2019/2020 Trade Speculation and Rumors 2.0

[SportsJunky]

Taylor Hall was a team worst -3 tonight with 1 SOG.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by cannon7

Matt Murray is a flash in the pan and that flash happened almost three years ago. The Pens know they have a sieve. Visit a Pens board sometime to see the pitchforks out for Murray.

Pitchforks are always out when you lose, especially from the fans.

[cannon7]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Pitchforks are always out when you lose, especially from the fans.

Take a look at that Canadiens forward depth. Paul Byron took Matt Murray to the woodshed.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by cannon7

Take a look at that Canadiens forward depth. Paul Byron took Matt Murray to the woodshed.

Actually, Carey Price took the whole Penguins team to the woodshed. He had like a .950 save % or something. Murray actually didn't play too bad at all. Much better than he did during the regular season.

[DB93]

What a disaster that Kadri trade is turning out to be for the Leafs. Literally got nothing from Barrie and Kerfoot. I think Kadri would have made a major difference in that difficult playin with the Jackets.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by DB93

What a disaster that Kadri trade is turning out to be for the Leafs. Literally got nothing from Barrie and Kerfoot. I think Kadri would have made a major difference in that difficult playin with the Jackets.

I think Kadri would have made a big difference to the flames if he had not vetoed the trade.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

I think Kadri would have made a big difference to the flames if he had not vetoed the trade.

He is exactly the type of center the Flames could use. I am still a little choked we didn't get him.

[Icon]

Murray is my guess of who the Pens hope Seattle takes ... /Yoda

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Icon

Murray is my guess of who the Pens hope Seattle takes ... /Yoda

Thats a whole season away though amd both he and Jarry are RFAs this off season and will be looking for raises.

My bet is they move one for sure, probably Murray.

[ricosuave]

Just thinking about all this talk of where the Flames have drafted, etc got me thinking - we certainly have had our fair share of opinions on GMs and their signings, but why are we not talking about the scouting, both amateur and pro scouting?

Nashville was more than happy to lose Neil to the Knights, and even though they made the finals, they were more than happy to let him go to UFA - looking back now it seems obvious. Why the hell would we sign him to such a ridiculous deal that the only way out of it was to deal with our most hated rivals for their ridiculous deal? Brouwer, Hamonic, there are others too - what did our pro scouting see in some of these guys, salary notwithstanding?

Granted, our amateur scouting has found some gems throughout the years, but boy, some of the picks previous to Tree coming aboard are downright insane. Does that all rest on the GM or the advisor (Burke) or does the amateur scouting guys really think that some of the guys listed here https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/...r00005090.html were really the best picks? Or maybe, in addition to cheaping out on coaches, the team cheaps out on the scouting staff as well - or at the very least maybe trusts them far more than they should, while their 'record' of development should be taking into account as well.

Point is, I'm all for trading Gaudreau, Giordano, whoever for picks, players, whatever - my biggest concern is that the team and whatever metric they follow while doing so, will end up screwing it up anyway.

Oh, and get a damn sports psychologist on board. And if you already have one, get two. Or get another. I don't know. But I do know that I'm tired of the Flames being among the most mentally fragile sports franchises when it comes to adversity and being down a goal. And get the entire team to go to the sessions. Coaches, everyone. Well, maybe not the equipment guys. They seem pretty solid. But everyone else!

[Mr.Coffee]

Signing Hall would be a mistake. GM / Team need to pause, put a comprehensive rebuild plan together and think through it not just go rush out and sign high profile free agents.

Rebuild is inevitable here but thoughtfully do it and not at the expense of future contract buyouts please. Take your time, do it right, take the pain of sucking a couple years.

[ricosuave]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Signing Hall would be a mistake. GM / Team need to pause, put a comprehensive rebuild plan together and think through it not just go rush out and sign high profile free agents.

There is interest in signing Hall because he would be somewhat of a free asset that may actually want to sign here. If he came with a bit of a hometown discount, someone to cheer for while rebuilding, cheering a local boy, and of course, the stick-it-to-the-oilers factor - these are all good reasons to do it. The only snags are 1- if he will still sign after we scorch the earth and move a bunch of deadwood, and 2- if he comes at a reasonable price tag so as not to interrupt the plan of which you speak.

[Doctorfever]

Originally Posted by ricosuave

There is interest in signing Hall because he would be somewhat of a free asset that may actually want to sign here. If he came with a bit of a hometown discount, someone to cheer for while rebuilding, cheering a local boy, and of course, the stick-it-to-the-oilers factor - these are all good reasons to do it. The only snags are 1- if he will still sign after we scorch the earth and move a bunch of deadwood, and 2- if he comes at a reasonable price tag so as not to interrupt the plan of which you speak.

Great point. I would like the team to sign him if, and only if, it is a team friendly deal. Sign him, trade some of our core pieces (a bit of a retooling) and shake things up a bit. Get a decent nhl player for each core piece you move and get a draft pick as well. Promote some of our mid level guys and rebuild on the fly.

I am not trading;
Chucky
Bennett
Dube
Mangi
Lindy
Anderson
Valli
Hanafin

But am open to any other trade.

Note that I am not a fan of Hall, but if the contract is good and it doesn’t work out, he should be easy to move.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Good teams are built through the !@#$ing draft. Full stop.

I don’t disagree at all. All the players people are discussing in these trades ARE Flames draft picks... Gaudreau himself a god damned steal in the 4th round. Monahan and Tkachuk also steals in their spots, although being high picks.

Again, I’m on board for trading both Monahan and Gaudreau. This is two years in a row with absolutely abysmal post season efforts. Totally inexcusable.

I just get annoyed by people thinking they can claim who the next MacKinnon is of the current teenagers available for the next few years. It’s ludicrous. And really, MacKinnon, while always good, didn’t start to become the top-end dominant force he is probably until the World Cup, maybe even as late as last years playoffs against the Flames. It can take time. 18 year olds and becoming elite top 5 centres is a rarity. Bennett for example is still young enough for it to become a thing.

Seriously think about yourselves and the growth you went through between 18 and 26-27. People become totally different human beings in that time.

[Mr.Coffee]

The return for Gaudreau is going to be horrendous, but it still may make sense due to the signal regarding a rebuild to the team and what it means and a strategic transition for the franchise. Hopefully you don’t get too fleeced and can get a couple key pieces, but the truth is new stars will emerge new hope will rise up and the team will get good again. The NHL has created a system where you’re never too far gone for too long, unless you’re Edmonton then it’s just hopeless.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

The return for Gaudreau is going to be horrendous, but it still may make sense due to the signal regarding a rebuild to the team and what it means and a strategic transition for the franchise. Hopefully you don’t get too fleeced and can get a couple key pieces, but the truth is new stars will emerge new hope will rise up and the team will get good again. The NHL has created a system where you’re never too far gone for too long, unless you’re Edmonton then it’s just hopeless.

Agreed. GM's around the league have to have a pretty clear picture that the 99 point season was likely his career outlier, not just a career high. I don't even know if they can be sold on getting PPG at this point, he's seemingly scared to play in the league and uninterested in taking training seriously. At least from an outside perspective. He definitely won't get first line winger value.

[TheScorpion]

Well now that I'm expecting Johnny to be traded for Nick Jensen and a 5th-round pick, I can't possibly be disappointed.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Ok, look. I am seeing some wild takes. Johnny was in 17-18 and then 18-19 16th and then 7th in league scoring. Full seasons. In a 31 team league.

Let that marinade.

So one of his past 3 years is an outlier? No, the skill is there. Something else is happening.

Johnny has elite skill, but a smart coach needs to recognize something pretty darn obvious. He is small and the playoffs are different.

Two ways to succeed - emphasize skill and use pace as a differentiator, or give him room to plays.

The Flames are playing a collapsing defence and Johnny is trying to anticipate the turnover and blow the zone. It’s a waste because he has no support

If you aren’t doing the first, then because he is so small, he can’t be successful in the playoffs without someone who is actively engaging defenders to create space.

For goodness sakes, and god forbid I use the gong show up north as an example, but look at the ice time they have given McJesus with Kassian. Just to create space and protect the player. Much as they had Semenko with Gretzky. They recognize a target, and elected to deploy a space maker.

Now imagine if you had a guy with the toughness like those meatheads, but also even a smidgeon of skill. Lucic and Bennett are both pretty aggressive players. Lucic is fantastic at protecting the puck along the boards.

When I saw the coaches stick with the top line that fell flat last playoffs, I suspected their ability to prepare for the upcoming playoffs. The minute I saw 6’5” Buddy Robinson dump the puck in to the corner for Johnny to retrieve, I knew it.

Good hell, some people on this site actually want to see Buddy Robinson dress.

It’s like the twilight zone. So many bizarre ideas, it is tough to know where to start.

I am too disappointed and frustrated with how Gaudreau is playing, but he is soft because he is tiny. He is skating in to 3 guys because he and his linemates don’t have a better plan, and are left to their own devices.

Marty St Louis was build like a brick #### house. His legs were not a result of squats, they were a result of genetics. We have all seen Guy Gaudreau. Good dad, but not passing along Marty’s bulk

I hope the Flames don’t trade Gaudreau because clearly they have devalued the asset. Tre hired Peters, and he had spectacular results early but really faded fast.

Ward really did a lot better, but hasn’t had much time. I like a lot of his messaging. and understand the reasoning behind some of his decisions, but wonder if he is a head coach (strategist) or assistant coach (gets the message and communicates it and also acts as PR among other things)

[Lanny_McDonald]

People don't understand how important a good coach is to players achieving success. This is pretty much the same team that Peters had in the running for the President's Trophy. What changed? They changed their style of play and tried to ratchet down their style and play more conservative. That is not how this team was built, and it was a stupid move. To make matters worse, when Peters washed out, they brought in a guy whose strategy is to completely collapse down and not let the horses run. If this team were coached by Alain Vigneault or John Torterlla, it would be a completely different story. A quality coach would take this very lineup and have THEM as one of the favorites. But this team doesn't do things the right way. We haven't had a coach that could use talented players worth a damn since Terry Crisp or Bob Johnson was behind the bench. The talent is on that bench. The problem is they don't have a staff who knows how to make it successful. They had the magic for 75 games a season ago, but made a stupid pivot and lost their way. Find that guy (Gallant?) that can help them use their talent the best way possible. That's the first move they need.

[Nelson]

Originally Posted by New Era

People don't understand how important a good coach is to players achieving success. This is pretty much the same team that Peters had in the running for the President's Trophy. What changed? They changed their style of play and tried to ratchet down their style and play more conservative. That is not how this team was built, and it was a stupid move. To make matters worse, when Peters washed out, they brought in a guy whose strategy is to completely collapse down and not let the horses run. If this team were coached by Alain Vigneault or John Torterlla, it would be a completely different story. A quality coach would take this very lineup and have THEM as one of the favorites. But this team doesn't do things the right way. We haven't had a coach that could use talented players worth a damn since Terry Crisp or Bob Johnson was behind the bench. The talent is on that bench. The problem is they don't have a staff who knows how to make it successful. They had the magic for 75 games a season ago, but made a stupid pivot and lost their way. Find that guy (Gallant?) that can help them use their talent the best way possible. That's the first move they need.

Let the horses run? Like against the Avs last year in the playoffs? The Flames don’t have the horses.