A Game of Thrones **BOOKS OFF LIMITS** v2

[Finger Cookin]

I don't agree with the harsh ratings, but an online community of hardcore ASOIAF fans where I've rated each episode of the series has not looked fondly on these final three episodes.

S08E04 - The Last of the Starks - 6.13/10 (ranked 73rd out of 73 series episodes)
S08E05 - The Bells - 6.56/10 (71/73)
S08E06 - The Iron Throne - 6.88/10 (70/73)

So this finale just didn't land for a lot of fans. To get an episode voted this poorly on the site, you have to go back to S05E06 - Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken, when we got to see Dorne for the first time. It scored a 6.21/10, placing second last amongst all of the episodes in the series.

What was the highest rated episode, you might be wondering? It was the season finale of season 6, which is the episode you can see the producers really decided to floor it to get to the series ending when Cersei blew up all of her rivals in the High Sept in King's Landing. So...I don't know what to make of that.

Also unsurprisingly, last night's episode had the largest audience of any episode in the series entire run. Good or ill, people wanted to see it.

[Finger Cookin]

Also, I know no one ever gets the last word in these discussions. But I'd be fine if this was the last word in this one.

Originally Posted by George R R Martin

How will it all end? I hear people asking. The same ending as the show? Different?

Well… yes. And no. And yes. And no. And yes. And no. And yes.

...

Book or show, which will be the “real” ending? It’s a silly question. How many children did Scarlett O’Hara have?

How about this? I’ll write it. You read it. Then everyone can make up their own mind, and argue about it on the internet.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

S6 finale being highly rated is no surprise. I think that is the finest episode of the entire series. It made up for some of the weaker content that season and even back to S5. Thought the show had hit its groove again and we were in for a final two seasons on par with the first four. I was not correct.

[Ashasx]

I really enjoyed season 6 after being really down on season 5. If I remember correctly, season 6 is kind of where the writers ran out of book material to draw upon.

I think I could have accepted this ending a bit more simply with more screen time.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

Also, I know no one ever gets the last word in these discussions. But I'd be fine if this was the last word in this one.

I don’t get it. Are some of the extremely unhappy people saying the show ending doesn’t count or something?

It was never gonna be exactly the same as the books. Even if the books never get finished you can’t just shoehorn the show ending in there instead. They’ve diverged way too much and the books ended several seasons ago. That ship has sailed.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

I don't agree with the harsh ratings, but an online community of hardcore ASOIAF fans where I've rated each episode of the series has not looked fondly on these final three episodes.

S08E04 - The Last of the Starks - 6.13/10 (ranked 73rd out of 73 series episodes)
S08E05 - The Bells - 6.56/10 (71/73)
S08E06 - The Iron Throne - 6.88/10 (70/73)

So this finale just didn't land for a lot of fans. To get an episode voted this poorly on the site, you have to go back to S05E06 - Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken, when we got to see Dorne for the first time. It scored a 6.21/10, placing second last amongst all of the episodes in the series.

What was the highest rated episode, you might be wondering? It was the season finale of season 6, which is the episode you can see the producers really decided to floor it to get to the series ending when Cersei blew up all of her rivals in the High Sept in King's Landing. So...I don't know what to make of that.

Also unsurprisingly, last night's episode had the largest audience of any episode in the series entire run. Good or ill, people wanted to see it.

Wait, so how was "The Bells" not as thrilling in nearly the same way as the finale of season 6? Both aimed at shock and awe from a similar angle and brought that in spades.

So strange that one is 1st and the other 71st...

Was it the musical piece during the blowing up of the Sept? Both had simillar build up sequences where everything was slowed down before the carnage of the events unfolded. "The Bells" had Cleganebowl, the most anticipated duel in the series.

I think a portion of fans were so ticked at episode three that they allowed that bitterness to carry over, leading to an under-appreciation of what the separate events of episodes 5-6 brought, which I honestly think was on par with the bigger episodes of earlier seasons in many ways.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Wait, so how was "The Bells" not as thrilling in nearly the same way as the finale of season 6? Both aimed at shock and awe from a similar angle and brought that in spades.

So strange that one is 1st and the other 71st...

Was it the musical piece during the blowing up of the Sept? Both had simillar build up sequences where everything was slowed down before the carnage of the events unfolded. "The Bells" had Cleganebowl, the most anticipated duel in the series.

I think a portion of fans were so ticked at episode three that they allowed that bitterness to carry over, leading to an under-appreciation of what the separate events of episodes 5-6 brought, which I honestly think was on par with the bigger episodes of earlier seasons in many ways.

Maybe don’t worry so much why people feel differently.

[Finger Cookin]

I mean, who knows for sure Cecil. I can't speak for what George meant by the comment. To me, it reads people will argue about this ending. And argue about his ending. And just argue.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Wait, so how was "The Bells" not as thrilling in nearly the same way as the finale of season 6? Both aimed at shock and awe from a similar angle and brought that in spades.

So strange that one is 1st and the other 71st...

Was it the musical piece during the blowing up of the Sept? Both had simillar build up sequences where everything was slowed down before the carnage of the events unfolded. "The Bells" had Cleganebowl, the most anticipated duel in the series.

I think a portion of fans were so ticked at episode three that they allowed that bitterness to carry over, leading to an under-appreciation of what the separate events of episodes 5-6 brought, which I honestly think was on par with the bigger episodes of earlier seasons in many ways.

It’s the build up and consequence.

Cersei blew up the sept to eliminate her rival who she thought would ursurp her. It was in her character to do so. And as a result Tomen jumped out of the Window killing the last of her children. (I think the daughter had died by now).

With Dany she got to the right place but the snap at the bells just didn’t seem to be warranted and could have been handled much better. It’s actually a good comparison of what changed in the show in terms of the set up to the shocking moment.

[Fire]

Not Seinfeld season finale bad but it was pretty lame for the most part. I had to laugh when they sent Jon Snow to the Night Watch for the second time. I didn't hate the season as much as some but it could have been so much better if they didn't rush it unnecessarily. Hopefully the books can give fans a great ending.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by GGG

It’s the build up and consequence.

Cersei blew up the sept to eliminate her rival who she thought would ursurp her. It was in her character to do so. And as a result Tomen jumped out of the Window killing the last of her children. (I think the daughter had died by now).

With Dany she got to the right place but the snap at the bells just didn’t seem to be warranted and could have been handled much better. It’s actually a good comparison of what changed in the show in terms of the set up to the shocking moment.

Watching episode 6 in season 7 when Tyrion and Daeny's were talking about going to meet Cersei, and Tyrion was trying to talk to her about leadership, you see so many seeds of what was to come with her. Tyrion tried to discourage her with the whole rule by fear concept like the Mad King and she blew right by that argument.


Daeny's was so convinced of her vision of breaking the wheel and building a new world that she wanted and her prophesy that its no surprise that her desire to do all those things wasn't tempered by patience or compassion. She had very little to no concept of mercy that was highlighted throughout the season and in the death of Sam's father and brother.



While Kings Landing might have bent the knee to her, She wasn't satisfied by that at all because it wasn't Cersei who bent the knee or surrendered.


The people in her way had little to no meaning to her.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by Fire

Not Seinfeld season finale bad but it was pretty lame for the most part. I had to laugh when they sent Jon Snow to the Night Watch for the second time. I didn't hate the season as much as some but it could have been so much better if they didn't rush it unnecessarily. Hopefully the books can give fans a great ending.

It was funny. Except he kind of just passed through Castle Black and went north with the Wildlings to help resettle their lands which is a pretty nice sendoff, since he had a special bond with them going back to his Ygritte days.

It was basically the one way to get him out of imprisonment that would appease Greyworm and the Westeros lords that were Dany supporters like Yara, without getting executed or rotting away in a cell.

I wish he would've played the "I'm the rightful heir tho" card, just once.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

So Jon would ultimately kill Dany.

You’re saying he would have acted differently if he didn’t know his true lineage? How did you come to that conclusion?

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by GGG

It’s the build up and consequence.

Cersei blew up the sept to eliminate her rival who she thought would ursurp her. It was in her character to do so. And as a result Tomen jumped out of the Window killing the last of her children. (I think the daughter had died by now).

With Dany she got to the right place but the snap at the bells just didn’t seem to be warranted and could have been handled much better. It’s actually a good comparison of what changed in the show in terms of the set up to the shocking moment.

The more personal justices carried out by Cersei to the faith militant, Tyrells and Shamebell certainly was impactful and brought the awe. Maybe as you're saying, it was cause it was a back up against the wall move rooted in desperation by Cersei, whereas Dany had a choice and punished many that would be considered uninvolved in any way.

Although there were certainly consequences for Dany, as shown in the first 10 minutes following her glorious blaze of victory.

Again, thought both set ups were very similar in terms of suspense, intensity and brutality. Cleverness points to the season 6 finale for the "master plan" setup though. For The Bells, it all depends I guess on whether you thought that Dany's actions were a massive heel turn or sufficiently built up, and that's fair.

[manwiches]

https://twitter.com/BrettSVergara/st...782657026?s=19

Lol

Sent from my SM-G950W using Tapatalk

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

...

Again, thought both set ups were very similar in terms of suspense, intensity and brutality. Cleverness points to the season 6 finale for the "master plan" setup though. For The Bells, it all depends I guess on whether you thought that Dany's actions were a massive heel turn or sufficiently built up, and that's fair.

I feel your first sentence and last sentence contrast one another in those who feel disappointed about how Dany's moment was, and the season overall all. Your last sentence acknowledge why I feel many are having the reaction they are.

The build up plays a crucial role in the major events in previous seasons which is why they were looked upon more favorably. I didn't find the build up to be prevalent here, and came off more hollow than it should've.

What happen isn't the fault. It's just that it wasn't cooked long enough for it to be edible for the unsatisfied. The lack of episodes to let things develop to the boiling point hindered the impact.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Locke

The person who wants power is the last person who should have it. The person who doesnt is the one who should.

Much like modern Monarchy, they're transitioning to a figure-head.

But I think we're going down a rabbit-hole here now.

My interpretation of that is more about people's motivation. The best ruler is one who does not covet power. The difference in Dany and Jon, one wanted power and one didn't. I don't see it about having a ruler who won't exercice power and be only symbolic. If so, that wasn't a theme explored in the show to my knowledge.

I enjoyed the episode but the "election" of Bran and Tyrion's speech ahead of it was cringy. Perhaps if Bran had been more of a complex character at this point it would have worked better.

[OldDutch]

Goes without saying GRRM is 70 and has 2 books to finish to get to this point. One that is still in progress for almost 10 years. Plus he is on record that the major plot points he shared with the producers.

This is the ending. Yes the books if they are ever written may take more detours to get there, and build a better case for it, but we all witnessed the ending more or less.

I loved this show. It never was perfect. I was happy and disappointed with it at all times. To look back at it in its “prime”, and I probably was on here complaining.

It did trail off, but that was excellent by all counts. Honestly I am not sure it could have ended with people happy. Danny becoming queen is trope, same with Jon. Night King winning would leave people unsatisfied.

Loved that show. My son was born when we first watched it and he is eight now. I invested to watch it and loved it. Last I’ll speak on it, is that I am so happy that show existed for the price of a few months of HBO each year.

[Looch City]

There was literally no one better than Bronn as Master of Coin? Like absolutely no single person better qualified than a damned sell sword with a big mouth?

Bran's rule ain't going to last long haha

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

You’re saying he would have acted differently if he didn’t know his true lineage? How did you come to that conclusion?

Yes, I suppose I am. By watching the season I guess.

Did him knowing his lineage end up resulting in the game of telephone tag that informed Daenerys of his true lineage?
Did her knowledge of his right to the throne affect her perception of him as a threat?
Could Tyrion and Jon have the conversation they did if he didn’t know his true lineage?

He would have not been operating within the same set of known circumstances if he did not know his lineage, therefore in my opinion it is not reasonable to suppose he would act the same.