually focus on the top line, you will beat Calgary in the long run. It is awesome that Bennett's line has contributed, but they have dried up a bit of late, and the 2nd line with Tkachuk just isn't generating enough - though Backlund did get a goal last game (and looked fantastic in that one).


I don't want a top-heavy team. I don't know how to make the money work, but I want 2-3 lines that can consistently chip-in on offence - RELIABLY.



The more 'game-breakers' you have in your lineup, the more games you will break, so to speak. Teams usually can't afford to focus on 2 lines in a game as much - you only have so many really good defensive players in a lineup. Teams that have reliable scoring depth are difficult teams to contain.


A good coach can come in and figure out what combos to start with - lots of really good options, and he can mix and match to form 3 lines.



Gaudreau - Monahan
Tkachuk - Backlund
Dube - Bennett
Hall - Linholm?


You get what I mean. Focus on getting 3 solid pairings out of it, and switch the remaining players around until something clicks.


No idea what you do with D, however, in this situation. Don't think it can work any longer with the way the cap is stagnated.... but I am not in the camp that thinks Johnny just isn't a 'playoff' guy - I think it is combination of attention from the other teams, and the insistence of having that line generate off the cycle. That's what I see from my perspective, anyway, though I do also assign half the blame on Johnny (and the rest of the top line) as well for not being more productive - I just think with the system they are being asked to play just makes it harder for them to generate offence, that's all. I want to see them fighting through it more, and I am not happy with their decision making and production, but I do think that the system is at least partly responsible for their lack of production.


I don't think this core is a bunch of 'coach killers'. I just don't happen to see a single coach being brought in that maximizes this teams' potential in the least. I thought Hartley was good (especially given the roster he had to work with), but every other coach got less than the sum of the parts, at least in the playoffs. There has been a long line of coaches who haven't got another sniff at a head coaching role on another team.


I do, however, think that Gaudreau will be traded, and it will be interesting to see what happens with the return, what other moves are made, and what coach (if any - aside from removing the interim tag) is brought in.


Interesting times ahead.



I just hope that this team doesn't do an 'overreaction' of sorts like the 2010 Flames did when they let Cammalleri walk and brought in Brent Sutter. Team stopped being a reliably scoring team with too much focus on defence (and a god-awful predictable system that didn't fit the core either, but that's another story).


I believe Calgary is a good team overall, with really good talent, that have some holes in the roster and who are poorly coached and poorly led (not pointing a finger at Giordano - the biggest leader on a team is always the coach IMO).

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

It’s weirder to me how he was always a fast player. He didn’t have a lot of gas in the tank, obviously, but he could fly (one way). Makes you wonder what he could have been if he had top tier commitment.

What's weirder to me is that he is listed at 200 lbs. Thirty percent of that must be just his gargantuan head.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Nope.

The Bennett argument is simply "play him with NHL players", and hey look - it's right!

I'd cool your jets on this whole Sam Bennett thing. This self-congratulatory garbage is pretty premature. Yes, he's hot and his line is playing the best on the team, but this is a garbage performance that no one should be trying to brag about. An NO, and an emphatic NO, Sam Bennett is not playing at an elite level or scoring at an elite level. He's enjoying a good run, but it's NINE games. The previous 52 have not been completely washed away. Nor have the other seasons before that. Bennett is still a 25-30 point player until he proves otherwise, and a nine game stretch ain't proving anything.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by SportsJunky

Ah, the Sammy Benzo argument.

Who has ever described Bennett as an elite playmaker?

[SportsJunky]

Ooh! I know this one!

[IrishSpring2013]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Thirty percent of that must be just his gargantuan head.

[Inferno099]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Not a good year for offer sheets or being RFAs coming off their ELCs

After signing Kylington to a 1M contract The Flames have 15 M to sign 3 defensemen a starting goalie and Mangiapane plus 3 minimum wage forwards.

I just can't see them going with

Gio-Anderson
Hanifin-Valimaki
Kylington- 700k
700k - 700k

Should they feel the need to resign Brodie or replacement at 6M and Talbot at fire sale 3M. and Mangiapane for 2 M It leaves pretty much just enough cap space for the 3 minimum wage forwards and 2 min wage D-men.

Forbort and Gustafsson will not be minimum wage D-men.

More than half the teams in the league will be in the same tight cap situation.

Can't see a way that St.L fits in Pietroangelo in even at his current 6.5 unless they get Steen to retire,

There is no Cap in Tampa to sign Sergachev or Cernak. Last year they would have been in the big extension pile of 1st year RFAs

With respect to our captain I hope Tre is looking for a partner to trade Gio.
Team needs to keep moving and Gio is not a fit any longer.
I respect him a lot but I did hope the organization was going to sell high off the Norris....
If they cannot trade hopefully he waives for expansion draft so a protected spot is not required to be used.

I realize this will be unpopular but the Flames all to often with older better players of value do not make moves when better return could have occurred when obvious the team is not in the tier to adequately compete for the cup.

[Teroy]

If you get a chance to trade Gio to a team where he has a chance to win the cup, do it. Do not trade Monahan. He's trying to be a bonafide centre, hustling to be the first one back and working his butt off. No, he doesn't drive the play in the offensive zone because he's waiting in the slot for that magic pass from Johnny that never comes. The weak link is Gaudreau and it's time for everyone to realize that. Those who assume he'll return to his old scoring self if traded are dreaming in technicolor. Teams have figured out how to play him and that will not change.

[1qqaaz]

Originally Posted by Inferno099

With respect to our captain I hope Tre is looking for a partner to trade Gio.
Team needs to keep moving and Gio is not a fit any longer.
I respect him a lot but I did hope the organization was going to sell high off the Norris....
If they cannot trade hopefully he waives for expansion draft so a protected spot is not required to be used.

I realize this will be unpopular but the Flames all to often with older better players of value do not make moves when better return could have occurred when obvious the team is not in the tier to adequately compete for the cup.

I think Giordano has been just as disappointing as Gaudreau during these playoffs. IMO Monahan has been better than Gio.

The problem is, the Flames can't afford to lose so many defenseman in one year. It generally doen't make a lot of sense to trade any defensemen that aren't UFAs.

Hamonic is probably gone. Brodie will likely need a Backlund-like contract, which will probably result in him being overpaid for most of the contract term. Gustafsson isn't great defensively. Forbert is atrocious. Kylington hasn't been developed properly. Hanafin hasn't progressed much.

The Flames can't afford to trade away Gio, despite his lackluster playoff performance.

[AC]

Johnny will light it up on a new team, I'm convinced.

I don't think he'll figure it out in the playoffs for a new team either though. I think he's a superstar that can't produce in the playoffs. He'll still help you make the playoffs which is obviously very valuable. But ideally he drops down the lineup in the playoffs which probably helps him take advantage of some easier matchups. Unfortunately I don't think that happens here from what we've seen.

If we're trading Gaudreau then I think at least seeing what the market is for Monahan makes sense too. I don't think he'll ever produce to the same level without Gaudreau.

It's incredibly frustrating seeing our top players continually underperform in the playoffs, whereas Edmonton and Vancouver's top players all raise their games it looks like. Surely that's an easier fix for a GM.

[Gaskal]

Wasn't Ristolainen the player that Chris Snow told front office that they'd be "nuts" to take this guy?