Canadians 'drowning in debt': 47% will borrow to cover costs, survey says

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Is your home boring??? Need more Xbox’s TVs computers. Dishes to be cleaned. Things to fix. Carpets to vacuum. Oh those are just the things that distract me when I try and work from home haha

No, I just do those things on my breaks or if I have some down time.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by icecube

Are you an 8 figure multimillionaire? If not, you'll be fine.

If you are? I'm sure you'll also be just fine and so will your offspring.

So no real reason why except someone shouldn’t have the amount of money they have?

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by rubecube

No, I just do those things on my breaks or if I have some down time.

You are a better man than me.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Weitz

So real no reason why except someone shouldn’t have the amount of money they have?

Well the reason is, as others have pointed out, massive wealth hoarding and inequality is tremendously destabilizing for a society.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Well the reason is, as others have pointed out, massive wealth hoarding and inequality is tremendously destabilizing for a society.

I understand that belief but its still not a reason to tax after tax money. If someone isn’t paying their fair share death isn’t the time to tackle it IMO. You shouldn’t be penalized for being smart with your money after taxes.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Weitz

You are a better man than me.

I don't know about that. Most of my work has hard deadlines, so I either get it done on time or I probably get reprimanded.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Weitz

I understand that belief but its still not a reason to tax after tax money.

Pragmatism vs. principle. Choosing the latter on something like this has consequences.

If you wanted a principled argument though, you could make the case that an inheritance tax on extreme wealth ensures that your kin don't represent a tax burden if they can afford and choose not to work.

[Enoch Root]

Some crazy ideas on estate taxes here.

First of all, estates DO pay tax. They experience a deemed disposition, whereby all assets are taxed to current market value.

Second, if you attempt to double-tax estates, people will simply gift out their assets prior to death, or put them in trusts, or whatever. If you attempt to tax these (for instance, they tax gifting in the US), people simply find more create ways to get around it. What you end up with is a very cumbersome and convoluted tax system that costs substantially more to administer, but accomplishes nothing more.

If you try to raise the game higher, wealth leaves the country altogether, and you end up worse off.

But I will take it back to the beginning of the conversation and ask one simple question: how on earth is passing on your (remaining, and after-tax) life savings to your children a bad thing?

Answer: it isn't

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

But I will take it back to the beginning of the conversation and ask one simple question: how on earth is passing on your (remaining, and after-tax) life savings to your children a bad thing?

Answer: it isn't

If it continues to concentrate wealth into a smaller and smaller group of people, it absolutely. There's enough evidence both historical and current that demonstrates this.

[V]

All of my money is going to charity if I make it to old age. If I die at 80 and my kids need the money when they’re in their 50s and 60s it means I’ve utterly failed them.

I would just rather the charities I support get the money than the government. The government sucks at spending money.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

If we believe that adult children will need to inherit large sums from their parents in order to be financially secure, aren't we conceding that we no longer live a broadly prosperous meritocracy? That it's no longer the case that a child raised in an average household who works reasonably hard will have a good life?

We're already seeing a hardening class system develop in this country. Do we really want to wind up like the States, with their crime, distrust, failing institutions, and vicious political culture?

We're going to need to consider policies like inheritance taxes if we want to avoid that fate. If we want strong public education and public health care to endure in a country with an ageing population, the money has to come from somewhere. Maybe inheritance taxes are a fair trade-off if they mean the affluent don't need to live in gated communities, send their kids to private schools, and pay for private health care.

Your initial premise is invalid - no one is saying that. Inheritance isn't needed in order for a 'household who works hard (to) have a good life'. Inheritance is simple possession, and at our death, we each have the right to do with our possessions what we choose. Most of us give our assets to our kids (post 2nd spouse), but many give to charities, church, or whatever they choose. Some start foundations, or create trusts for the benefit of others.
But the important thing in all that is that it is their choice to do as they please.

The day we take personal choice out of the equation is the day that our society failed itself.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by V

All of my money is going to charity if I make it to old age. If I die at 80 and my kids need the money when they’re in their 50s and 60s it means I’ve utterly failed them.

I would just rather the charities I support get the money than the government. The government sucks at spending money.

I would hope that any sort of estate tax would a) be only applicable to extreme wealth, and b) be calculated/applied after charitable deductions.

[Table 5]

I know which charity I'm donating to.

[V]

Yeah that sounds good to me.

I really don’t understand the people that want to leave vast fortunes for their kids. People that didn’t earn the money suck at spending money. How many third generation companies fail because the kids didn’t understand how hard it was to build that wealth in the first place?

The last thing I want is my kids to suck off the family teat instead of making their own fortune. That flies in the face of capitalism.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

The day we take personal choice out of the equation is the day that our society failed itself.

Ok, we'll make the choices:

1. Give it to the government
2. Give it to charity

There. Personal choice baby.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by rubecube

If it continues to concentrate wealth into a smaller and smaller group of people, it absolutely. There's enough evidence both historical and current that demonstrates this.

Actually, a very significant portion of estates are blown, either by the children or the grandchildren. It seems that children of successful parents aren't as good with money as their parents were.

The only case where that isn't true is for the uber wealthy (billionaires). And taxing their estates is pretty much impossible, because they are completely mobile and fluid with their assets.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by V

The last thing I want is my kids to suck off the family teat instead of making their own fortune. That flies in the face of capitalism.

I think that's what chaps my ass about a lot of people. Hard work and bootstraps for everyone else, but not their precious little angels.

[Fuzz]

Imaine where the world would be if Donal Trump had to start from zero...ah, dreams.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Actually, a very significant portion of estates are blown, either by the children or the grandchildren.

How much is a very significant portion?

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Ok, we'll make the choices:

1. Give it to the government
2. Give it to charity

There. Personal choice baby.

Championing other peoples' money. Social justice warriors for the win.

(also, a good chunk of it already goes to charity via taxes)

Edit: sorry, to government, not to charity