Alberta Election Thread - Election Day April 16 2019

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by GGG

I question the statement that the world economy is decreasing its reliance on oil and gas. I don’t think we have seen any evidence that oil and gas demand is dropping. And even if O+G demand does drop off Alberta is well positioned to be a low cost supplier of oil given the high upfront capital investment of CPF facilities and the relatively low (relative to shale) sustaining production costs. So in my opinion current production levels will be maintained in Alberta relatively indefinitely unless a massive technological shift occurs away from oil and gas in developing nations. And even if that massive shift away from oil vehicles occurs the switch to natural gas based power instead of coal should see increasing gas demand as carbon emmissioms are forced to drop.

Either way if Alberta and Canada have their #### together we can be a minor supplier of the worlds enerfy needs going forward. The world is not going to meet any of its Paris goals unless Carbon Capture rescues us.

We don’t have an issue with the global demand for our product. We have a transportation problem.

And we have factions within our own governments that are preventing transportation of our product at any cost to Canadians. That is just oil though.

It still stuns me that we are phasing out our 22 coal fired plants in Canada, which provide the cheap electricity, while China alone is building over 700 new ones from what I understand(and yes they are a signatory to the Paris accord...an accord that isnt worth the paper it is written on) and they already generate well over half of that type of electricity on earth. The US isnt much better. Add that to the rest of the countries and there are over 1600 new or being built as of last year.

Further to that, Canada will still mine and sell our coal to other countries to burn so they benefit from the cheap electricity. Someone explain this one rationally will ya?

Yet somehow, our virtue signalling governments are determined to not only hurt their own bottom line with lost revenus, they are doing it on the backs of taxpayers and business. And what will that accomplish exactly? Not a damn thing except putting people out of work, and exacerbating the struggles of the lower and middle class citizens with the burden of more money to be paid for....nothing of substance or significance.

It really is as close to cutting off the nose to spite the face as it gets.

The stupidity of it all is endless.

[Bunk]

^ Yes, and here's the thing, we have total unanimity within our province that the transportation of our product is crucial. We don't necessarily have agreement of exactly the political tactics how to get there, but we also have limited ability provincially to force the issue. If there was ever a federal matter, this is it.

My worry a bit is if Kenney goes in and completely antagonizes Trudeau. If it seems apparent in the upcoming federal election that there is absolutely zero political upside in getting pipelines built, and only downside in places like BC, Quebec and Ontario where elections are decided, they'll just say screw it - we don't need Alberta. Come October, not even a Albertan in caucus anymore to bother with. Win the election, write off Trans Mountain and be done with it.

It'll feel damn good for a moment to give the F-U to Ottawa, but we could be royally screwed. That's a perfectly plausible scenario.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Bunk

^ Yes, and here's the thing, we have total unanimity within our province that the transportation of our product is crucial. We don't necessarily have agreement of exactly the political tactics how to get there, but we also have limited ability provincially to force the issue. If there was ever a federal matter, this is it.

My worry a bit is if Kenney goes in and completely antagonizes Trudeau. It seems apparent in the upcoming federal election that there is absolutely zero political upside in getting pipelines built, and only downside in places like BC, Quebec and Ontario where elections are decided, they'll just say screw it - we don't need Alberta. Come October, not even a Albertan in caucus anymore to bother with. Win the election, write off Trans Mountain and be done with it.

It'll feel damn good for a moment to give the F-U to Ottawa, but we could be royally screwed. That's a perfectly plausible scenario.

Except that in both Ontario and BC, there is more support for pipelines than there is against them. Period..In fact in every province except one they are supported. I will let you guess which one and who is getting pandered too yet again.

the entire problem though is that foreign funded and well organized campaigns have been winning the PR battle on this stuff for years and the truth about support, actual emissions, reality of switching to renewables, etc...is unknown by the majority of Canadians. Its what eco-nuts have done for decades and in this instance, it was an easy sell for Tides and their lot.

This has to be ended...full stop. Kenney is the one leader that has specifically addressed this stuff and what he will do to combat it, and the time for talking and playing nice with everyone is over. It doesnt work...we are miles further behind than when both the Libs and NDP won elections 4 years ago.

I want a federal referendum, not just because of the equalization but because it will bring nation wide attention to what the hell is actually happening here. People just dont know elsewhere.

There is an entire chapter of climate change and what has to happen to address the reality of it that is being completely ignored and shut down. That has to end. Apparently since no one else will do it, then it has to start right here and right now.

[Regorium]

Originally Posted by Bunk

Totally fair. I am curious about the statement about Alberta being well positioned to be a low cost provider. I am not in Oil and Gas, so I don't know much about the long term operating costs after after the capital expansions. One worry I have is, isn't a lot of the jobs about the expansions themselves? Will the jobs recover in places like Calgary, even if Oil recovers and we can get the product exported?

Yes the boom type jobs are the expansions themselves but there are still lots of steady jobs in operating and maintaining the assets.

And if the producers are making money with those operating assets, that means they have the flexibility and capital to adapt to the market with it - whether that might be investing in R&D, solar facilities, wind power or what not.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Bunk

^ Yes, and here's the thing, we have total unanimity within our province that the transportation of our product is crucial. We don't necessarily have agreement of exactly the political tactics how to get there, but we also have limited ability provincially to force the issue. If there was ever a federal matter, this is it.

My worry a bit is if Kenney goes in and completely antagonizes Trudeau. If it seems apparent in the upcoming federal election that there is absolutely zero political upside in getting pipelines built, and only downside in places like BC, Quebec and Ontario where elections are decided, they'll just say screw it - we don't need Alberta. Come October, not even a Albertan in caucus anymore to bother with. Win the election, write off Trans Mountain and be done with it.

It'll feel damn good for a moment to give the F-U to Ottawa, but we could be royally screwed. That's a perfectly plausible scenario.

At the end of the day. What's going to happen is probably that the Liberal Caucus will split on approving the pipeline construction. We know that the new head of the treasury board, and the environment minister are hard against any development.



I also firmly believe that if the government does approve this, its still a long way from shovels in the ground as the lawsuits are going to pile up no matter how much consultation is done. Various groups have already said their heading to court no matter the result.


So this will get tied up in court again. The pressure will be on the government to re do the assessment under Bills c-69 and C-48 as they are going to pass amended fairly soon.


Also as noted, I doubt that any of the Federal Liberal's in Alberta will win their seats back. So the decision becomes a political one.


If the Liberal's get back in, its just as likely that they will look at a bunch of lawsuits, the cost of doing a new assessment under the new rules and say, not worth the dollars and effort and kill transmountain or put it on indefinite hold and kick it down the road for someone else to deal with.


I will be pleasantly surprised if we see any actual construction before fall of 2020

[Bunk]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Except that in both Ontario and BC, there is more support for pipelines than there is against them. Period..In fact in every province except one they are supported. I will let you guess which one and who is getting pandered too yet again.

Indeed, that is true. The PR push back in favour of projects like Trans Mountain, has actually worked pretty well. The issue is in places like Ontario, while people generally support, it is way, way down the list of issues they care about - and will not really move them much one way or another. In pockets of seat rich lower mainland or Vancouver Island, it is a higher priority issue.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by transplant99

So calling out the sitting party on their actual record of governance the last 4 years, now qualifies as "fear and smear"?

Good grief.

In regards to bringing up what a candidate said in their past being an actual part of what they believe today, then the UCP should be splashing this all over the province.



And that picture is WAY WAY more recent than the Kenney video, so i must conclude that Notley and Phillips are actively working against getting ANY pipelines built, therefor they should automatically be disqualified from being elected to represent Albertans. Right?

Woosh.

The point was that fear and smear is used by all major players, not that it is valid, nor that criticism of actual current governing policy is “fear and smear.”

I think neither Kenney’s decades old statements nor Notley’s standing at a protest should be used against them, but to take issue only with one party doing it is partisan nonsense.

The sooner we can realise both leading parties are engaging in some pretty stupid and unhelpful misinformation and fear mongering, the sooner we move away from this sort of partisan bickering. Complaining when the “bad guys” do it while letting it slide when your side does it is just dishonest imo. Either take issue with it as a whole, or don’t.

When we become fanboys for a political party or a leader, we gain a skewed view of reality. That’s not a place you should want to be coming from when making a decision.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Bunk

Indeed, that is true. The PR push back in favour of projects like Trans Mountain, has actually worked pretty well. The issue is in places like Ontario, while people generally support, it is way, way down the list of issues they care about - and will not really move them much one way or another. In pockets of seat rich lower mainland or Vancouver Island, it is a higher priority issue.

Agreed...my thing though is that in regards to the bolded, that can be changed with real honest dialogue and a narrative that isnt controlled from offices in NY city.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Bunk

Indeed, that is true. The PR push back in favour of projects like Trans Mountain, has actually worked pretty well. The issue is in places like Ontario, while people generally support, it is way, way down the list of issues they care about - and will not really move them much one way or another. In pockets of seat rich lower mainland or Vancouver Island, it is a higher priority issue.

Yeah it’s a not a topic of conversation here. It’s weird, most people I’ve spoken to think it’s a minor issue.

[GordonBlue]

I interrupt this election to bring you the 50th birthday bash for beloved Alberta Legislature burger.

https://www.thechronicleherald.ca/ne...burger-294190/


Alberta’s legislative library must preserve records tabled in the house.

That’s why the burger is now encased in resin, displayed in a glass case opposite decidedly more traditional records

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Woosh.

The point was that fear and smear is used by all major players, not that it is valid, nor that criticism of actual current governing policy is “fear and smear.”

I think neither Kenney’s decades old statements nor Notley’s standing at a protest should be used against them, but to take issue only with one party doing it is partisan nonsense.

The sooner we can realise both leading parties are engaging in some pretty stupid and unhelpful misinformation and fear mongering, the sooner we move away from this sort of partisan bickering. Complaining when the “bad guys” do it while letting it slide when your side does it is just dishonest imo. Either take issue with it as a whole, or don’t.

When we become fanboys for a political party or a leader, we gain a skewed view of reality. That’s not a place you should want to be coming from when making a decision.

Not all of us are fanboys for any particular party. Some of us simply dislike some more than others. I'm certainly not a Kenny or UCP fan but IMO they are better than alternative for the majority of Albertans.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Woosh.

The point was that fear and smear is used by all major players, not that it is valid, nor that criticism of actual current governing policy is “fear and smear.”

I think neither Kenney’s decades old statements nor Notley’s standing at a protest should be used against them, but to take issue only with one party doing it is partisan nonsense.

The sooner we can realise both leading parties are engaging in some pretty stupid and unhelpful misinformation and fear mongering, the sooner we move away from this sort of partisan bickering. Complaining when the “bad guys” do it while letting it slide when your side does it is just dishonest imo. Either take issue with it as a whole, or don’t.

When we become fanboys for a political party or a leader, we gain a skewed view of reality. That’s not a place you should want to be coming from when making a decision.

Back at ya.

What particular fear tactics are the UCP explicitly endorsing?....kind of my point. They are using existing records/numbers from the last 4 years of NDP rule.

2 different websites attacking Kenney personally and then that video.Its ridiculous.

That being said i couldn't agree with you more that every party ends up going down the same road at some point, but in general it isn't usually the incumbents!

It's apparent that Notley and her crew aren't able to run on their existing record because there is so little to run on that matters to the majority of voters and they know it.

[transplant99]

This is the kind of nonsense that simply shouldnt be allowed

On the video Kenney says he was part of a campaign leading to a vote where the majority in San Francisco said No to a gay spousal law.

A voice in the video says he was stopping dying AIDS patients from seeing their same-sex partners in hospital.

The next day, Thursday, the Notley NDP release a 10-minute documentary where they put in a slightly longer video of Kenney followed by heart-wrenching interviews of people who lived through the AIDS crisis of 30 years ago.

The people interviewed are then shown the Kenney video. They don’t like it and say so.

The 10 minutes ends with those interviewed in San Francisco more or less saying don’t vote for Kenney. Then there’s a final quotation from Notley.

Now Kenney points out he volunteered at an AIDS hospice 30 years ago. He and others saw the vote campaign as being about the definition of marriage not about limiting partners from visiting loved ones in hospital.

Yeah its Bell but its also factual and points out how friggin desperate the NDP are.

25 more days.

[calgarygeologist]

What are the rules for campaign signs? I drove down Country Hills Blvd this afternoon from Deerfoot to Shaganappi and there wasn't a single sign up for any party. I expected those huge 4x8 signs, or whatever they are, to be up all over the place on a busy road like that. Are they not allowed to do it anymore or are the candidates just slow up there?

[Amethyst]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

What are the rules for campaign signs? I drove down Country Hills Blvd this afternoon from Deerfoot to Shaganappi and there wasn't a single sign up for any party. I expected those huge 4x8 signs, or whatever they are, to be up all over the place on a busy road like that. Are they not allowed to do it anymore or are the candidates just slow up there?

They're all over in my neighbourhood!

[Zarley]

Originally Posted by Tyler

Actually, I think the biggest issue AHS has is keeping people alive, and this does in fact do that

I'm certainly not discounting the value of work that AHS professionals do, but I'd encourage you to do some more research into the performance of this province on broader public health metrics. The government's interactive health data website is an excellent resource for this, and the results are not pretty:

- As a province, we are in the bottom half of OECD jurisdictions in terms of overall life expectancy at birth.
- We have the 7th worst infant mortality rate among 34 jurisdictions.
- This poor performance comes despite the 6th highest per capita total health spending (public and private) adjusted for purchasing power parity.
- Thanks to increases in operational spending by the current government, we now have the highest per capita healthcare spending of any province in the country.

The point is that we can build as many cancer centres as we want and hire more and more nurses, but we are not going to solve the structural issues with the public health bureaucracy. We need to be studying the approaches to public health used in places like Japan, France, NZ, and Australia which all have lower expenditures and better outcomes. I don't know what the answer is but it's certainly not carrying on with the status quo.

[Ozy_Flame]

Not even three days since appointment. I hope he can keep his bible thumping out of politics.

UCP candidate and pastor slammed for sermon comment that wives should ‘submit’ to their husbands

“Wives, respect your husbands. Submit to your husbands. Husbands, love your wives,” the pastor said in the clip.

The UCP named Wong Thursday as the replacement for Caylan Ford in the Alberta election race.

Ford resigned after Facebook messages surfaced this week in which she promoted racist white supremacist talking points, saying among other things that she is “somewhat saddened by the demographic replacement of white peoples in their homelands.”

UCP spokesperson Matt Solberg defended Wong Friday, saying in an email: “It should come as no surprise that a pastor quoted the Bible (Ephesians 5) while delivering a sermon.”

The full Bible verse Solberg referenced reads: “Wives, submit yourselves to your own husbands as you do to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior. Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.”

[Ozy_Flame]

Here's another oddball story:

https://twitter.com/user/status/1109138198775500800

[Slava]

I think that I'm going to vote first thing on April 9 so that I can try to ignore all the campaigning after that. It's a few days in and I've had enough of the mudslinging already.

At this point I think that I will just vote for the Alberta Party because they're not the other two. I don't know.

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by Slava

At this point I think that I will just vote for the Alberta Party because they're not the other two. I don't know.

I think that's the most sane and realistic solution. They seem the least crazy on all fronts.