[PGT] Preds 3 Flames 2

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

If you were a coach right now would you want to go anywhere near this franchise?

Like, maybe the biggest reason gallant hasn't been hired is because he doesn't want the job?

I think a smart coach would see a lot of talent that just needs a push. This is the same guy who agreed to coach an expansion team.

Even you don’t think guys like Gaudreau, Monahan, etc are part of the solution, they can be moved for pieces that can help you build a new identity.

And outside of that I have no issue starting to build a harder working, hate to lose, fast paced, and gritty identity around:

Lindholm
Tkachuk
Dube
Bennett
Mangiapane
Ryan
Backlund (he’s struggled this year but he always gives 100% IMO)
Lucic (kinda stuck with him)

Gio
Hanifin (I give him one more year)
Valimaki
Andersson

Rittich

Then if you decide to move them you have the pieces you get from Monahan, Gaudreau, Brodie, Hamonic, & this years draft. And forwards like Pelletier, Phillips, Gawdin, Peterson, Zavgorodny who are all impressing at their current levels coming up the pipeline.

This doesn’t have to be a “burn it down” rebuild.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

Actually - yes. Emphatically so. (Provided the money is right etc.)

Wouldn't any coach give his eyeteeth to have JG and "turn him around" and be forever known as the guy who did that? You bet. They are just as competitive as the players, which is why they're in the NHL.

Don't bite. The guy looks for any reason to bash the team and organization. If this franchise can ever put together a stretch of good seasons that leads to a happy positive fanbase ol Flash will be gone like a fart in the wind.

[memphusk]

Originally Posted by AustinL_NHL

I find it funny how Flames fans think it's less on the coach than it is on their give a crap meter.

I find it pretty crazy and unlikely how a team built by a GM who covets character, determination and hardworkers over any other trait...

as well as a team that is at least 50% built with players who's scouting report talks about how they give it their all every shift (Mangiapane, Tkachuk, Lindholm, Gaudreau, Dube, Bennett, Backlund, Giordano, Hamonic, Andersson, Rittich)...

the same players that were known as the "cardio kids" and "comeback kids" for their refusal to not give up when trailing in the third period and led the NHL in third period comebacks...

have somehow suddenly lost all ability to show that they care.

Either the coaching is flat out putrid (which it is), we've somehow gotten the wrong mix of character to mess with the "gamer" in the players that care (possible) or the players just randomly decided to shut off their motor this season for no reason in particular (hmm... that's a hard sell)

Maybe they give it all they have. Good chance that maybe all they have isn't good enough. I would go with that.

[tvp2003]

The coach doesn’t know what he’s doing. The players don’t know what they’re doing. Apparently firing a coach in the middle of the season and replacing him with a lesser version of the same coach is not a good idea. Especially when your core is underperforming and the effort isn’t there.

[Manhattanboy]

That post earlier today about Backlund being the new Stajan is so good.

[dino7c]

This was a hard fought game and a decent effort...problem isn't this game IMO

Problem was Montreal, Ottawa, Edmonton, SJ

Lose all those games and you are putting yourself in must win games against decent opponents

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

That post earlier today about Backlund being the new Stajan is so good.

Except he makes 2 million more a year.

[Beninho]

Flames always wait too long to make a trade or get the right coach. Typical


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Except he makes 2 million more a year.

And doesn't have near the heart.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Jimdon

This might be the most apologist post I've seen so far to try to take the blame on the coach and excuse the players.

There were players deserving of blame in Hartley's final year here. Jonas Hiller was the worst goaltender in the NHL. Kris Russell and Dennis Wideman were also awful.

But the players on that team who were there then and are here now - Gaudreau, Bennett, Backlund, Monahan, Brodie, Giordano were all strong that year. Anyone who watched that season would remember that. Gaudreau is everyone's whipping boy this year and even he was a plus player that year. Brodie had his best season. Bennett had his best season. Backlund had a near 50 point season. That team was around top ten in scoring before they sold off at the deadline (I think they finished twelvth?).

To take Hartley and Peter's accomplishments of getting this team to perform at an elite level and dismiss them as being flawed without putting any responsibility on the team takes mental gymnastics that I'm just not capable of

Hartley got this team to perform at an elite level? What? Our entire strategy under Hartley was to back off and have every skater play goalie for the whole game until the other team got tired of shooting, and then hope to score on odd man rushes. I had a ton of fun in 2014-15 - but we weren't an elite team.

Peters lost four straight games in the playoffs to a wildcard team without any meaningful tactical adjustments. No, Monahan and Gaudreau and Backlund and Lindholm and Tkachuk didn't have very good playoffs. But despite all that the primary issue in the playoffs was how the second defense pair was getting absolutely pummelled to submission and nothing was done to shelter them.

Brodie was our best Dman in the playoffs and he only averaged 22:28. You know what Hartley had Brodie playing in the playoffs? 27:07. Maybe those nearly 4 and a half minutes of ice time could have been shifted towards our top defense pair instead of the second D pair who were atrocious.

Bennett was our best forward in the playoffs and he only averaged 13:14. You know what Hartley had Bennett playing the playoffs, which were games two to twelve of his entire NHL career? 14:01. Seriously, How the heck do you excuse a guy giving you 5 points in 5 games and not think to maybe give him a few extra shifts?

The Gaudreau - Monahan - Lindholm line was ineffective long before the playoffs. They stopped clicking around the all star break. Despite revisionist history, it wasn't Gaudreau that was the issue on that line down the stretch, it was the other two, particularily Lindholm who stopped shooting altogether. Peters didn't split them up until game 5 of the playoffs. The same Peters who when he first came in (and started winning) had no problems turning on the blender. He was a completely different coach down the stretch and that carried into this season big time.

Beyond that? After game 1 Bednar implemented a forechecking strategy that gave our team fits on the breakout. Peters had no answer. We're not the first team to ever come across a team-specific forecheck in the playoffs - but Peters literally had no counter. The playoffs are about playing chess and Peters was still playing Angry Birds five games in. How the #### was it a "historic season" as you put it when the playoffs were so underwhelming?

But sure, call it mental gymnastics.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

That post earlier today about Backlund being the new Stajan is so good.

it's a Calgary Puck Hall of Famer

[CGY12]

Originally Posted by dino7c

This was a hard fought game and a decent effort...problem isn't this game IMO

Problem was Montreal, Ottawa, Edmonton, SJ

Lose all those games and you are putting yourself in must win games against decent opponents

Sorry Dino, but "decent" doesn't cut it. Especially after the last 2 loses. The problem with this team is that it comes out with a "decent" effort when they should be playing desperate hockey. That 3rd period was a joke. How you can not manage to get 1 single shot, down 1, on home ice, after the last 2 putrid efforts, in a time of desperation, in the first 13 minutes of the period, tells me all I need to know about this team. Actually I knew these guys were soft and not good enough already and i've been saying it since last year, so I'm not surprised.

Team needs an overhaul from all levels, management, coaching, players. I'm sick of "decent".

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by CGY12

Sorry Dino, but "decent" doesn't cut it. Especially after the last 2 loses. The problem with this team is that it comes out with a "decent" effort when they should be playing desperate hockey. That 3rd period was a joke. How you can not manage to get 1 single shot, down 1, on home ice, after the last 2 putrid efforts, in a time of desperation, in the first 13 minutes of the period, tells me all I need to know about this team. Actually I knew these guys were soft and not good enough already and i've been saying it since last year, so I'm not surprised.

Team needs an overhaul from all levels, management, coaching, players. I'm sick of "decent".

did you even read my whole post? I basically said decent doesn't cut it because they lost all those other games they should have won (or won most of) They put themselves in a situation where every game is life and death

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I think a smart coach would see a lot of talent that just needs a push. This is the same guy who agreed to coach an expansion team.

Even you don’t think guys like Gaudreau, Monahan, etc are part of the solution, they can be moved for pieces that can help you build a new identity.

And outside of that I have no issue starting to build a harder working, hate to lose, fast paced, and gritty identity around:

Lindholm
Tkachuk
Dube
Bennett
Mangiapane
Ryan
Backlund (he’s struggled this year but he always gives 100% IMO)
Lucic (kinda stuck with him)

Gio
Hanifin (I give him one more year)
Valimaki
Andersson

Rittich

Then if you decide to move them you have the pieces you get from Monahan, Gaudreau, Brodie, Hamonic, & this years draft. And forwards like Pelletier, Phillips, Gawdin, Peterson, Zavgorodny who are all impressing at their current levels coming up the pipeline.

This doesn’t have to be a “burn it down” rebuild.

Or you could get paid for 5 months and wait for any of the 5-10-15 coaching vacancies and call your own shot.

[ComixZone]

Ward references the team identity and that they’re not playing to it right now and how last year they were scoring team and that didn’t work in the playoffs.

...does anyone have a damn clue as to what identity Ward thinks this team has this season?

If they decided to not being a scoring team and to be something else this year, that would certainly explain the complete cliff this team’s offensive talent has driven off of and why you have offensively gifted players like Gaudreau looking completely lost. I don’t know how many times we’ve dumped the puck into Johnny’s corner this year (a bajillion?), but if that’s the plan I get why these players have quit on the organization. Just paceless, dry, safe hockey. I’m reminded of Conroy’s story of his first shift with Jarome where Connie dumped it in - and after the shift Iggy yelled at Connie that on the first line, you don’t dump it in on the rush. What the hell is this team actually trying to accomplish?

[Mightyfire89]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

If you were a coach right now would you want to go anywhere near this franchise?

Like, maybe the biggest reason gallant hasn't been hired is because he doesn't want the job?

"I'm a hot commodity in the NHL right now. I'm still being paid through 2021 by my former team, there is an expansion organization on the horizon run by professionals and I just had tremendous success with a different expansion franchise.

I know what I'll do! I'll go to an organization with a poorly assembled team full of coach killers that don't look like a solid bet to make the playoffs or do anything once they are there. The GM looks like he could be gone in less than a year and there are serious rumours that the team might be looking to trade away their best player.

Yes, THAT is the team I want to go to. Sign me up to coach THAT team."

Legit possibility. Which is sad.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Ward references the team identity and that they’re not playing to it right now and how last year they were scoring team and that didn’t work in the playoffs.

THis reeks of when Brent Sutter tried to turn the Keanan Flames into a dump and chase team while they were one of the top teams in the league. They missed the playoffs that year and never made them again under Brent.

[djsFlames]

It's ####ed up that they were shopping Brodie for a RW, not Hamonic.

What dimension is Brad (Tre)living in?

[CGY12]

Originally Posted by dino7c

did you even read my whole post? I basically said decent doesn't cut it because they lost all those other games they should have won (or won most of) They put themselves in a situation where every game is life and death

I did read the entire post which started with "This was a hard fought game and a decent effort...problem isn't this game IMO".

Teams ramp up this time of year and whether they've lost the last 2 or 3 or won them, they compete, they play desperate, they show up on home ice, win or lose the effort and give a s*** meter is there. Do you honestly think what you witnessed tonight displays that from the Flames? Decent doesn't cut it and its been going on far to long with this franchise. Watch Wards post game, spot on with his comments. You want to win this time of year you need to get dirty, get to the tough areas to score goals and prevent them. The Flames didn't do that last year during the stretch run and they aren't doing it this year, when teams are ramping up the intensity.

Easy team to defend and easy team to attack. Not going anywhere with that type of team.

[DazzlinDino]

The biggest reason the Flames have a problem this season is because there is no merit system. Too many players are allowed to mail it in, night after night. They are the ones that are dictating wins and losses. A real coach would bench Johnny and remind him there is no "I" in TEAM. A proper coach would have reminded Lucic the first game again,st Edmonton that his effort was poor, soft and unacceptable. Instead we've got in an inexperienced coach that doesn't know how to drive the team. Without a good merit system and higher expectations this team continues to drive the bus.