Alberta Politics Thread v2

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by Jacks

Election will be called on Monday from what I've been told.

Beautiful.

I've prepared a primer in case some have forgotten how rough this has been.

- 8 month royalty review, Notley finds out it's fair and in her words "isn't the time for a cash grab."
- Losing the PPA lawsuit they sued themselves over.
- Unconstitutional small brewery taxes ruled against THREE times.
- The powerbar/thermostat racketeering.
- Pissing off farmers with Bill 6.
- Corp taxes up, income taxes up, min wage up regardless of business size.
- Carbon tax not campaigned on.
- Multiple credit downgrades.
- Social license doesn't exist.
- Phasing out coal power then buying it from Montana.

I'm sure I missed a bunch, but feel free to add.

[Dion]

I was watching Alberta Prime Time and it's regular Tuesday talk on politics. The belief is the NDP will have a short spring session (week to 10 days) after the throne speech. Probably the first week of April before the writ is dropped.

Suggestions from the panel is the NDP will want to introduce a bill to protect public health care and at the same time use this as a way to paint Kenney as the enemy of health care in Alberta.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

Beautiful.

I've prepared a primer in case some have forgotten how rough this has been.

- 8 month royalty review, Notley finds out it's fair and in her words "isn't the time for a cash grab."
- Losing the PPA lawsuit they sued themselves over.
- Unconstitutional small brewery taxes ruled against THREE times.
- The powerbar/thermostat racketeering.
- Pissing off farmers with Bill 6.
- Corp taxes up, income taxes up, min wage up regardless of business size.
- Carbon tax not campaigned on.
- Multiple credit downgrades.
- Social license doesn't exist.
- Phasing out coal power then buying it from Montana.

I'm sure I missed a bunch, but feel free to add.

Someone coming into your home to show you how to install light bulbs and shower heads

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

Beautiful.

I've prepared a primer in case some have forgotten how rough this has been.

- 8 month royalty review, Notley finds out it's fair and in her words "isn't the time for a cash grab."
- Losing the PPA lawsuit they sued themselves over.
- Unconstitutional small brewery taxes ruled against THREE times.
- The powerbar/thermostat racketeering.
- Pissing off farmers with Bill 6.
- Corp taxes up, income taxes up, min wage up regardless of business size.
- Carbon tax not campaigned on.
- Multiple credit downgrades.
- Social license doesn't exist.
- Phasing out coal power then buying it from Montana.

I'm sure I missed a bunch, but feel free to add.

Borrowing money for operations and increasing spending elsewhere. That’s it. That’s my whole election campaign if I’m another party.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

Beautiful.

I've prepared a primer in case some have forgotten how rough this has been.

- 8 month royalty review, Notley finds out it's fair and in her words "isn't the time for a cash grab."
- Losing the PPA lawsuit they sued themselves over.
- Unconstitutional small brewery taxes ruled against THREE times.
- The powerbar/thermostat racketeering.
- Pissing off farmers with Bill 6.
- Corp taxes up, income taxes up, min wage up regardless of business size.
- Carbon tax not campaigned on.
- Multiple credit downgrades.
- Social license doesn't exist.
- Phasing out coal power then buying it from Montana.

I'm sure I missed a bunch, but feel free to add.

Those two alone show how desperately incompetent this group is.

Ideology outweighed common sense AND reality in both instances. And both are going to end up costing Albertans BILLIONS of dollars while not making any tangible difference in the lowering of carbon output worldwide.

Then the cherry on top as Slava points out...borrowing money so they could increase their debt.

Totally mind boggling stupidity.

[GGG]

- Royalty review improved conventional oil and gas royalty system significantly
- Agree PPA was terrible
-Agree lightbulb program was brutal
-Bill 6 was good legislation in general, farms are real businesses that have real safety risks. They are not special
-Alberta’s tax base needed increasing to deliver services at the level expected. If Kenny cuts revenue he is an idiot. We have subsidized low taxes with resource revenue for far too long
- Alberta needed a Sales tax, the Carbon tax effectively is one. Doing the political heavy lifting on this was important. Again Kenny would be an idiot to cut it now the political damage was taken on by someone else. Put the funds in general revenues and leave it in place

- agree social license didn’t work. She got ####ed by Trudeau
- agree the coal phase out is poorly designed

The other big thing she did is took on her unions and won without them striking. Getting 0% raises without strikes was good governance and needs to continue for another 3 years at least to bring costs back in line.

I think that on taxation the NDP fixed the revenue side of the problem in Alberta. This was a very important accomplishment that the next premier needs not to squander. The NDPs record is also not as bad as people make it out to be. That said spending increased greater than pop growth plus inflation over the 4 years so that is not acceptable.

I really hope Kenny’s platform is competent.

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

Beautiful.

I've prepared a primer in case some have forgotten how rough this has been.

- 8 month royalty review, Notley finds out it's fair and in her words "isn't the time for a cash grab."
- Losing the PPA lawsuit they sued themselves over.
- Unconstitutional small brewery taxes ruled against THREE times.
- The powerbar/thermostat racketeering.
- Pissing off farmers with Bill 6.
- Corp taxes up, income taxes up, min wage up regardless of business size.
- Carbon tax not campaigned on.
- Multiple credit downgrades.
- Social license doesn't exist.
- Phasing out coal power then buying it from Montana.

I'm sure I missed a bunch, but feel free to add.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by GGG

I really hope Kenny’s platform is competent.

I say the same about the Alberta Party.

I'm not voting NDP and have a lot of concerns about the UCP.

need another option or I'll have to consider spoiling my ballot.
(I'm still going to vote no matter what)

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

I think if you're not going to vote for a party you can formally reject your ballot, which would be the option that makes most sense as a protest?

Although I frankly can't get behind that, there's always a "least bad" option and voting Alberta Party just to put some numbers up and give them something to build on would be a positive in itself.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by GGG

-Alberta’s tax base needed increasing to deliver services at the level expected. If Kenny cuts revenue he is an idiot. We have subsidized low taxes with resource revenue for far too long

Explain this statement? Or are you confusing tax base with tax rate here? Because I'm pretty sure everyone agrees with expanding the tax base, and that's what Kenney would certainly tell you his policies are aimed at doing, while the NDP's policies have only shrunk it.

[CaptainCrunch]

Just as a thing, Kenney has been releasing a lot of campaign planks on their twitter account.

[wireframe]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

Beautiful.

I've prepared a primer in case some have forgotten how rough this has been.

- 8 month royalty review, Notley finds out it's fair and in her words "isn't the time for a cash grab."
- Losing the PPA lawsuit they sued themselves over.
- Unconstitutional small brewery taxes ruled against THREE times.
- The powerbar/thermostat racketeering.
- Pissing off farmers with Bill 6.
- Corp taxes up, income taxes up, min wage up regardless of business size.
- Carbon tax not campaigned on.
- Multiple credit downgrades.
- Social license doesn't exist.
- Phasing out coal power then buying it from Montana.

I'm sure I missed a bunch, but feel free to add.

It's probably just me, but none of this has been 'rough' on my household at all.

edit: To clarify, I think there are a few valid criticisms in this list, like the PPA lawsuit, but it has had absolutely zero effect on my life.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by GGG

- Royalty review improved conventional oil and gas royalty system significantly
- Agree PPA was terrible
-Agree lightbulb program was brutal
-Bill 6 was good legislation in general, farms are real businesses that have real safety risks. They are not special
-Alberta’s tax base needed increasing to deliver services at the level expected. If Kenny cuts revenue he is an idiot. We have subsidized low taxes with resource revenue for far too long
- Alberta needed a Sales tax, the Carbon tax effectively is one. Doing the political heavy lifting on this was important. Again Kenny would be an idiot to cut it now the political damage was taken on by someone else. Put the funds in general revenues and leave it in place

- agree social license didn’t work. She got ####ed by Trudeau
- agree the coal phase out is poorly designed

The other big thing she did is took on her unions and won without them striking. Getting 0% raises without strikes was good governance and needs to continue for another 3 years at least to bring costs back in line.

I think that on taxation the NDP fixed the revenue side of the problem in Alberta. This was a very important accomplishment that the next premier needs not to squander. The NDPs record is also not as bad as people make it out to be. That said spending increased greater than pop growth plus inflation over the 4 years so that is not acceptable.

I really hope Kenny’s platform is competent.

Yeah it really is fiscally. In fact its a bloody disaster. The worst part is that it was entirely and completely avoidable if they had ANY common sense and didn't govern on ideology first, reality second.

But this has been rehashed a hundred times.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Explain this statement? Or are you confusing tax base with tax rate here? Because I'm pretty sure everyone agrees with expanding the tax base, and that's what Kenney would certainly tell you his policies are aimed at doing, while the NDP's policies have only shrunk it.

Sorry Tax Rate.

Alberta's tax rates have been too low to support the services it offers. They rely on resource revenue to subsidize services. The Alberta Advantage was sitting on a highly valuable resource. Not its flat tax. So we have a few options to ween ourselves off of resource revenue. Increase taxation or cut services. A combination of both are required. The NDP did a good job of making the revenue side sensible. Now we need someone to attack the spending side.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Yeah it really is fiscally. In fact its a bloody disaster. The worst part is that it was entirely and completely avoidable if they had ANY common sense and didn't govern on ideology first, reality second.

But this has been rehashed a hundred times.

Royalties they used common sense and went against ideology
Unions negotiations they used common sense and went against ideology.

Minimum wage they went to fast without data to support positive or negative consequences. The early raises up to $12 would have been supported by data from other jurisdictions.

What do you see as ideology based governance? Outside of minimum wage I don't see it. Their decision not cut staff is just applying keynesian economic theory so its well grounded.

[Regorium]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Yeah it really is fiscally. In fact its a bloody disaster. The worst part is that it was entirely and completely avoidable if they had ANY common sense and didn't govern on ideology first, reality second.

But this has been rehashed a hundred times.

It wasn't avoidable at all.

Okay, it was avoidable, but considering the plan that Prentice put out was strongly rejected by voters (33% debt, 33% tax increase, 33% service cut), it clearly wasn't wanted.

Kenney can grandstand all he wants, but given a similar level of oil revenue, there's literally no way he can cover 10 BILLION dollars of a budget gap just by "finding efficiencies" and "cutting red tape".

Frankly, I'm not happy that they went into deficit/debt, but the fact that it's pretty well controlled is a positive. Unions haven't gotten raises for years under Notley.

It'd be interesting to see how Kenney manages the situation. My bet is that our debt gets even worse (assuming no pipeline changes), and it's all blamed on the socialist NDP, all the while Kenney does nothing to fix it.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by wireframe

It's probably just me, but none of this has been 'rough' on my household at all.

edit: To clarify, I think there are a few valid criticisms in this list, like the PPA lawsuit, but it has had absolutely zero effect on my life.

At least you're honest.

I'll say this, the "ooga booga Kenney bad" Kenney narrative will have zero affect on my life. I'll be voting based on differing economic ideology and high unemployment in Calgary.

[Ozy_Flame]

I agree with wireframe, NDP policies have had no effect on my life at all. If anything, the market prices for oil did, as they should. Municipal affairs affect my daily life far more.

Having said that, I am extremely concerned about Kenney's potential impact on our healthcare industry, and is showing a serious lack of understanding on what healthcare workers do in their roles, as well as yanking the public integrated model back towards privatization. Planning to cancel a medical lab because "labs don't save lives" is shockingly naive and misunderstanding the whole healthcare process.

This is among other things that party concerns me about. I get the sense their platform objective is to return Alberta to somewhere between 1993 or 2005. Sucks that we're going to have to accept this party as our next government and one that wants to go back in time. Oh goody.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

I agree with wireframe, NDP policies have had no effect on my life at all. If anything, the market prices for oil did, as they should. Municipal affairs affect my daily life far more.

Having said that, I am extremely concerned about Kenney's potential impact on our healthcare industry, and is showing a serious lack of understanding on what healthcare workers do in their roles, as well as yanking the public integrated model back towards privatization. Planning to cancel a medical lab because "labs don't save lives" is shockingly naive and misunderstanding the whole healthcare process.

This is among other things that party concerns me about. I get the sense their platform objective is to return Alberta to somewhere between 1993 or 2005. Sucks that we're going to have to accept this party as our next government and one that wants to go back in time. Oh goody.

So you quoted this phrase which i assume means you saw or heard someone say that.

care to link that?

[CaptainCrunch]

I think that Ozzy is referring to this, he can correct me if I'm wrong


https://calgaryherald.com/news/local...a-cee90df81476

A planned $590-million Edmonton Laboratory Clinical Hub — dubbed the ‘Superlab’ — would be nixed under a UCP government, party leader Jason Kenney said Monday.
The UCP would also reverse a planned $50-million purchase of Dynalife labs, an Edmonton-based company with about 1,200 workers.


In May 2016, Health Minister Sarah Hoffman announced her government’s intention to consolidate lab testing for northern Alberta in one central facility. It would replace Dynalife’s downtown facility and labs across the city.

Kenney on Monday slammed the NDP government’s plan as a “boondoggle” fuelled by “NDP ideology.”


He contended scrapping it would save taxpayers $640 million, but Hoffman and the Health Sciences Association of Alberta have come out swinging against his proposal.


“They’re ideologically hostile to the idea of the private sector delivering some services more efficiently on behalf of the government,” Kenney said.


“Our view is that you can get better bang for the taxpayer buck through choice and competition, rather than through a monopoly provider.”

Speaking with media in Edmonton, Kenney said the government should be making choices to directly support patient care, not building a $600-million lab.


The government’s current lab plan also includes a program to share information through a database. Kenney said he doesn’t have a problem with that, but a UCP government would take a close look at databases to make sure they’re being developed “in a common-sense way.”

I couldn't find a labs don't save lives quote anywhere in my admittedly quick search

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

Beautiful.

I've prepared a primer in case some have forgotten how rough this has been.

- 8 month royalty review, Notley finds out it's fair and in her words "isn't the time for a cash grab."
- Losing the PPA lawsuit they sued themselves over.
- Unconstitutional small brewery taxes ruled against THREE times.
- The powerbar/thermostat racketeering.
- Pissing off farmers with Bill 6.
- Corp taxes up, income taxes up, min wage up regardless of business size.
- Carbon tax not campaigned on.
- Multiple credit downgrades.
- Social license doesn't exist.
- Phasing out coal power then buying it from Montana.

I'm sure I missed a bunch, but feel free to add.

I'd like to add increasing municipal taxes to the list. It was a fairly significant increase in 2016.


And I'd really like to add the propagation of the evil private/American style health care myth. That really has to end.