Dec 14 Practice Notes: Backlund and Smith will travel with team on road trip

[Captaincanada80]

At the airport and went through security with the team. Boys looking good!! I asked a group of them “you boys gonna win tomorrow?”

“Oh hell yes we are!”

Also got a pic with Cassie and Rick

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Maybe. But for both players these are second-unit minutes, and with the low number it is pretty difficult to determine which of these players ihas a greater share in the effectiveness/ineffectiveness of his unit's powerplay production.

But my point was not too suggest that Ryan has been a good fit on the powerplay. It was rather an attempt to balance some of the exaggerated opinions of some of the Flames players. Jankowski is not really a better option to play ahead of Ryan, and yet discussions tend to focus on Ryan's second-line promotion as some outrageous and obvious injustice. It's not.

Maybe? The powerplay is firing at almost a relative 50% increase to where it was at the end of last year.

Regardless, your stats show that there's as much support for Ryan being on there as there is for Jankowski. In other words, no support for declaratives either way. Your comment about things being misconstrued or badly exaggerated is... a bit exaggerated.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

Maybe? The powerplay is firing at almost a relative 50% increase to where it was at the end of last year.

Regardless, your stats show that there's as much support for Ryan being on there as there is for Jankowski. In other words, no support for declaratives either way. Your comment about things being misconstrued or badly exaggerated is... a bit exaggerated.

And that is exactly my point. I was responding to an assertion that Jankowski is an obviously much better option for the powerplay than Ryan. He is not.

[Karl]

Ryan should be 4th line + PK. That is all.

[Karl]

This is how I'd have the forward lines:

Gaudreau-Monahan-Lindholm
Tkachuk-Jankowski-Bennett
Mangiapane-Quine-Neal
Czarnik-Ryan-Hathaway

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

And that is exactly my point. I was responding to an assertion that Jankowski is an obviously much better option for the powerplay than Ryan. He is not.

Agreed, not OBVIOUSLY better choice. But I think there is a clear case to be made.

Jankowski and Ryan have the same 4+6 points, but Ryan has had more ice time per game, played more games and played way more on the PP, which accounts for 4 of his points. Jankowskis points are all 5v5 or SH.

To put it another way, Jankowski has put up a point about every 35 minutes of 5v5, while Ryan puts up a 5v5 point about every 78 minutes.

That's a pretty big statistical difference, on top of the eye test. Plus the 2nd PP unit has struggled all season, so changing things up seems pretty rational.

[Karl]

Originally Posted by wretched34

Why.... why does Bill Peters keep doing this.
Either give Jankowski a chance to produce offense with Tkachuk and Bennett, or utilize Lindholm as a center for a few games.
Ryan is not producing offense, or providing good defense from the 2C position.

I believe you could swap Tkachuk and Lindholm, and move Neal up to a top 6 spot, without hurting the bottom 6.
I think Tkachuk can produce as well with Johnny and Money as Lindholm has been, and Lindholm provides some much needed 2 way play from the 2C slot, maybe he even gets Neal, since Lindholm can be a playmaker, and Neal is a sniper.

Gaudreau-Monahan-Tkachuk
Bennett-Lindholm-Neal
Mangiapane-Jankowski-Czarnik
Lomberg-Ryan-Hathaway

or, just swap Ryan and Jankowski, I don't think Ryan is much better defensively than Jankowski, and Janko has far more offensive potential.

I agree with most of your point regarding Ryan but this part of your post that I bolded is not true at all.

[The Boy Wonder]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Maybe he is...but at age 30 i dont think its a hinderance at this point. Perhaps his injury recovery abilities are affected but i don't believe his skating is....or maybe i just hope that's the case?

At any rate I just can't believe Bennett is the answer for top 6 minutes... even if the fancy stats suggest he should be, because the eye test says exactly the opposite.

Neal needs to damn well figure it out, then everyone slots in where they should and would be most effective.

How has the eye test shown you that anyone other than Bennett has even a moderately better chance of scoring?

The other options generate fewer High danger chances (both to the eye test and the fancy stats) AND they are doing it against worse competition...

Therefore Bennett isn't scoring (although he had a nice goal last game and a few other good chances) but nobody else gives you a better chance and at least bennett is responsible defensively, can skate against the opponent's top line if needed and he does in fact generate chances.

Bennett and Backlund combined isn't great because neither one of them can seem to finish at all, both need a skills coach to improve their release and hand eye so they can hopefully score more. But no chance is Neal mixed with thachuk going to benefit anyone because the footspeed is not there to compete shift in shift out with most teams top two lines.

At this point, Bennett figuring out how to finish is best for this team.

If they would put neal in a spot to just rip one timers on the PP like he's done his entire career instead of standing in front of the net while derek ####ing ryan wastes opportunities where Neal should be then we would see his output start to pick up.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Captaincanada80

At the airport and went through security with the team. Boys looking good!! I asked a group of them “you boys gonna win tomorrow?”

“Oh hell yes we are!”

Also got a pic with Cassie and Rick

A bunch of posters just got triggered.

[Karl]

Originally Posted by Toonage

"why...why..." comes across that way sorry.

Why does it matter how close it is to being resolved? Because its a game away. Its not worth getting upset over at this point. You didn't like the fit, thats fine, but its almost done. Ryan may never see that spot again for all we know.

And its not like Ryan as 2C sewered the team.

He helps the team defensively but he often sewers his line's offensive chances. That's why even now I'd have Janko or even Quine play ahead of him at centre.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

A bunch of posters just got triggered.

Shame Bob Cole wasn't there too.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Karl

He helps the team defensively but he often sewers his line's offensive chances. That's why even now I'd have Janko or even Quine play ahead of him at centre.

Because Janko never sewers an offensive chance.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Shame Bob Cole wasn't there too.

He doesn't like those new-fangled non-propeller planes.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

1130am hockey tomorrow? Not sure if I like that or not.

[Phagoof]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Kristen Anderson @KdotAnderson
"Wakey-wakey," -- James Neal, just now to Mikael Backlund who was in the wrong position during a drill. Big development to have their top shut-down centre back on the ice ahead of a three-game road trip through the Central Division.

i would of responded "Wakey-wakey to you too, Mr. 6 points."

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Itse

Agreed, not OBVIOUSLY better choice. But I think there is a clear case to be made.

Jankowski and Ryan have the same 4+6 points, but Ryan has had more ice time per game, played more games and played way more on the PP, which accounts for 4 of his points. Jankowskis points are all 5v5 or SH.

To put it another way, Jankowski has put up a point about every 35 minutes of 5v5, while Ryan puts up a 5v5 point about every 78 minutes.

That's a pretty big statistical difference, on top of the eye test. Plus the 2nd PP unit has struggled all season, so changing things up seems pretty rational.

I can agree with most of this (although I think the significance of points/60 mins is exaggerated—it's pretty common for players with good production per 60 mins to see this number slide when allotted more ice time). And I am not beyond juggling players and experimenting in various situations. What I take issue with is the outrage expressed by some at Ryan's usage.

[420since1974]

This season, I haven't seen any Flames player score very many one-timers from the RH side on the PP.
That's Neal's wheelhouse, I don't understand why he has not been afforded more opportunities at that spot on either PP.
I've become a big fan of BP's player usage and line blending, but I wish that he would try this scenario for an extended number of games.
That said, it's hard to argue with the team's success so far this season.
I'm one of those who feel that Neal's experience will ultimately pay-off in the play-offs.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by phagoof

i would of responded "wakey-wakey to you too, mr. 6 points."

*sigh*

[Karl]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Because Janko never sewers an offensive chance.

No.

It's because Janko and Bennett are more offensively talented and better at creating their own offense than Ryan and they're also not that much worse defensively than Ryan either.

And Ryan does not have more points than they, he has the same amount of points that they have.

[868904]

Originally Posted by 420since1974

This season, I haven't seen any Flames player score very many one-timers from the RH side on the PP.
That's Neal's wheelhouse, I don't understand why he has not been afforded more opportunities at that spot on either PP.
I've become a big fan of BP's player usage and line blending, but I wish that he would try this scenario for an extended number of games.
That said, it's hard to argue with the team's success so far this season.
I'm one of those who feel that Neal's experience will ultimately pay-off in the play-offs.

Ward seems to prefer having a right hand shot on that side. Which is why Ryan is always there.

They seem to be ok putting the right shot Czarnik on the left side of the powerplay on unit 2 though.

I agree with you, there are two things that I would give a long look to on PP2:

1) Andersson in Ryan's spot;
2) Neal in Ryan's spot.

I've already commented on why Anderesson is better there.

As for Neal, i'd put him there and just tell him to shoot every single time he gets the puck. Just let it rip and put it on net. He's not that great a passer or puck handler, but he's got a good shot so he should be trying for at least 5 shots per game.

Just keep it simple, play to your strengths, SHOOT the puck. He really isn't good at anything else.