[News] UPD: Friedman: Peters being officially removed as head coach is close

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by corral

now see if you can reply without using the word ‘stupid’ which in no circles is as derogatory as what peters is alleged to have said

fyp

[AustinL_NHL]

CHUCKY!!!!

The only player who rarely disappoints <3

[bluejays]

What I love about this whole thing is that people who are #######s are being exposed. In the Peters kicking case, when Brind-Amour confirmed it the onus is now on what happened after to discipline Peters? Or was it a slap on the wrist from ownership and/or Francis because winning is everything? Again, the ends can't always justify the means in society, so it's really good when this occurs in sports. Bringing these things to light should happen more in the workplace.

[Corral]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Lol. Really? Stupid is derogatory now? And AS derogatory as the N bomb? Now THAT IS stupid. How about dumb, slow, nitwitted, dimwitted? We going to mark all those down as bad as an N bomb?

How about we just ban the English language? We will all just talk like teletubbies and the world will be safe.

Try going to a school for kids with learning disabilities and call everyone stupid. Tell me how that goes for you.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Corral

Try going to a school for kids with learning disabilities and call everyone stupid. Tell me how that goes for you.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Corral

Try going to a school for kids with learning disabilities and call everyone stupid. Tell me how that goes for you.

Say what? Yeah that's not the word they dont like. Anywho, as someone with family who has special needs, I can assure you stupid is not a word you have to tread lightly with. And if you're going to a special needs school to call people.stupid, well you're just not a good human in the first place.

Pick your battles better hombre.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Corral

Try going to a school for kids with learning disabilities and call everyone stupid. Tell me how that goes for you.

Is there a school for kids who post bad takes? What happens when you say “that’s a bad take” there?

[sureLoss]

Ron Francis has some answering to do.

Geoff Baker
@GeoffBakerTIMES
BREAKING: Former Carolina Hurricanes owner Karmanos says he’d have fired coach Bill Peters “in a nanosecond” had GM Ron Francis told him of player abuse allegations. Francis, now with NHL Seattle, has yet to comment.

https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/...e-allegations/

“I’m pretty upset,” said Karmanos, 76, who sold the team two years ago and claims he learned of the incidents this week through news reports. “And I have my calls in to Ronnie as well. I think he’s the one who’s going to have to tell people what he did when he found out that the coach had done these things.’’

Francis, who was named NHL Seattle GM in July, has yet to speak about what happened. NHL Seattle on Wednesday declined all comment on the matter.

“Look, I’m probably as upset as anybody could be,” Karmanos added. “I take pride in our organizations. I’ve always taken pride in playing the game the right way and all of that stuff. So I’m fed up.’’

Karmanos said he first heard of Jordan’s allegations when reports surfaced Tuesday.

“I never could figure out why the kid wouldn’t take the contract we had offered him,” Karmanos said of Jordan, who left to play in the Kontinental Hockey League. “He was an excellent seventh defenseman as far as I was concerned. And now I can understand why.’’

[Elkyiv]

This honestly could be a Netflix documentary

[BoLevi]

I haven't followed the whole thread....

But aren't the incidents of physical abuse worse than the incidents of racism?

Actual assault is certainly worse than verbal assault.

[Jetfire]

Originally Posted by BoLevi

I haven't followed the whole thread....

But aren't the incidents of physical abuse worse than the incidents of racism?

Actual assault is certainly worse than verbal assault.

They're both remarkably terrible and Peters needs to face the music for both, starting with his removal as our coach over the next day or so here. I think saying that one is worse than the other sells the other issue short, when both caused a ton of hurt to each respective party.

One side that hasn't been talked about quite as much that I wonder about is the mental abuse side of things, thinking back on how he shat on Eddie Lack and such. I wonder what he could have done to someone like Scott Darling who has had mental health issues and substance problems, with his steep career decline coinciding with his arrival in Carolina. It's possible Peters didn't do anything in that particular scenario, but with all this other garbage he's now confirmed to have done, it certainly makes me wonder and worry.

[JohnnyB]

Sometimes after an initial allegation that sounds bad, the news that follows and adds context really dulls the edge of initial claims. With this one, I feel like every bit of additional news coming out makes it look and feel worse.

[Barnet Flame]

nm

[Barnet Flame]

I got it wrong in the post above. Sorry. For some reason I can’t edit it.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by BoLevi

I haven't followed the whole thread....

But aren't the incidents of physical abuse worse than the incidents of racism?

Actual assault is certainly worse than verbal assault.

Depends on the degree of each one I guess, although I'm not sure why you need to rank them.

[SportsJunky]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Well, from the past few pages I know I can turn to CP if I ever need a bunch of lawyers.

It really is true. There are a lot of lawyers that post here. On occasion I’ve been known to mutter, “that guy’s a lawyer?!”

[cubistcastle]

Originally Posted by New Era

Yeah, so much for this not being tagged with the Flames. "Flames" in almost every headline, and the flaming C being in almost every picture of every story that's come out in the last 24 hours. The Flames are doing the right thing, but this is still going to be associated with the Flames, just like the Dennis Wideman incident will always be associated with the team.

We're still pretending anyone outside this forum cares about the wideman thing huh?

[Corral]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Say what? Yeah that's not the word they dont like. Anywho, as someone with family who has special needs, I can assure you stupid is not a word you have to tread lightly with. And if you're going to a special needs school to call people.stupid, well you're just not a good human in the first place.

Pick your battles better hombre.

Fair enough. I overstated this to make a point that plenty of language is derogatory in certain contexts. Calling my post stupid? I like to think CP is better than that.

[Sutter4Mayor]

Originally Posted by BoLevi

I haven't followed the whole thread....

But aren't the incidents of physical abuse worse than the incidents of racism?

Actual assault is certainly worse than verbal assault.

I'll answer this because I think it is a decent, honest question - and I'm always asked about this in the field of mental health.

I think there is a layer of subjectivity here with respect to how the victim interprets the experience (racism).

I've lost count of the number of people who have sat across from me in my office and discussed how they would rather have experienced a physical attack as opposed to being referred to in a discriminating/degrading term. For them, it's worse than the actual assault because of their own historical relationship with the term - or their family/cultural/ethnic/religious historical relationship with the term.

The thing with a physical attack is that you can grade it in terms of severity (e.g., that really hurt, that kinda hurt, that didn't bother me at all). In addition bruises, cuts, breaks and scrapes can heal - so there is a linear path to recovery (An interesting point here, however, is that the emotional/cognitive connection to the physical attack can remain).

In contrast, there "can" be a non-linear path to recovery from a racially degrading remark, if any recovery at all.

IMO (and it is my opinion from decades of working in the field) the saying "sticks and stones can break my bones but names will never hurt me" really #####ed a lot of people up. What ended up happening was that a large percentage of people actually experienced hurt from name-calling, etc., which contradicted societal norms. As a result, these individuals further experienced feelings of abnormality, being lesser than, or weak because the sh*t actually hurt them. It mind-#####ed them. Many of them continue to carry the emotional scars to this day.

The good news is that as a society we are starting to appreciate the impact of those norms, and are shifting away from those stiff-upper-lip-themed viewpoints. An honest mistake from an older time of what was viewed as "the right thing." But there's a fallout from it. That generation has some of the highest rates of violence, addiction, depression, and self-harm (again, I see it on a daily basis). Sure, you can argue that correlation doesn't equal causation - and there can exist internal/external threats to the validity of my statement - but you can't prove it to be false.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Ron Francis has some answering to do.

Geoff Baker
@GeoffBakerTIMES
BREAKING: Former Carolina Hurricanes owner Karmanos says he’d have fired coach Bill Peters “in a nanosecond” had GM Ron Francis told him of player abuse allegations. Francis, now with NHL Seattle, has yet to comment.

https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/...e-allegations/

I'm still rather focused on this part of the story, which I fear is getting overlooked:

On Wednesday, current Carolina coach Rod Brind’Amour, a longtime Hurricanes assistant who replaced Peters, told reporters the alleged abuse “for sure happened, the two issues that are in question.”

He added: “The way the players handled it and the support staff handled it (was to) bring it to management right away. Management handled it correctly, and (we) never heard of it again. Never saw anything else after that. It was definitely dealt with in my opinion correctly. That’s not something we talk about. … We’ve definitely moved past that.”

But Brind’Amour, a friend and former teammate of Francis, did not specify what corrective action, if any, was taken.

I get that Brind'Amour wants to move on from the incident—that the team wanted to move on at the time—but isn't this just illustrative of the larger problem here? I think it is fair to consider Bill Peters an abuser with everything that has come out, including all the stuff from Carolina. But doesn't the decision made to handle this internally not also help to promote the perpetuation of abuse, and enable the abuser?

Some people have made a big deal about how much Treliving should have known about Bill Peters abusive behaviour. However, given the fact that Rod Brind'Amour is STILL of the opinion that burying the issue is an acceptable response to dealing with abuse, how confident can anyone be that this stuff would ever be disclosed after the fact?