Nov 20. Friedman's 31 Thoughts: Flames not interested in selling low on Gaudreau

[topfiverecords]

Gaudreau's value isn't low. He's not the type of player that his value has a wild low/high swing. Everyone knows who he is and what he can bring and a trade now is not bringing back less because he's having a minor rough patch. He's not a player that might be past their prime and a risky acquisition.

Wait too long, until he's into the last year of his deal with a NTC and it'll be selling lower than now.

[Zarley]

Jankowski hasn’t been great, but I don’t think he’s been near as bad as many of you are suggesting. I’m not sure how moving him now, when his value is at an all time low, helps us in any way.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by Zarley

Jankowski hasn’t been great, but I don’t think he’s been near as bad as many of you are suggesting. I’m not sure how moving him now, when his value is at an all time low, helps us in any way.

Because he wouldn't be on the ice.

[heep223]

Originally Posted by Zarley

Jankowski hasn’t been great, but I don’t think he’s been near as bad as many of you are suggesting. I’m not sure how moving him now, when his value is at an all time low, helps us in any way.

Dude he’s just bad. Not just this season either. He had a string of short handed goals that will be the highlight of his career.

[ignite]

nm

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by heep223

Dude he’s just bad. Not just this season either. He had a string of short handed goals that will be the highlight of his career.

He did score 17 and then 14 goals in a bottom six role...he was certainly showing progress before this season

[Karl]

Originally Posted by Zarley

Jankowski hasn’t been great, but I don’t think he’s been near as bad as many of you are suggesting. I’m not sure how moving him now, when his value is at an all time low, helps us in any way.

I think he has.

He's been consistently the worst player on the ice in most games the Flames have played this year.

He really has been that awful with very few exceptions this year. There's no getting around that.

[bubbsy]

Jankowski has all the tools to be a decent nhler.

He has zero frigin motor. He will start skating to where he needs to (loose puck, forecheck, etc) but starts to glide for the last 15% of the journey. He's never on time to make an impact on the play.

Is that teachable or innate to his playing style? I have no idea, but if it doesn't change, he should not be on the roster.

[Doctorfever]

It’s amazing how you see things as a “fan” sometimes. When the Flames were winning, I would have been saying no way we should be trading Hamonic, and, to a lesser extent, Janko.
I saw Hammer as a longer term player on this team. A serviceable mid to bottom pairing dman who plays with a bit of sandpaper. Something that is needed on every team.
For some reason, the entire team has not looked the same, and the entire defence core hasn’t been near as good as last year.
A shake up is definitely needed. We all know Brodie has been on the block before, but if he isn’t bringing the best returns, you have to look at other players.
If a trade doesn’t happen, I am sure looking forward to Val coming back to help shake things up on the back end.

[bubbsy]

To be frank, I blame this GM for entire fall of this year's team result.

A team struggled since the all star break, got their ass kicked in the playoffs. I don't care that you tried but failed due to things like player NtC's, etc.

Flames were a top team at the deadline, the GM does nothing but add a #6/7 dman at the deadline.

Team gets whooped in a laughable manner, and the GM trades Neal for Lucic, and adds Talbot.

What message does that share with the roster??? It's all good enough? We don't actually intend to win anything meaningful, let's just hope for regular season success??

Treliving is kind of an idiot. It's clear he's got zero people management skills whatsoever. I get that he tried to make moves, but there's gotta be plan B's to allow for change for the sake of making change to a group that got their ass kicked.

Management basically telling the team "we're going with you, you'll do it" despite the players realizing the team ain't close to getting it done come crunch time, is equivalent to saying "meh, it's good enough, just get to the playoffs again". Not to mention having your intended trades leaked, so when they don't go thru, you are stuck with players knowing they aren't even wanted here.

The more I write it out, the more I realize that Brad Treliving is a dumb gm. Good riddance, you f'ing suck man. Go make pizza's or something, this isn't a gig for you.

[ComixZone]

A pretty harsh take Bubbsy, but not entirely unfounded. He himself would say he needs to be better, but as they say “talk is cheap” and Tree has been on a cold streak for 16 months. What happens between now and the trade deadline is important, because this team isn’t good enough and adding pieces around the perimeter at the expense of the future seems like a really stupid thing to do in my eyes.

I hope he friggin’ nails the next 8 months as it’s an important time for this team. It will define if the “rebuild” stalls in mediocretown or ascends into that next tier that we haven’t been in since 1990 or so.

As for this season, I do agree - as much as this falls on the players, it also falls on the GM. I think Bill Peters is one of the few who don’t share that top level of blame for the current situation.

[GullFoss]

Unfortunately, this increasingly feels like a retool year for the flames. Not a "burn it down" type of year, but one where you maybe take a step back to take a couple steps forward.

Even if the flames are a 6-10 seed within the conference at the deadline, it would be really poor asset management to try and make a playoff run with Brodie, hamonic and Frolik.

With Brodie and Hamonic likely to be replaced by Valimaki and Kylington, it's pretty clear that the freed up cap space can be recycled into a high end player. And if Brodie, Hamonic and frolik are traded for futures, those the picks themselves can be also used to acquire a high end player.

[1qqaaz]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

To be frank, I blame this GM for entire fall of this year's team result.

A team struggled since the all star break, got their ass kicked in the playoffs. I don't care that you tried but failed due to things like player NtC's, etc.

Flames were a top team at the deadline, the GM does nothing but add a #6/7 dman at the deadline.

Team gets whooped in a laughable manner, and the GM trades Neal for Lucic, and adds Talbot.

What message does that share with the roster??? It's all good enough? We don't actually intend to win anything meaningful, let's just hope for regular season success??

Treliving is kind of an idiot. It's clear he's got zero people management skills whatsoever. I get that he tried to make moves, but there's gotta be plan B's to allow for change for the sake of making change to a group that got their ass kicked.

Management basically telling the team "we're going with you, you'll do it" despite the players realizing the team ain't close to getting it done come crunch time, is equivalent to saying "meh, it's good enough, just get to the playoffs again". Not to mention having your intended trades leaked, so when they don't go thru, you are stuck with players knowing they aren't even wanted here.

The more I write it out, the more I realize that Brad Treliving is a dumb gm. Good riddance, you f'ing suck man. Go make pizza's or something, this isn't a gig for you.

I don't think any disagrees that a lot of blame goes to Treliving.

Can the Flames make the playoffs? Yes.
But if they miss, Treliving is probably gone, rightfully so.

I hope the Flames don't make a big move at the moment, because I don't trust Treliving's ability to get good value. At least not at this point in time.

Drafting and development have been fine. But I'm skeptical that Treliving should get the credit, since there was already a lot of improvement in that regard under Feaster. Button has been with the team for a long while.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by 1qqaaz

I don't think any disagrees that a lot of blame goes to Treliving.

Can the Flames make the playoffs? Yes.
But if they miss, Treliving is probably gone, rightfully so.

I hope the Flames don't make a big move at the moment, because I don't trust Treliving's ability to get good value. At least not at this point in time.

Drafting and development have been fine. But I'm skeptical that Treliving should get the credit, since there was already a lot of improvement in that regard under Feaster. Button has been with the team for a long while.

I don’t think Tree will be gone if they miss. It will be on him to make sure it doesn’t happen again and to improve the roster in a notable manner.

[Brick]

I am hoping for a new GM, the sooner the better.

They need to get it right with the next guy.

[RM14]

Jankowski was drafted as a high skill offensive talent. The Flames are trying to teach him to play mainly PK and manage situations in the bottom 6. That's is not an easy transition.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

To be frank, I blame this GM for entire fall of this year's team result.

A team struggled since the all star break, got their ass kicked in the playoffs. I don't care that you tried but failed due to things like player NtC's, etc.

Flames were a top team at the deadline, the GM does nothing but add a #6/7 dman at the deadline.

Team gets whooped in a laughable manner, and the GM trades Neal for Lucic, and adds Talbot.

What message does that share with the roster??? It's all good enough? We don't actually intend to win anything meaningful, let's just hope for regular season success??

Treliving is kind of an idiot. It's clear he's got zero people management skills whatsoever. I get that he tried to make moves, but there's gotta be plan B's to allow for change for the sake of making change to a group that got their ass kicked.

Management basically telling the team "we're going with you, you'll do it" despite the players realizing the team ain't close to getting it done come crunch time, is equivalent to saying "meh, it's good enough, just get to the playoffs again". Not to mention having your intended trades leaked, so when they don't go thru, you are stuck with players knowing they aren't even wanted here.

The more I write it out, the more I realize that Brad Treliving is a dumb gm. Good riddance, you f'ing suck man. Go make pizza's or something, this isn't a gig for you.

Seems like a well thought out and balanced perspective you bring, and it's great to read that you agree with yourself. How do you find the time to write such eloquent prose when you must be so busy with your job at the garbage dump?

[united]

No surprise on the Kylington front as he's wanted a move since last season as I posted a few months ago. Probably would have been moved this summer until Valimaki happened, and I wouldn't be surprised to see him included in a deal over the next year or so.
https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showpo...&postcount=330

Completely agree with Friedman's take on Gaudreau. He's been simply awful this season and the worst performer on the team relative to expectations, and it's largely the result of playing almost exclusively on the perimeter and shying away from contact or potential contact. I kind of hope he has an undisclosed UBI that is causing this because it is getting into alarming territory rather than just a poor run of form.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

I don’t think Tree will be gone if they miss. It will be on him to make sure it doesn’t happen again and to improve the roster in a notable manner.

Most GMs get one coaching hire, not 2

Not only that, he fired the Jack Adams winner for Gully

Just saying

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

Gaudreau's value isn't low. He's not the type of player that his value has a wild low/high swing. Everyone knows who he is and what he can bring and a trade now is not bringing back less because he's having a minor rough patch. He's not a player that might be past their prime and a risky acquisition.

Wait too long, until he's into the last year of his deal with a NTC and it'll be selling lower than now.

Exactly.

I didn't know his value was "low" right now.

Gaudreau will in all likelihood be a top 10 producer in multiple seasons yet to come. Cheap, dynamic, durable, superstar. Nothing about a not great quarter of a season alters the value that those things carry.

His value ACTUALLY takes a hit if the Flames decide to deal him in his final contract season. Between now and next season his value is highest.

Between this and the Edmonton penalties comments, I feel like in actuality Friedman is not the brightest bulb.