Canadians 'drowning in debt': 47% will borrow to cover costs, survey says

[PsYcNeT]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Cool. How much do you think that one very specific event changed the total number of homes being built in Calgary?

The developer stated it added 700 residences to the neighbourhood.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by PsYcNeT

The developer stated it added 700 residences to the neighbourhood.

My point was (and apologies for being sarcastic) that it was a microcosmic situation. But all it should mean is that the required development will happen elsewhere instead of Harvest Hills.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

My point was (and apologies for being sarcastic) that it was a microcosmic situation. But all it should mean is that the required development will happen elsewhere instead of Harvest Hills.

This is the problem.

[The Yen Man]

People were more upset about losing the golf course than it being a new development. Sure it's Nimbyism, but it wasn't to restrict high density housing.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

People were more upset about losing the golf course than it being a new development. Sure it's Nimbyism, but it wasn't to restrict high density housing.

And to be fair, when I lived in Evergreen I was upset at losing Shawnee Slopes for the same reaaon

[blankall]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Should be able to get by is a very subjective definition.
Let's say a person is 27, single and makes $60,000. What would not being able to get by mean? Not able to rent? Not able to buy a house? Not having any savings?

Call me nuts but someone like a fireman who has a wife with an income should comfortable be able to buy a detached home, support a family of 4-6, save for retirement, and afford a vacation here and there. 30 years ago the fireman wouldn't have needed the dual income to comfortably afford that. A second income was added, and many still can't afford that, and that's if you manage to get that fireman job, which now takes years of high effort to get.

This is a mess.

[PsYcNeT]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

People were more upset about losing the golf course than it being a new development. Sure it's Nimbyism, but it wasn't to restrict high density housing.

You mean the 9-hole golf course that had been losing money for the better part of a decade and had a 1.8 star rated clubhouse?

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by blankall

Call me nuts but someone like a fireman who has a wife with an income should comfortable be able to buy a detached home, support a family of 4-6, save for retirement, and afford a vacation here and there. 30 years ago the fireman wouldn't have needed the dual income to comfortably afford that. A second income was added, and many still can't afford that, and that's if you manage to get that fireman job, which now takes years of high effort to get.

This is a mess.

Perhaps the idea of “being comfortable” has changed. And requires more money.

[The Yen Man]

Originally Posted by PsYcNeT

You mean the 9-hole golf course that had been losing money for the better part of a decade and had a 1.8 star rated clubhouse?

Um, yes? Those people were upset they were no longer backing onto green area. Sure the golf course was small, but its still a nicer view than ondos and townhouses.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I don't think 5% on average is too high if you want to maintain a nice home. You'll need a roof every 25 years ($15k?), you'll need new windows every 40 years ($30-50k?), you'll need interior paint every 15-20 years ($12k?), fence every 25 years ($4k?), deck/trees/exterior landscaping care ($300-$800/year minimum), exterior paint for the structure(s) every 10-15 years ($5k), appliances: hot water tank every 15 years ($1k), dishwasher every 12 years ($500), stove/fridge/washer/dryer replace every 20 years ($5k bare minimum for econo machines).

The above just barely keeps your house at the standard it is at today. Everyone I know likes to improve things over time, too, with the odd reno or update. Change some fixtures, buy a storm door, plant some annuals, etc. Have you been to a house that hasn't been renovated in 50 years? It looks like crap every single time. Nothing lasts forever. If you've only put $55k into your house you have either let things go, haven't tracked your spend well, or have been incredibly lucky with your timing.

Your numbers all sound about right to me, and I think I $5k per year is about right. 5% of value would be $25k per year, which is way high. Any year you don't replace the windows you'll be under that.

I'm well under $5k per year, but I'll catch up and be closer to $5k per year overall at the end of my next 10 years, as I'll need new windows and furnace in that time, and will probably do new carpets in the carpeted areas and full interior/exterior paint. Using the numbers you estimated (which seem about right to me) that would put me at 67k in the next 10 years. I'll do a bunch of that work myself for less, but wouldn't if I was 70.

And the 10 years after that will be cheaper maintenance.

I definitely think 5% is too high. Even if you assume $5-7k on contractor type items, you could add another $500/month for snow removal/lawn care and still be only at 2% of house value per year.

[Johnny199r]

Originally Posted by blankall

Call me nuts but someone like a fireman who has a wife with an income should comfortable be able to buy a detached home, support a family of 4-6, save for retirement, and afford a vacation here and there. 30 years ago the fireman wouldn't have needed the dual income to comfortably afford that. A second income was added, and many still can't afford that, and that's if you manage to get that fireman job, which now takes years of high effort to get.

This is a mess.

Can't a fireman do that now? Let's assume a wage of $90,000 for a firefighter (and assuming he has no 2nd, part time job like lots of firefighters I know) let's assume his wife makes $60,000. That's $150,000. He's got a great pension, so there's retirement set.

I don't know anyone that has 4 kids anymore, but let's assume 2-3 kids. If they buy a $400,000 house in the outer suburbs. 2 used vehicles. Assuming vacations are reasonable (camping in the mountains rather than $10,000 family vacations every year) and no ridiculous competitive hockey fees for the kids, they should be able to have a nice life - keep in mind families 30-40 years ago weren't taking their kids to Mexico and paying 5-10k a year for kids hockey.

The days of one breadwinner have been over for a long time. Does it make sense today that a dad who works as a store clerk, or bus driver should be able to support of a family of 5 like the old days? Should women not be in the workforce anymore, or have their fields super low paid again? There's a reason construction labourers are still paid much high than early childhood educators, because men historically needed to support a family.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Johnny199r

Can't a fireman do that now? Let's assume a wage of $90,000 for a firefighter (and assuming he has no 2nd, part time job like lots of firefighters I know) let's assume his wife makes $60,000. That's $150,000. He's got a great pension, so there's retirement set.

I don't know anyone that has 4 kids anymore, but let's assume 2-3 kids. If they buy a $400,000 house in the outer suburbs. 2 used vehicles. Assuming vacations are reasonable (camping in the mountains rather than $10,000 family vacations every year) and no ridiculous competitive hockey fees for the kids, they should be able to have a nice life - keep in mind families 30-40 years ago weren't taking their kids to Mexico and paying 5-10k a year for kids hockey.

The days of one breadwinner have been over for a long time. Does it make sense today that a dad who works as a store clerk, or bus driver should be able to support of a family of 5 like the old days? Should women not be in the workforce anymore, or have their fields super low paid again? There's a reason construction labourers are still paid much high than early childhood educators, because men historically needed to support a family.

Your scenario paints a well above average income, and the options are limited to a house in an outlying and undesirable neighborhood. What about families that actually earn average incomes... Or even slightly less. Basically everyone's been knocked down several pegs.

Edit:
It's also extremely difficult to find a fireman income that pays a steady salary of $90k. You'd probably have to be a sub on call for a decade to find that.

[redforever]

Quote:
Originally Posted by redforever View Post
If you are talking about seniors still living in their home, which will probably be older, and they can't do the work themselves, $5000 does not go that far when you have to factor in the labor as well. Many might not be doing their own yard work, particularly winter time, they certainly won't be going up on their roofs to check out things, they won't be up ladders painting, at least they should not be.

And the goal is to keep seniors in their home as long as possible as it does not cost the health system as much.

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Ah I see what you mean. I wasn’t considering paying for lawn care or snow shoveling and such as part of that. So yeah could be right.

I will tell you my exact circumstance. My husband died at a very young age and I am widowed for some time. I am 70. I tried to stay in my Priddis property which we bought and developed on our own and it was home for 35 years...raised our children there.

But as a widowed woman, trying to keep up a quarter section in the country has too many challenges. So talking with my children to find a solution, this is what we came up with.

I moved into Calgary, basically inner city (Killarney) and I now live in a semi-detached house. My children have so many attachments and memories of the Priddis property and it was decided that my son would move there.

I have a fairly new place and although it does not need huge renos every year at the moment, there are standard things that need attending to...that I can't do..and that I don't bother asking my children to help all the time as they too have busy lives.

I have an underground sprinkler system and that needs to be activated in the spring and deactivated in the fall. I am not capable of doing that.

I have my eaves cleaned once a year, I am not capable of doing that nor will I entertain the thought of going up on a ladder to do so.

I have my windows cleaned twice a year. My property is a two story and there is no way in hell I am going up on a ladder to attend to that job.

I had problems with condensation in my attic this past spring. I am not capable of attending to that.

Just this week, the seal of my toilet had to be replaced. Again, I am not capable of doing that.

I need my furnace cleaned at least once every two years.

These are just small things, small yearly things that need to be attended to so small problems don't become big problems.

And demographics and statistics show that females live longer than males so as time goes on, there will be more females in my situation.

At the moment, I have no health problems...not on any drugs for high blood pressure, cholesterol, nothing...but one does not know what time will bring. I hope to stay in my present home as long as possible adding a lift upstairs if needed or hiring some part time help if needed.

I am used to this area now, I have made friends here, I have attachments here now, I know the services I can access from where I live. Uprooting seniors to areas late in life, where they have no friends close by and have to learn new shopping habits and the like is not in their best interests.

[GGG]

Let’s go with Median Family income in Calgary which is 100k for a discussion of average.

https://regionaldashboard.alberta.ca...m=2013&to=2017. Let’s assume a 30% tax rate because I am to lazy to do the math.

So 70k after tax which is 5800 per month. The median detached house in Calgary is 450k so a 25yr mortgage, 5% down which is about 2k per month. Daycare might crush them as an expense. More ridiculous is that a bank would lend them about 600-650k

So the Median Family in Calgary can afford the median detached home.

[GirlySports]

Can we get into how daycare and especially after school care is a scam?

[jammies]

My father was a cop in the 80s and there is no way we could have afforded a home with only one salary. My mother had a decent full-time job, we owned in Marlborough, it wasn't like they were living high, and yet money was tight.

Many of you are confusing the 50s and 60s with the 80s and 90s. Two average incomes have been necessary to be comfortably in the middle class and own a decent home for decades and decades.

[Jason14h]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Can we get into how daycare and especially after school care is a scam?

So start a daycare ? If enough do the prices will come down

They should turn all the empty offices downtown into giant day homes !

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Can we get into how daycare and especially after school care is a scam?

How so? If you aren’t willing to pay it, you can pick up your kids from school and take them to the office or drop them off at home. Or make more friends in the neighbourhood with the stay-at-home parents where the kids can go for a couple of hours.

Daycare is a money sink though, I agree with that, but there are some options.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Wormius

How so? If you aren’t willing to pay it, you can pick up your kids from school and take them to the office or drop them off at home. Or make more friends in the neighbourhood with the stay-at-home parents where the kids can go for a couple of hours.

Daycare is a money sink though, I agree with that, but there are some options.

Those stay at home parents charge as well nowadays.

Did our parents ever pick us up from school? We'd hang out or just go home. And school gets out earlier now. $700/month for an 11 year old not to go home is a money sink.

[Johnny199r]

Originally Posted by blankall

Your scenario paints a well above average income, and the options are limited to a house in an outlying and undesirable neighborhood. What about families that actually earn average incomes... Or even slightly less. Basically everyone's been knocked down several pegs.

Edit:
It's also extremely difficult to find a fireman income that pays a steady salary of $90k. You'd probably have to be a sub on call for a decade to find that.

City of Calgary I looked up looks like it's 90k after a few years.