[PGT] Dallas something Flames not enough

[Flash Walken]

It's going to be a lot easier for Treliving to fire Peters than it is for him to pull off a roster changing trade.

If Peters is the bad cop and one of the assistants is the good cop, we might see good cop promoted by christmas.

[kukkudo]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

It's going to be a lot easier for Treliving to fire Peters than it is for him to pull off a roster changing trade.

If Peters is the bad cop and one of the assistants is the good cop, we might see good cop promoted by christmas.

They are not firing Peters mid-season to have one of the assistants take over. If the core has really tuned out the coach, Tre will make a move soon.

[UKflames]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

It's going to be a lot easier for Treliving to fire Peters than it is for him to pull off a roster changing trade.

If Peters is the bad cop and one of the assistants is the good cop, we might see good cop promoted by christmas.

Then what we will get will be that new coach bounce of 4-5 games and then fall back into the current poor play and out of the playoffs.
This is a player problem in my opinion, and personally, I think a lot of it stems from chucky holding out for the pay day he got compared to the other top players on the team (nothing to back that up just an opinion).

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by UKflames

Then what we will get will be that new coach bounce of 4-5 games and then fall back into the current poor play and out of the playoffs.
This is a player problem in my opinion, and personally, I think a lot of it stems from chucky holding out for the pay day he got compared to the other top players on the team (nothing to back that up just an opinion).

The organizational philosophy for the last 25 years has been 'just make the playoffs, anything can happen' and I expect that to continue moving forward.

The coach bounce is probably enough to get the team into the playoffs and that's all they need to justify the decision imo.

Firing the coach is what I would do. Trading a player would be after that.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

It's going to be a lot easier for Treliving to fire Peters than it is for him to pull off a roster changing trade.

If Peters is the bad cop and one of the assistants is the good cop, we might see good cop promoted by christmas.

What’s easiest is irrelevant. Treliving isn’t making franchise changing decisions based on laziness. You draw some really weird conclusions sometimes.

I think the smart money is on Peters lasting the year if not more. Franchise changing trade likely happens next offseason.

[BrennyBaller]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Don't be afraid to be that guy, this is good info and I appreciate it.

Just speculation on my part that if Freidman is saying something, its usually because an agent has told him something. This is more the case in trade scenarios but I thought it might apply here. I shouldn't have sounded so definitive.

I more meant I don't know if what Friedman was saying is accurate, just used yours as the quote as it related.

[mrdonkey]

I'm not expecting any kind of change during the season. The Flames will do exactly what they did when the Iginla core wasn't working: trade expiring fringe players for low-round picks, tinker around the edges, miss the playoffs or squeak in as a wildcard and get bounced, draft 13th-21st overall, sell low on a major player in the offseason, and drag this process out as long as possible.

[SuperMatt18]

Really the coach decision would come down to what Tkachuk and Gio are saying behind closed doors to Treliving.

If those two think that the coach is truly the issue then maybe you could see the coach fired, but if those two are still buying what the coach is selling then I think the coach stays.

[cross16]

Friedman mentioned this on HNIC after the Arizona game but it was more of him wondering it out loud then actually speculating. Burke almost right after said he felt it was too soon so probably enough for Friedman to run with it.

So now we are speculating that this core tuned out Hartley after 1 good year, Gulutzan after 1 good year and now Peters after 1 good year. Seems to me the finger isn't pointing in the right place here.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Immediately after both Boomer and Sarich said they didn't think that Peters was being too hard on the guys.

Really there has been no indication in the local media or at practices that Peters is being too tough on the guys or grinding them too hard.

Tough to see if that is really what is happening behind the scenes at this point.

Obviously Friedman is getting information that Boomer and Sarich may not be privy to. Sounds like some in the locker room may not be happy. They aren't in the locker room and I don't understand how either would have first hand knowledge as neither is what I would consider an insider. I don't think it's time to start talking about firing the coach because I feel Treliving will move players before that happens. That said Peters may need to try and change up his approach.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Obviously Friedman is getting information that Boomer and Sarich may not be privy to. Sounds like some in the locker room may not be happy. They aren't in the locker room and I don't understand how either would have first hand knowledge as neither is what I would consider an insider.

The leakiest organizations are the ones with the most disgruntled employees.

[Roof-Daddy]

Good lord.

Is it not possible for this organization to hire a coach that can coach at the NHL level, but can also "keep the room" for more than one or two ####ing years?

Unbelievable.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Good lord.

Is it not possible for this organization to hire a coach that can coach at the NHL level, but can also "keep the room" for more than one or two ####ing years?

Unbelievable.

Lots of tough coaches have tenure around the league.

Those tough coaches have the firm support of management and ownership.

Players understand that reality.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Good lord.

Is it not possible for this organization to hire a coach that can coach at the NHL level, but can also "keep the room" for more than one or two ####ing years?

Unbelievable.

It sounded like Hartley was going overboard and Gulutzan just isn't a great head coach but if players are tuning out coaches every 2nd year I would consider it a player problem as well.

[AltaGuy]

I think it's all on the players, personally. Would be very disappointed to see Peters go.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by cross16

So now we are speculating that this core tuned out Hartley after 1 good year, Gulutzan after 1 good year and now Peters after 1 good year. Seems to me the finger isn't pointing in the right place here.

I'm not convinced that this core ever tuned out Hartley, and maybe not even Gulutzan as terrible as he was. What I remember happening with Hartley was:

1) Hiller had an awful year in net letting every point shot through, culminating in a Rasmus Ristolainen hat trick of point shots.
2) Giordano had a rough start returning from a major injury
3) Hamilton had a rough start as he adjusted to vastly different systems
4) Brodie had a career year marred only by missing the beginning of the season to injury. Gaudreau, Bennett, Colborne, Backlund, and even Monahan all had solid seasons.
5) The clock expectedly struck 12 on Russell, Jooris, Granlund, and Bouma. To a lesser extent, Hudler and Wideman came down to Earth.
6) Wideman caused the team to go from the least penalized team in the first half to miraculously being the most penalized team in the second half
7) Treliving decided to place Byron on waivers without having a valid replacement for his speed, tenacity, and two way play in the bottom six. He didn't replace that element until signing Ryan and Czarnik last season.

Hartley's stretch pass heavy systems caused Treliving to fire him, but otherwise that team played for each other and for Hartley.

In Gulutzan's case, the team finished the season outshooting opponents vastly, often hitting the 35 to 40 shot mark and having nothing to show for it. Gulutzan had them playing his systems to perfection and the dissonance between the process and results was actually remarkable. The issue was that whatever Gulutzan was trying clearly wasn't working. Blame luck, blame Gulutzan's rigid line construction, blame a lack of pace inherent to his breakout schemes, but you can't blame the core for not executing his plan.

If the core has indeed tuned out Peters (which for the first time actually looks possible due to their lethargic and sloppy play and poor underlying numbers, and may be related to how badly he got outcoached last April) it would not be indicative of a pattern with the core.

[Flamenspiel]

What really stands out is the early game against the Kings. I would say that was possibly the worst 1st period of hockey I had seen in 14 years of being an STH.

That being said, coach or not, this team just does not have the horses to compete for the Stanley Cup, regardless of how much effort they show.

[Strange Brew]

Except for Lucic/Neal and Smith/Talbot, this is the same team that came out of last years's training camp. That's not much turnover for a professional hockey team and I can't believe we have yet to see a meaningful roster move. I'm convinced we see some kind of move before he moves to coach #4 under his tenure.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Flamenspiel

What really stands out is the early game against the Kings. I would say that was possibly the worst 1st period of hockey I had seen in 14 years of being an STH.

That being said, coach or not, this team just does not have the horses to compete for the Stanley Cup, regardless of how much effort they show.

I can think of 4 periods like that. 2 against Colorado that were the most lopsided periods I can recall seeing in the NHL.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Except for Lucic/Neal and Smith/Talbot, this is the same team that came out of last years's training camp. That's not much turnover for a professional hockey team and I can't believe we have yet to see a meaningful roster move. I'm convinced we see some kind of move before he moves to coach #4 under his tenure.

I think teams have adjusted to the Flames including their top players, and those top players have yet to adjust against that.
The book is out on how to defend Johnny and crew.