[Rumour] UPD: Canes will try to trade Adam Fox after he indicates he will not sign with them

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by btimbit

The difference though is an NCAA player has added incentive to wait, and that's to finish school. CHL and Euro players don't get that bonus.

Finishing school is a great incentive, I just wish it didn't waste a pick for whatever team drafted them.

I'm sure I've said it before but I'd like to see one extra year before a drafted player goes free agent. That way a player can finish school if they want, without the pressure of being a free agent. Then if they really do want to be a free agent they have to go play in europe for a year or something

The real difference is that you can't sign the player and send him back to NCAA. The Flames for example can sign Zavgorodniy out of the QMJHL and send him back there next year (or even have him go over to Europe and play).

If the Flames were to try to sign Pettersen who's playing NCAA, he can't play there anymore. So to sign him - you either have to decide he's ready to play in the AHL or have him agree to switch teams to play junior for a year (and also tick off the NCAA schools who may tell their players to avoid your team). So by the time the Flames seriously start to negotiate with him after his second year, he's two years away from free agency and may decide to wait it out.

[driveway]

Originally Posted by jaydub74

I know it's been discussed, but this NCAA college free agent loophole is crap. I'm not sure why it hasn't been closed by the league (I know it needs to be collectively bargained) but the NHL has basically had their way with the NHLPA in negotiations so it should have been done. It would seem every team but the Rangers would be in favour of changing it. If you're drafted, your team property until they release you.

I really like the fact that a player can forego hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars if they are truly interested in choosing the team they want to play for. The draft is pretty antithetical to our ideals around individualism, the free market, personal choice. I mean, why is a teenager forced to negotiate with a single employer? And it's not even a negotiation! It's a set entry-level salary. If there was no salary cap at all, and no draft, how big would McDavid's first contract have been? 150 million dollars? More?

In addition - and more to the point - this gives players the opportunity to develop their games so they are better when they arrive in the NHL. Think about Basketball, where players cannot play in the NCAA after being drafted into the NBA, and you get the one-and-done freshmen all over Division I.

I am in favor of players having a mocidum of agency over their destinations when it comes to playing professional sports.

[Enoch Root]

Drafts, player rights, salary caps and such keep the league competitive. And the league is a single product. Allowing players to go where they want is counter-productive to the product of the league.

[oldschoolcalgary]

Originally Posted by EldrickOnIce

Teams know the rules in advance also, and I expect they draft accordingly.
Nothing preventing CHL or European players from going to school while they wait out 4 years either, other than a CHL player has a lot tougher time keeping up with school, given the hockey schedule. The CHL encourages it though, by paying for education. At least, AFAIK that scholarship fund is also available to players still actively playing in the league.

i would add that its a different mindset for many kids growing up in the states.

in the states, kids see the college experience under a lens of playing for a team that might be their parents alma mater, or a school that they grew up rooting for...

in canada, you don't have that in USports, so kids see the CHL as the most direct path to achieving their goals of playing in the NHL

There are a lot of kids that verbal to a school, only to choose going to the CHL as well...So, it really depends on how much kids value going to college, as the top CHL prospectd could easily get scholarships to a top US College too if they were interested in pursuing that route

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Canes owner says they will trade Fox

https://www.newsobserver.com/sports/...228708234.html




Friedman on 960 says he is hearing Carolina is asking for a lot. He isn't sure if they are doing it out of spite to force him to go back to school or if they think he is a very good player and just want a good return.

Also said that the Rangers are near the top if not at the top of Fox's list and that some teams believe that the Rangers will wait for UFA rather than pay the price now

He is also getting mixed reviews on Fox with some thinking he is elite with others not convinced.

I smell a fresh fleecing opportunity.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

I smell a fresh fleecing opportunity.

Yeah - why is the owner commenting on trades.

How can you end up with that much money and not have the good sense to let the people you hire do the work/talking...

[sureLoss]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

Yeah - why is the owner commenting on trades.

How can you end up with that much money and not have the good sense to let the people you hire do the work/talking...

Waddell has to lay low. He claimed the Canes had a 99.9% chance to sign Fox after the trade.

[sureLoss]

LeBrun on insider trading said he doesn't think Carolina will accept a 2nd for Fox in their trade talks with the Rangers. They maybe eyeing the Jets 1st (that the Rangers acquired for Hayes).

[TheoFleury]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

LeBrun on insider trading said he doesn't think Carolina will accept a 2nd for Fox in their trade talks with the Rangers. They maybe eyeing the Jets 1st (that the Rangers acquired for Hayes).

I don't think they realize they are bent over a barrel. If I'm NYR I just wait until he's UFA rather than pay that.

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

I don't think they realize they are bent over a barrel. If I'm NYR I just wait until he's UFA rather than pay that.

I think it also benefits Fox if this goes through. If he gives them a list of teams then they will accommodate him. He really wants to turn pro. If his list consists of one team then you don't accommodate him. NYR are a divisional opponent. Make them work for it. He gets to RFA one year sooner if this works out. The cash doesn't hurt either.

[Yoho]

Originally Posted by shermanator

Am I the only one who did not realize how well the Canes were doing this year? 1 point behind Winnipeg and Nashville and 2 points ahead of Vegas. Think the blockbuster trade was win-win for both teams, even if it gets worse for Carolina in the offseason.

Too bad Carolina will have none of the players they traded for soon. But you’re right this year it’s been win-win.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

I don't think they realize they are bent over a barrel. If I'm NYR I just wait until he's UFA rather than pay that.

I guess it depends on whether or not they are interested in adding him to their roster in 2019 or 2020. If the Rangers were able to trade for Fox this summer he could be playing NHL games for the full season next year, and that could potentially be worth quite a lot.

[Yoho]

Been a bad week for the Canes owner.

[Yamer]

If you're a mid to elite level NCAA prospect you kind of have the league by the balls the way things are now.

Most of them have full scholarships to stay and play hockey, all while enjoying the benefits of an education, excellent training facilities, and a shorter schedule. Play out the stretch, get your degree, and choose your destination.

I guess your only risk is having your stock drop or getting injured.

[burnitdown]

Originally Posted by Yamer

If you're a mid to elite level NCAA prospect you kind of have the league by the balls the way things are now.

Most of them have full scholarships to stay and play hockey, all while enjoying the benefits of an education, excellent training facilities, and a shorter schedule. Play out the stretch, get your degree, and choose your destination.

I guess your only risk is having your stock drop or getting injured.

...and of course, foregoing perhaps a few million dollars by extending your amateur career an extra couple years.

[dissentowner]

My opinion of Fox has always been a guy who will be an excellent PP D man but will get absolutely owned in his own end defensively. Like a slower Jake Gardiner.

[sureLoss]

LeBrun on NHL GMs trying to fix the NCAA free agency situation. (He calls it a "loophole" not me so go @ him on twitter or something).

https://theathletic.com/903974/2019/...eeps-spinning/

Jarmo Kekalainen had a suggestion at the GM meetings early last month. He proposed some form of qualifying offer scenario, where as long as the NHL team made a certain contract offer meeting requirements, that the college player would still see his rights owned by that NHL team even if he didn’t sign. That the club would at least have an asset and not lose the player to free agency.

But he noted that while most NHL teams want the "loophole" fixed, it is a CBA matter to be negotiated between the NHL and NHLPA. The NHLPA won't want to limit a player's options.

[Bleeding Red]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

But he noted that while most NHL teams want the "loophole" fixed, it is a CBA matter to be negotiated between the NHL and NHLPA. The NHLPA won't want to limit a player's options.

Doesn't the NHLPA have a history of throwing rookies under the bus?
the NCAA thing could be the first chip they toss without argument to help ease the pain elsewhere.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Bleeding Red

Doesn't the NHLPA have a history of throwing rookies under the bus?
the NCAA thing could be the first chip they toss without argument to help ease the pain elsewhere.

I don't know about that, as these college free agents are a factor in driving up salaries which is what the PA wants.

Schultz, Vessey, DeKeyser, those guys all drove up the price for players in their age bracket.

[Roof-Daddy]

They should fix it, whatever you want to call it.

You hit on a lotto ticket, that lotto ticket shouldn't be allowed to grow legs and walk away.