2018/2019 Trade Speculation and Rumors

[Samonadreau]

Originally Posted by timbit

Don’t want to seem like I am fixated but I like Couturier a lot more offensively and defensively. He is a 1 b or high end 2 C with great AAV and term.

Have to think Couturier is as untouchable a piece as Philly has.

[timbit]

Originally Posted by Samonadreau

Have to think Couturier is as untouchable a piece as Philly has.

You’re probably right but I would be paying a much bigger price because of his age, salary. term etc than Stone. Monahan, Couturier and Backlund set things up at C for a longtime

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by timbit

Don’t want to seem like I am fixated but I like Couturier a lot more offensively and defensively. He is a 1 b or high end 2 C with great AAV and term.

I don’t see Philly doing that move unless the Flames moved out one of their big 4 forwards or Hanifin. If Treliving could turn Jankowski and Bennett into Couturier he would likely have done it by now. Stone at least by all accounts appears to be a rental player where the Sens will get futures that include a late 1st, decent prospect and young depth roster player.

I just don’t see the Flames being able to afford Stone long term unless they could move Frolik, Neal, and one of Brodie, Stone, Hamonic. Basically Stone and Tkachuk would require 15-16M to re-sign and that doesn’t include Rittich, Bennett, 4th line wingers etc

[RT14]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Yeah, but Fletcher is competent and Melnyk is a loose cannon.

Why does Philly trade couts?

Trading for a player a team doesn't want to give up doesn't come cheap. I'd love coutourier too, Ivana Toilet-Seat-Made-Out-Of-Solid-Gold, but its just not in the cards now, is it?

Fletcher was just quoted as saying the only untouchable is Giroux. You hinted that going after Stone for a very high cost might be worth it because it would give us the best top 6 in the league. Timbit, and I agree, is suggesting if we’re gonna pay a premium for either of them, he’d rather Couturier because of his contract, position and playing style.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by timbit

Would go as high as 2 firsts, Jankowski or Bennett, Andersson or Kylington because of AAV , term, age and 200 foot game.

That's interesting.

I might pull the trigger on that deal.

[timbit]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

I don’t see Philly doing that move unless the Flames moved out one of their big 4 forwards or Hanifin. If Treliving could turn Jankowski and Bennett into Couturier he would likely have done it by now. Stone at least by all accounts appears to be a rental player where the Sens will get futures that include a late 1st, decent prospect and young depth roster player.

I just don’t see the Flames being able to afford Stone long term unless they could move Frolik, Neal, and one of Brodie, Stone, Hamonic. Basically Stone and Tkachuk would require 15-16M to re-sign and that doesn’t include Rittich, Bennett, 4th line wingers etc

Thinking 2 firsts, Jankowski or Bennett, Andersson or Kylington.

[RT14]

Originally Posted by timbit

Thinking 2 firsts, Jankowski or Bennett, Andersson or Kylington.

And that’s where I disagree I think just a bit. 2 firsts on top of that package is a bit too rich for him imo. I’d do 2019 1st, 2020 3rd, Jankowski and Kylington or maybe Andersson. If that’s not enough, I’d walk away.

[TheScorpion]

IMO the Flames should move Brodie anyway this summer to make room for Valimaki, Andersson, and Kylington be full-time NHLers going forward. Brodie's gonna want a huge raise and the Flames shouldn't pay it. That'd be a good way to recoup some assets traded in a possible Stone trade, too -- the Flames could easily get a 1st+ for Brodie.

[timbit]

Originally Posted by RT14

And that’s where I disagree I think just a bit. 2 firsts on top of that package is a bit too rich for him imo. I’d do 2019 1st, 2020 3rd, Jankowski and Kylington or maybe Andersson. If that’s not enough, I’d walk away.

He had 76 points last season and was a Selke finalist. He is on pace for 75 points again this season with 4 more years at 4.3 AAV. Just turned 26.

[RT14]

Originally Posted by timbit

He had 76 points last season and was a Selke finalist. He is on pace for 75 points again this season with 4 more years at 4.3 AAV. Just turned 26.

Yeah but Kylington or Andersson should carry a lot of value by themselves, Janko probably quite a bit after coming into his own this year too and would be a decent defensive replacement for Couturier. Add a 1st and a 3rd. Seems like a lot, although you make some great points.

[timbit]

Elite defensive C who puts up 75 points at that salary and age command a huge return.

The term is extremely attractive, as well.

Would be tough to find a better top 3 C on any team for the next few years.

[Philly06Cup]

Lol!

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by timbit

Would be tough to find a better top 3 C on any team for the next few years.

And that would be the length of this window of possible success. Just a short few years. This is a team that has nothing left in the system because of Treliving's wheeling and dealing to get to this point, and now people are starting to propose trading away the very depth this team invested in developing. That depth is what will extend the window and allow the Flames to keep this level of success rolling long term. This is a team that is pretty damn close as it is. I'd maintain the course and keep the powder dry. Upgrade the goaltender situation if possible, but beyond that, hold firm. With no high level prospects in the system at any position it is time to keep an eye on sustainability as well.

[Fan69]

Originally Posted by New Era

And that would be the length of this window of possible success. Just a short few years. This is a team that has nothing left in the system because of Treliving's wheeling and dealing to get to this point, and now people are starting to propose trading away the very depth this team invested in developing. That depth is what will extend the window and allow the Flames to keep this level of success rolling long term. This is a team that is pretty damn close as it is. I'd maintain the course and keep the powder dry. Upgrade the goaltender situation if possible, but beyond that, hold firm. With no high level prospects in the system at any position it is time to keep an eye on sustainability as well.

Dont always agree with your take but i agree here. Having players coming up is what got chicago three cups instead of one. Now is when we start selling a top end player here or thier but with sgnificant futures coming back otherwise your selling your most important pieces and starting a new rebuild after a year or two because you cant maintain enough depth to stay competative.

Precarious point that could be ugly if done incorrectly by tre.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by New Era

Except he isn't. Sam Bennett is 199th in scoring for forwards. That would place him onto the third line.

If you actually take into consideration opportunity, Bennett is much worse. Bennett is producing at a 1.70 P/60 amongst forwards, which puts him 9th on the Flames and clearly in the bottom six. He's 236th on this measure in the league. For comparables, looking at the top 10 teams, on Tampa Bennett would be 11th, on San Jose he would be 10th, on Winnipeg he would be 12th, on Nashville he would be 10th, on the Islanders he would be 10th, the Leafs he would be 9th, Vegas he would be 9th, Montreal he would be 12th, Washington he would be 11th. For the rest of the league, on Pittsburgh he would be 11th, Minnesota he would be 9th, Carolina he would be 10th, Colorado he would be 8th, Vancouver he would be 9th, Anaheim he would be 10th, Arizona he would be 7th, Rangers he would be 9th, Florida he would be 8th, Detroit he would be 8th, Chicago he would be 7th, Philadelphia he would be 9th, New Jersey he would be 8th, Ottawa he would be 11th. The only teams he would manage to scrap into the top six are Columbus, where he would be 6th, Boston he would be 6th, Buffalo he would be 6th, Dallas he would be 6th, and Los Angeles he would be 6th. The only team where he sneaks about the six slot is Edmonton, where he would be 5th. Not sure how I see where he's a top six player.

that is a really long winded way of agreeing with me.

199/31 = 6.4

6 forwards make up the top two lines

He's between a 2nd and 3rd line average NHL player.

I've said that two times.

Thanks for your support!

[Wolfman]

What would be the cost to land Panarin? I guess it would depend on if you could re-sign him. How did the Jackets get him for so cheap?

[bzoo02]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

IMO the Flames should move Brodie anyway this summer to make room for Valimaki, Andersson, and Kylington be full-time NHLers going forward. Brodie's gonna want a huge raise and the Flames shouldn't pay it. That'd be a good way to recoup some assets traded in a possible Stone trade, too -- the Flames could easily get a 1st+ for Brodie.

In theory this is the right move, but when you're 1st place in the west and pushing for a cup run you don't break up the best D pairing in hockey.

Edit: Misread "this summer". Fully agree Scorp.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by bzoo02

In theory this is the right move, but when you're 1st place in the west and pushing for a cup run you don't break up the best D pairing in hockey.

I don't think he's saying to move Brodie during the season. I think he's saying if you pay a first for a trade deadline deal, you can get a first back in the off season if you move Brodie.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by bzoo02

In theory this is the right move, but when you're 1st place in the west and pushing for a cup run you don't break up the best D pairing in hockey.

“This summer”

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Wolfman

What would be the cost to land Panarin? I guess it would depend on if you could re-sign him. How did the Jackets get him for so cheap?

More than we would ever want to pay. You are asking a playoff team to move their best forward who though might be headed to UFA will be a boon come playoffs. There is about zero chance we could re-sign him.The Jackets didn't get him cheap if Saad had turned out the way he was trending which was a young 30+ goal scoring power forward.